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Department of Subways - Proposals/Ideas

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1 minute ago, subwayfan1998 said:

you're right, but there were plans prior to Gateway Project on Extending (7) to Seacaucus

That's true; I think that was a dumb idea and stand by my assertion that you'd be carrying a lot of air if you did that, whereas a Jersey City-Newark via Hoboken connection would take a load off the 126 (which I think is one of the busiest NJT short-haul routes; that route runs buses every 1-2 minutes in peak direction and most of them are full) as well as off the PATH and the 1 bus (which runs something like every 15-20 to Jersey City and those buses are super full because the Newark stretch of the 1 does a lot of heavy lifting)

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2 hours ago, engineerboy6561 said:

That's true; I think that was a dumb idea and stand by my assertion that you'd be carrying a lot of air if you did that, whereas a Jersey City-Newark via Hoboken connection would take a load off the 126 (which I think is one of the busiest NJT short-haul routes; that route runs buses every 1-2 minutes in peak direction and most of them are full) as well as off the PATH and the 1 bus (which runs something like every 15-20 to Jersey City and those buses are super full because the Newark stretch of the 1 does a lot of heavy lifting)

Also Much better is (7) to extend at least to 14th Street and Little Neck - Marathon Parkway.

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2 minutes ago, subwayfan1998 said:

Also Much better is (7) to extend at least to 14th Street and Little Neck - Marathon Parkway.

I still think the sweet spot for the (7) is around Bell Blvd; that's enough to let you reconfigure the bus network around Bayside/Flushing/Auburndale and it wouldn't make sense to go all the way out to Little Neck unless you upzoned the f**k out of it (and frankly if you did that you'd need to add new subway relief for northern Queens because the (7) is bursting at the seams as it is.

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15 hours ago, subwayfan1998 said:

you're right, but there were plans prior to Gateway Project on Extending (7) to Seacaucus

No one ever said they were good plans

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(A) splits RPK/Far Rockaway

(C) Lefferts-168th via Fulton express, 8th express (stopping at 50th), and CPW local

(E) unchanged

(K) 179th-WTC via QBL/Hillside local, 53rd, and 8th local

(B) runs on weekends

(D) unchanged

(F) Springfield-CI (stops at Springfield, 212th, FLB, 188th and so on) via Hillside/QBL express, 63rd, 6th local and Culver express (Bergen would be reopened with an underpass)

(V) 179th-Church via QBL/Hillside local, 63rd, 6th local and Culver local

(G) extended to 18th center

(J) cut back to Chambers; uses middle tracks between Essex and Chambers

(brownM) Metropolitan-Bay Ridge

(Z) eliminated

(L) tail tracks added at 8th; center tracks at Atlantic rebuilt for short turns

(N) Fordham Plaza-CI via 3rd, 2nd and so on

(Q) 125th/St Nicholas- CI via 125th, 2nd and so on

(R) Astoria- Euclid via Broadway local, Montague, new connection between DeKalb and Lafayette and Fulton local

(W) eliminated

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Posted (edited)
18 hours ago, engineerboy6561 said:

Newark Airport would be hard to swing because the PATH is already getting extended there, and swinging across through Secaucus probably isn't the best idea. I used to commute out to Newark and Secaucus is in the middle of bumf**k nowhere; the spot where you'd really want to send the (7) if you were going to extend it to Jersey (which would be jurisdictionally really complex to do and not super likely) would be through Hamilton Park and down JFK Blvd, either straight down to Danforth or with a turn west over Kearny to serve the Ironbound before hitting Newark Penn; again, the jurisdictional issues would make that really hard to pull off. As far as the eastern end is concerned you probably don't need to go all the way out; the sweet spot is probably Bell Blvd because it would let you reconfigure the buses around Flushing and Bayside.

Agreed that Bell Blvd, possibly even Springfield, is the sweet spot for a (7) extension that would be a real game changer for public transit in Northeast Queens. Once you pass over the Cross Island Parkway on Northern, you can really see just how much the density in the development drops off. It’s very noticeable. As for the other end of the (7), I’ve always had my reasons for not extending it to Jersey without going further  east in Queens first. Putting logistics and politics aside, probably the best place to extend the (7) in Jersey would be through Hoboken, Union City and Jersey City, as those are some hugely dense areas of population, with a significant amount of transit riders. 

18 hours ago, subwayfan1998 said:

you're right, but there were plans prior to Gateway Project on Extending (7) to Seacaucus

Yes, Bloomberg wanted to do it. But his idea was to just extend the (7) to Secaucus through densely populated Hoboken and Union City without stopping in either place. This was just after newly-elected Gov. Christie pulled NJ out of the ARC Tunnel project. There was just so much wrong about that idea and so many people on both sides of the Hudson who would have good reason to be pissed over it (if it had a realistic chance of happening). 

I’m not completely against the idea of extending the (7) or (L) to Jersey. It’s really not any different than proposing extending HBLR or PATH to Staten Island (which have been proposed on more than one occasion). And we certainly could use another trans-Hudson rail connection on top of two new Amtrak/NJT tunnels to Penn (not like Donald cares!). 

Edited by T to Dyre Avenue

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4 minutes ago, T to Dyre Avenue said:

Agreed that Bell Blvd, possibly even Springfield, is the sweet spot for a (7) extension that would be a real game changer for public transit in Northeast Queens. Once you pass over the Cross Island Parkway on Northern, you can really see just how much the density in the development drops off. It’s very noticeable. As for the other end of the (7), I’ve always had my reasons for not extending it to Jersey without going further  east in Queens first. Putting logistics and politics aside, probably the best place to extend the (7) in Jersey would be through Hoboken, Union City and Jersey City, as those are some hugely dense areas of population, with a significant amount of transit riders. 

Yes, Bloomberg wanted to do it. But his idea was to just extend the (7) to Secaucus through densely populated Hoboken and Union City without stopping in either place. There was just so much wrong about that idea and so many people on both sides of the Hudson who would have good reason to be pissed over it (if it had a realistic chance of happening). 

I’m not completely against the idea of extending the (7) to Jersey. It’s not any different than proposing extending HBLR or PATH to Staten Island (which have been proposed on more than one occasion). And we certainly could use another trans-Hudson rail connection on top of two new Amtrak/NJT tunnels to Penn (not like Donald cares!). 

What if (7) extended to Little Neck - Marathon Parkway

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Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, subwayfan1998 said:

What if (7) extended to Little Neck - Marathon Parkway

I think Little Neck’s too far out. It’s well past the Cross Island Parkway, and the density has dropped off significantly long before you get to Marathon Parkway. So much so that it’s not very easy to tell where Queens ends and Nassau County starts. I feel that the residents living that far east (Little Neck/Douglaston) would be much less likely to switch from the railroad to the (7).

Edited by T to Dyre Avenue
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I agree that the (7) to Secaucus is a bad idea. Any NJTransit train that goes to Secaucus either goes to Hoboken or Penn Station. If you are going to Penn Station, you don't need the (7), and if you are going to Hoboken, you could transfer to the (7) there instead.

However, I think that sending the (7) to Hoboken would be very helpful (if they could get the NY/NJ Bureaucracy out of the way). Any new capacity across the Hudson River is needed. It would also take some load of the PATH, which would give it room for more expansion (maybe extending the yellow line to Newark and adding a line to the airport or Elizabeth)

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Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, T to Dyre Avenue said:

Agreed that Bell Blvd, possibly even Springfield, is the sweet spot for a (7) extension that would be a real game changer for public transit in Northeast Queens. Once you pass over the Cross Island Parkway on Northern, you can really see just how much the density in the development drops off. It’s very noticeable. As for the other end of the (7), I’ve always had my reasons for not extending it to Jersey without going further  east in Queens first. Putting logistics and politics aside, probably the best place to extend the (7) in Jersey would be through Hoboken, Union City and Jersey City, as those are some hugely dense areas of population, with a significant amount of transit riders. 

Yes, Bloomberg wanted to do it. But his idea was to just extend the (7) to Secaucus through densely populated Hoboken and Union City without stopping in either place. There was just so much wrong about that idea and so many people on both sides of the Hudson who would have good reason to be pissed over it (if it had a realistic chance of happening). 

I’m not completely against the idea of extending the (7) to Jersey. It’s not any different than proposing extending HBLR or PATH to Staten Island (which have been proposed on more than one occasion). And we certainly could use another trans-Hudson rail connection on top of two new Amtrak/NJT tunnels to Penn (not like Donald cares!). 

I'm pretty sure the idea was basically to use the (7) as a bootleg Gateway supplement/replacement or to share the Meadowlands crowds with NJT, but considering how packed the NJT 1, 126, and PATH are a relief line through JC and Hoboken is a much better use of that capacity. As a former commuter to/from the Newark Ironbound my dream would be a (7)<7> to Irvington via Springfield Av/Ferry St/JFK Blvd/Newark St/Washington St; you'd effectively take enormous loads off the NJT 1, 25, and 126  this way and provide a backup for the PATH (especially considering that PATH runs every 15 on the weekends).

10 minutes ago, subwayfan1998 said:

What if (7) extended to Little Neck - Marathon Parkway

One of three things would happen; either the neighbors would pitch an epic shitfit and it wouldn't happen, the trains would be running mostly empty to Bell Blvd and the build would have eaten money that could have gone to SAS, fixing the (J)(M)(Z) or other projects, or Douglaston and Little Neck would get heavily upzoned and we'd need to build northern Queens relief lines ASAP to manage the resultant crowding.

Edited by engineerboy6561

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(A) Inwood-207th Street to Reads Lane

(C) 168th St to Cambria Heights-234th St via 8th Ave Local, Fulton Street Local, Pitkin Ave and Linden Blvd

(E) WTC to Queens Village-Spingfield Blvd via QBL Express, Archer Ave and Jamaica Ave.

(K) WTC to Rockaway Park-Beach 116th St via 8th Ave, QBL, 53rd St, New Queensrail Rockaway Beach Branch from Rego Park to Ozone Park and Rockaway Line.

(B) Brighton Beach to Co-Op City via Concourse and E Gun Hill Rd.

(D) Coney Island-Stillwell Ave to Co-Op City via Concourse Local and E Gun Hill Rd.

(F) Coney Island-Stillwell Avenue to Floral Park-Little Neck Pkwy via QBL Express and Hillside Local to Little Neck Pkwy.

(M) Elmhurst-Roosevelt Ave to Floral Park-263rd St via Myrtle Local, Jamaica Local, Manhattan Bridge, Nassau, 6th Ave, 53rd St, QBL Local and Union Turnpike.

(G) Kings Hwy to Rockaway Park-Beach 116th St via QBL Local, New Queensrail Rockaway Beach Branch from Rego Park to Ozone Park and Rockaway Line.

(J) Bay Ridge to Queens Village-Springfield Blvd via 4th Ave, Montague, Nassau St Local, Williamsburg Bridge, Jamaica Local, Archer Ave and Jamaica Blvd.

(Z) Runs All Times from Chambers St to Rosedale-Hook Creek Blvd via Nassau St Local, Williamsburg Bridge, Jamaica Express, Archer Ave, Merrick Blvd and LIRR Atlantic Branch.

(L) Canarsie-Rockaway Parkway to 72nd St via 14th St Local and 10th Ave.

(T) 125th St-Broadway to Cambria Heights-234th St via 125th St Local, 2nd Ave, New Tunnel Between Hanover Sq and Court St, Fulton Street Local, Pitkin Ave and Linden Blvd.

Torquoise (V) Hanover Sq to Throgs Neck-E Tremont Ave via 2nd Ave Local, 149th St, Longwood Ave and Lafeyette Ave

(N) Coney Island-Stillwell Avenue to Little Neck-Little Neck Parkway via Broadway express, Astoria Local, 19th Ave Tunnel, East Elmhurst Ditmars Blvd, Booth Memorial Ave, 64th Ave and 61st St.

(Q) Coney Island-Stillwell Avenue to Co-Op City via Broadway express, 2nd Ave Local, Bronx 3rd Ave and E Gun Hill Rd.

(R) Bay Ridge to Floral Park-263rd St via  Broadway local, QBL Local and Union Turnpike.

(W) Chelsea-Travis Avenue (Staten Island) to College Point-20th Avenue via Victory Blvd Local, New Tunnel Connecting Sunset Park-59th Street and St. George, 4th Ave, Manhattan Bridge, Broadway Local, Astoria Local, 19th Ave Tunnel, East Elmhurst Ditmars Blvd, Northern Blvd and 150th St.

:MJ: Mariners Harbour to Tottenville-Craig Ave via Richmond Ave

(1) South Ferry to 261st-Van Cortlandt Park

(2) Wakefield-241st to Sheepshead Bay-Voorhies Ave via Extended Nostrand Ave Line from Flatbush Ave-Brooklun College to Gerritsen Ave-Marine Park, Gerritsen Ave and Knapp St

(3) Kingsbridge-238th St to East New York-Flatlands Ave

(9) Gowanus-4th Ave-9th St to 261st-Van Cortlandt Park via New Tunnel Between South Ferry via Governors Island and Atlantic Basin and 9th St Local.

(4) Woodlawn to Floyd Bennett Field via Utica Ave Local and Flatbush Ave.

(5) Eastchester-Dyre Ave to Sheepshead Bay-Voorhies Ave via Extended Nostrand Ave Line from Flatbush Ave-Brooklun College to Gerritsen Ave-Marine Park, Gerritsen Ave and Knapp St

(6) Unchanged

(7) Chelsea-14th St to Bell Blvd via 11th Ave, 42nd St Local, Steinway Tunnel, Flushing Roosevelt Ave and Cocheron/35th Ave.

:8: Chelsea-14th St to Little Neck Pkwy via 11th Ave, 42nd St Local, Steinway Tunnel, Flushing Roosevelt Ave and Northern Blvd.

 

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46 minutes ago, subwayfan1998 said:

(3) Kingsbridge-238th St to East New York-Flatlands Ave
 

(3) Kingsbridge-238th St to East New York-Flatlands Ave via Tunnel Between 148th St and 165th St, Bronx MLK Jr. Blvd, W Tremont Ave, Sedgwick Ave, W Kingsbridge Rd and Bailey Ave.

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1 hour ago, subwayfan1998 said:

(bunch of crap here)

There are so many thing wrong with this, but I will focus on a few main issues:

(A) - The line doesn't go past Mott for a reason and if it did the furthest it would go would probably be the LIRR station. 

(C) - LOL! Nobody in Cambria Heights wants a slow-ass C train; the only way a line to Cambria Heights would be useful was if Fulton was extended under Pitkin, Liberty, Van Wyck and Linden (even so, the furthest I would go would be Springfield or Farmers)

(K) - QBL doesn't need more branching

(G) - figure it out why this would suck

(R) - yeah, let's make it even worse

(3) - this line doesn't go to the Bronx for good reason

(J) - Congrats! You have created another (R) and further crowded the (E) !

(W) - any SI route should come from NJ (PATH) as Brooklyn won't save time over the express bus and Manhattan would be prohibitively expensive unless the MTA reined in costs

(F) - any extension of the F would probably require you to send it express via Hillside and Culver as it would be unbearably long for train crews otherwise

 

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2 minutes ago, R68OnBroadway said:

There are so many thing wrong with this, but I will focus on a few main issues:

(A) - The line doesn't go past Mott for a reason and if it did the furthest it would go would probably be the LIRR station. 

(C) - LOL! Nobody in Cambria Heights wants a slow-ass C train; the only way a line to Cambria Heights would be useful was if Fulton was extended under Pitkin, Liberty, Van Wyck and Linden (even so, the furthest I would go would be Springfield or Farmers)

(K) - QBL doesn't need more branching

(G) - figure it out why this would suck

(R) - yeah, let's make it even worse

(3) - this line doesn't go to the Bronx for good reason

(J) - Congrats! You have created another (R) and further crowded the (E) !

(W) - any SI route should come from NJ (PATH) as Brooklyn won't save time over the express bus and Manhattan would be prohibitively expensive unless the MTA reined in costs

(F) - any extension of the F would probably require you to send it express via Hillside and Culver as it would be unbearably long for train crews otherwise

 

How i would crowded the (E), (E) can go to Leffert Blvd.

(A) - I Understand

(C) - why you consider (C) Train Slow? Even i Mentioned Pitkin.

(K) - why wouldn't QBL need Branching

(G) - Why would it be Suck?

(R) - why worse?

(J) - why crowding the (E), (E) can go to Lefferts.

(W) - Staten Islanders want to a Subway that goes to Manhattan.

(F) - ok!

Have you heard of Queensrail, Former LIRR Branch that many want to extend the Subway Line.

https://www.rockawave.com/articles/queens-rail-and-way-task-force-begins-work/

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Just now, subwayfan1998 said:

How i would crowded the (E), (E) can go to Leffert Blvd.

(A) - I Understand

(C) - why you consider (C) Train Slow? Even i Mentioned Pitkin.

(K) - why wouldn't QBL need Branching

(G) - Why would it be Suck?

(R) - why worse?

(J) - why crowding the (E), (E) can go to Lefferts.

(W) - Staten Islanders want to a Subway that goes to Manhattan.

(F) - ok!

Have you heard of Queensrail, Former LIRR Branch that many want to extend the Subway Line.

https://www.rockawave.com/articles/queens-rail-and-way-task-force-begins-work/

@R68OnBroadway

http://www.vanshnookenraggen.com/_index/2016/12/queensway-vs-subway/

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1 minute ago, subwayfan1998 said:

How i would crowded the (E), (E) can go to Leffert Blvd.

 (A) - I Understand

(C) - why you consider (C) Train Slow? Even i Mentioned Pitkin.

Nobody from eastern Queens wants to take a local line into Manhattan.

(K) - why wouldn't QBL need Branching

QBL is crowded enough east of Forest Hills and needs the capacity there.

(G) - Why would it be Suck?

Putting the (G) on the Rockaway beach branch (which is already a waste) would steal Manhattan-bound capacity

(R) - why worse?

The (R) is already long enough and doing this would make it only worse.

(J) - why crowding the (E), (E) can go to Lefferts.

People already go for the (E) given how slow the (J) is; this will only make it worse.

(W) - Staten Islanders want to a Subway that goes to Manhattan.

They don't want one that makes a ton of stops in Brooklyn-at that point it would be better to take the express bus. You would also clog 4th Av with SI riders and make 4th unusable past 59th. 

(F) - ok!

Have you heard of Queensrail, Former LIRR Branch that many want to extend the Subway Line.

https://www.rockawave.com/articles/queens-rail-and-way-task-force-begins-work/

 

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My idea is for a Fifth Ave subway:

The 2 tracks over the Willamsburg Bridge and the other 2 from Nassau St Line form a 4 track line going up First Ave starting at Delancey. There will be a stop at 8th St/1st Ave to serve the Tompkins Sq area. Then the line turns west down 15th st and has a stop at Union Sq for Connections to the (4)(5)(6)(N)(Q)(R)(W)(L). The line then continues down 15th St until turning up 5th Ave with these stops:

23rd St (connect to M23 SBS (R))

34th St (Connect to M34 SBS)

42st (Connect to (7)(B)(D)(F))

50st (Connect to (E)(F)(6))

58st (Connect to (R))

Lex/63rd (Connect to (N)(Q))

The line then splits: The 2 tracks from Nassau go into the 63rd St Tunnel and down the existing QB Express. The 2 Tracks from the Willy B go up 2nd Ave to 125th St/Lex. 

Service pattern becomes as follows:

(J)(Z)  125th/Lex to Jamaica Center all times via 2nd Ave, 5th Ave, Williamsburg Bridge, Broadway-Brooklyn, Jamaica Line. 

(brownM) 179st-Hillside to Bay Ridge all times via QB Bypass, 63rd St, 5th Ave, Nassau St-Montague, 4th Ave Local. Half of all trains turn at Broad St Manhattan.  

(S) Myrtle Ave to Metropolitan Ave all times. Upper level restored at Myrtle for shuttle operation. 

Also two more things: 

(N)(Q) run under new tracks under 64th st with a new stop at 64th/2nd to connect to the (J)(brownM)(Z). Then the (N)(Q) run up express tracks under the SAS to 3rd Ave/138St in The Bronx where they run under 3rd Ave and Webster Ave to Gun Hill. The (F) runs under a new line along 52nd St with stops at 5th and Lex Avs then into Queens under 45th rd and Jackson Ave with stops at Court Sq and Queens Plaza. The (F) and (brownM) trains run into the new Queens Bypass under the LIRR with stops at Woodside ( (7)<7>), Grand Ave, 63rd Drive, 71st Ave, Union Turnpike and Hillside/Queens Blvd (Transfer to (E)) where it continues down Hillside Ave to 179th St. The existing QB line has the (E) running express to Jamaica Center and the (G) taking over local service from Forest Hills. 

 

 

 

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57 minutes ago, subwayfan1998 said:

(3) Kingsbridge-238th St to East New York-Flatlands Ave via Tunnel Between 148th St and 165th St, Bronx MLK Jr. Blvd, W Tremont Ave, Sedgwick Ave, W Kingsbridge Rd and Bailey Ave.

You realize that 148th is at ground level, you would have to tear down an apartment building, make a sharp 90 degree turn but somehow get deep enough to go under the Harlem River?

Do you want to do one of these but underground?

Intermodal_train_on_Tehachapi_Loop.jpg

Please think before you click submit reply!

  • LMAO! 2

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, R68OnBroadway said:

(C) Lefferts-168th via Fulton express, 8th express (stopping at 50th), and CPW local

Thank you for being the only person on these forum so far to back me up on this! As a person living in the rockaways, it is incredibly frustrating when an A shows up for the first time in 8 minutes and it is going to Ozone Park

Edited by ibroketheprinter
Spelling (again)
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1 minute ago, ibroketheprinter said:

Thank you for being the only person on these forum so far to back me up on this! As a person living tin the rockaways, it is incredibly frustrating when an A shows up for the first time in 8 minutes and it is going to Ozone Park

I used to live in the Rockaways as well and I support this message

  • Upvote 1

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2 hours ago, R68OnBroadway said:

 


Ok, (J) Will Run Non-Stop from Chambers St to Rosedale-Hook Creek Blvd via Nassau St Local, Williamsburg Bridge, Jamaica Express, Archer Ave, Merrick Blvd and LIRR Atlantic Branch.
 

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4 hours ago, subwayfan1998 said:

(A)Inwood-207th Street to Reads Lane

(C) 168th St to Cambria Heights-234th St via 8th Ave Local, Fulton Street Local, Pitkin Ave and Linden Blvd

(E) WTC to Queens Village-Spingfield Blvd via QBL Express, Archer Ave and Jamaica Ave.

(K) WTC to Rockaway Park-Beach 116th St via 8th Ave, QBL, 53rd St, New Queensrail Rockaway Beach Branch from Rego Park to Ozone Park and Rockaway Line.

(B) Brighton Beach to Co-Op City via Concourse and E Gun Hill Rd.

(D) Coney Island-Stillwell Ave to Co-Op City via Concourse Local and E Gun Hill Rd.

(F) Coney Island-Stillwell Avenue to Floral Park-Little Neck Pkwy via QBL Express and Hillside Local to Little Neck Pkwy.

(M) Elmhurst-Roosevelt Ave to Floral Park-263rd St via Myrtle Local, Jamaica Local, Manhattan Bridge, Nassau, 6th Ave, 53rd St, QBL Local and Union Turnpike.

(G) Kings Hwy to Rockaway Park-Beach 116th St via QBL Local, New Queensrail Rockaway Beach Branch from Rego Park to Ozone Park and Rockaway Line.

(J) Bay Ridge to Queens Village-Springfield Blvd via 4th Ave, Montague, Nassau St Local, Williamsburg Bridge, Jamaica Local, Archer Ave and Jamaica Blvd.

(Z) Runs All Times from Chambers St to Rosedale-Hook Creek Blvd via Nassau St Local, Williamsburg Bridge, Jamaica Express, Archer Ave, Merrick Blvd and LIRR Atlantic Branch.

(L) Canarsie-Rockaway Parkway to 72nd St via 14th St Local and 10th Ave.

(T) 125th St-Broadway to Cambria Heights-234th St via 125th St Local, 2nd Ave, New Tunnel Between Hanover Sq and Court St, Fulton Street Local, Pitkin Ave and Linden Blvd.

Torquoise (V) Hanover Sq to Throgs Neck-E Tremont Ave via 2nd Ave Local, 149th St, Longwood Ave and Lafeyette Ave

(N) Coney Island-Stillwell Avenue to Little Neck-Little Neck Parkway via Broadway express, Astoria Local, 19th Ave Tunnel, East Elmhurst Ditmars Blvd, Booth Memorial Ave, 64th Ave and 61st St.

(Q) Coney Island-Stillwell Avenue to Co-Op City via Broadway express, 2nd Ave Local, Bronx 3rd Ave and E Gun Hill Rd.

(R) Bay Ridge to Floral Park-263rd St via  Broadway local, QBL Local and Union Turnpike.

(W) Chelsea-Travis Avenue (Staten Island) to College Point-20th Avenue via Victory Blvd Local, New Tunnel Connecting Sunset Park-59th Street and St. George, 4th Ave, Manhattan Bridge, Broadway Local, Astoria Local, 19th Ave Tunnel, East Elmhurst Ditmars Blvd, Northern Blvd and 150th St.

:MJ: Mariners Harbour to Tottenville-Craig Ave via Richmond Ave

(1) South Ferry to 261st-Van Cortlandt Park

(2) Wakefield-241st to Sheepshead Bay-Voorhies Ave via Extended Nostrand Ave Line from Flatbush Ave-Brooklun College to Gerritsen Ave-Marine Park, Gerritsen Ave and Knapp St

(3) Kingsbridge-238th St to East New York-Flatlands Ave

(9) Gowanus-4th Ave-9th St to 261st-Van Cortlandt Park via New Tunnel Between South Ferry via Governors Island and Atlantic Basin and 9th St Local.

(4) Woodlawn to Floyd Bennett Field via Utica Ave Local and Flatbush Ave.

(5) Eastchester-Dyre Ave to Sheepshead Bay-Voorhies Ave via Extended Nostrand Ave Line from Flatbush Ave-Brooklun College to Gerritsen Ave-Marine Park, Gerritsen Ave and Knapp St

(6) Unchanged

(7) Chelsea-14th St to Bell Blvd via 11th Ave, 42nd St Local, Steinway Tunnel, Flushing Roosevelt Ave and Cocheron/35th Ave.

:8: Chelsea-14th St to Little Neck Pkwy via 11th Ave, 42nd St Local, Steinway Tunnel, Flushing Roosevelt Ave and Northern Blvd.

 

I hope you guys realize I was joking about the Reads Lane thing. That would actually be an immense waste of resources as there are plenty of other lines much more worthy of an extension.

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, subwayfan1998 said:

(A) Inwood-207th Street to Reads Lane

There's no way for this to work and there's nothing at Reads Lane to merit an extension. You'd need to make a Crescent St-type curve onto Mott Av and another one onto Cornaga Av, and there's no density out there to support the train anyway. Honestly, if the (A) was going to be extended any further along the Rockaways it would be along the Far Rockaway Branch ROW and would probably be to Gibson along the existing LIRR tracks.

(C) 168th St to Cambria Heights-234th St via 8th Ave Local, Fulton Street Local, Pitkin Ave and Linden Blvd

It makes no sense to send a local all the way out there without a corresponding express; nobody's gonna want to take it and it's going to empty out the moment there's a chance to transfer (probably onto the (E)). My comments about the time differential between the (E) and the (J) upthread would also apply here; there would be no reason to stay on the (C) and everyone would hop to the (E) to save time. You could redesignate half the (A) trains as (K) trains, and then send the (K) and the (C) together along Pitkin Av/Rockaway Bl (Linden's a poor choice because there's nothing on Linden), and even then realistically I'd only extend the new line as far as Springfield Blvd, see my discussion on breakeven points for extensions about why.

(E) WTC to Queens Village-Spingfield Blvd via QBL Express, Archer Ave and Jamaica Ave.

This is pretty reasonable.

(K) WTC to Rockaway Park-Beach 116th St via 8th Ave, QBL, 53rd St, New Queensrail Rockaway Beach Branch from Rego Park to Ozone Park and Rockaway Line.

Possible, but probably not the best use of the trackage. You'd be adding a merge at QBP that would jam up the (E) and (M) pretty well, and if you were going to use a line to serve the Rockaways that way I don't think it's a great idea to use the local for it. Also if you branch off QBP partway through you wind up reducing the TPH that can go out to 71 Av, which doesn't work so well if you expect the eastern end of that corridor to carry.

(B) Brighton Beach to Co-Op City via Concourse and E Gun Hill Rd.

(D) Coney Island-Stillwell Ave to Co-Op City via Concourse Local and E Gun Hill Rd.

The (B) and (D) plans are reasonable, although it might make more sense to turn the (B) at Bedford because of the yard.

(F) Coney Island-Stillwell Avenue to Floral Park-Little Neck Pkwy via QBL Express and Hillside Local to Little Neck Pkwy.

That's honestly a bit long; I'd probably go out to Springfield/Braddock in order to save money for other projects and avoid carrying air, and you'd want to run it express at least to 179 St to keep runtime down.

(M) Elmhurst-Roosevelt Ave to Floral Park-263rd St via Myrtle Local, Jamaica Local, Manhattan Bridge, Nassau, 6th Ave, 53rd St, QBL Local and Union Turnpike.

Looping the (M) is a pretty reasonable idea given that you'd wind up significantly improving a number of intra-Queens trips by making it unnecessary to go into Manhattan or deal with the (G) to get to SW Queens/Ridgewood; I'd probably send it under Eliot Av, make Woodhaven an express stop and then terminate it there. I'd probably also wrap the (M) at 179 St as the local so that runtimes don't get too long.

(G) Kings Hwy to Rockaway Park-Beach 116th St via QBL Local, New Queensrail Rockaway Beach Branch from Rego Park to Ozone Park and Rockaway Line.

This is a pretty bad plan. You've now capped all the QBL local services at 7.5TPH (assuming 30TPH/track pair ceiling under current plans), which means that QBL/Hillside local is gonna get only 15 local TPH (down from 30 today) and they'll flip out. Furthermore, you're making the (G) insanely long under this plan. Kings Highway to 4 Av is 25 minutes, 4 Av to Court Sq is another 25 minutes, the run from Queens Plaza to Woodhaven is another 20, and then from Woodhaven to Rockaway Beach is probably another 25-30, which would give you an end-to-end runtime on the (G) of about two hours give or take. Also, at that length anything that goes wrong on QBL, Culver or Rockaway will back up the (G), and anything wrong with the (G) is going to trash runtimes on the (A)(F)(K)(M), which carry a ton of people and are already pretty overstressed as it is.

(J) Bay Ridge to Queens Village-Springfield Blvd via 4th Ave, Montague, Nassau St Local, Williamsburg Bridge, Jamaica Local, Archer Ave and Jamaica Blvd.

This is going to be about as long as the (R) and is going to leave 4 Av riders in about the same shape as the (R) train currently does, and isn't really an improvement

(Z) Runs All Times from Chambers St to Rosedale-Hook Creek Blvd via Nassau St Local, Williamsburg Bridge, Jamaica Express, Archer Ave, Merrick Blvd and LIRR Atlantic Branch.

Trim this back to Springfield Blvd and it's fine

(L) Canarsie-Rockaway Parkway to 72nd St via 14th St Local and 10th Ave.

No real argument with this; it's not my personal preference but it's a reasonable thing to do

(T) 125th St-Broadway to Cambria Heights-234th St via 125th St Local, 2nd Ave, New Tunnel Between Hanover Sq and Court St, Fulton Street Local, Pitkin Ave and Linden Blvd.

Why cut it off at 125 St? The 3 Av/north Bronx corridor could use an express, and the (N)(Q) are already on the local tracks for 2 Av. Also, see my comments on the (A)(C)(K) section for why running something all the way out to Cambria Heights is a bad idea.

Torquoise (V) Hanover Sq to Throgs Neck-E Tremont Ave via 2nd Ave Local, 149th St, Longwood Ave and Lafeyette Ave

Interesting idea but I don't really think Lafayette is the best place to send it because of the lack of bus system connectivity. It would probably make more sense to send it along Bruckner to Bay Plaza rather than through Lafayette, and you could send this to Euclid via a new tunnel from Whitehall to Court St

(N) Coney Island-Stillwell Avenue to Little Neck-Little Neck Parkway via Broadway express, Astoria Local, 19th Ave Tunnel, East Elmhurst Ditmars Blvd, Booth Memorial Ave, 64th Ave and 61st St.

(Q) Coney Island-Stillwell Avenue to Co-Op City via Broadway express, 2nd Ave Local, Bronx 3rd Ave and E Gun Hill Rd.

These are both at least somewhat reasonable ideas, but I would really recommend trimming the (N) to Bell Blvd and following a routing more along the lines of Astoria Blvd/Northern Blvd to supplement (7)<7> service.

(R) Bay Ridge to Floral Park-263rd St via  Broadway local, QBL Local and Union Turnpike.

The (R) is already super long and unwieldy as it is; extending it out to Floral Park-263 St would add another 25-30 minutes and now it's two hours plus end-to-end, and the QBL proposal would also cap it out at 7.5tph peak.

(W) Chelsea-Travis Avenue (Staten Island) to College Point-20th Avenue via Victory Blvd Local, New Tunnel Connecting Sunset Park-59th Street and St. George, 4th Ave, Manhattan Bridge, Broadway Local, Astoria Local, 19th Ave Tunnel, East Elmhurst Ditmars Blvd, Northern Blvd and 150th St.

Again, you're now running three services on the 4 Av local tracks and I'm not really sure of the wisdom of doing that; that's also another merge that the (J) and the (R) now have to deal with. You might have the TPH for this because you've wrecked QBL local to the point where the (R) is capped at 7.5tph, and if you have the (R) running 7.5 and the (J) running 15 the (W) could take the remaining 7.5, but that then leaves Broadway local capped out at 15tph total because of the combination of decisions you made earlier.

:MJ: Mariners Harbour to Tottenville-Craig Ave via Richmond Ave

There's not gonna be the ridership to do that on heavy rail; I could maybe see a thing where the HBLR runs on Richmond to Eltingville TC, but south of there the density just wouldn't be there to support rapid transit at the moment; you could possibly extend HBLR over the median of the parkway between the Drumgoole Roads but I don't know if there would be the ridership to justify it.

(1) South Ferry to 261st-Van Cortlandt Park

Nope. There is not the density along Broadway to support subway service north of 242nd St, and the buses run really quickly and efficiently between 242nd St and the county line; it's basically the same situation as sending the (F) to Floral Park

(2) Wakefield-241st to Sheepshead Bay-Voorhies Ave via Extended Nostrand Ave Line from Flatbush Ave-Brooklun College to Gerritsen Ave-Marine Park, Gerritsen Ave and Knapp St

That's fine

(3) Kingsbridge-238th St to East New York-Flatlands Ave

I don't think it would make sense to go all the way to 238 St. What you'd wind up doing if you were going to extend the (3) north would probably be to relocate 148 St under the yard and at a 45 degree angle, then deal with a downsloping 90 degree S-curve to swing under the Hudson and pop up on Ogden by 167 St in order to run the (3)  up Ogden/MLK Blvd to Fordham Rd (where you'd probably want to wrap it up). You might also need to demolish 145 St to give yourself the horizontal room to drop below the yard before entering the new 148 St, and I have no idea how you'd manage to build that lower level while successfully underpinning the trainyard and the apartment building overtop it.

(9) Gowanus-4th Ave-9th St to 261st-Van Cortlandt Park via New Tunnel Between South Ferry via Governors Island and Atlantic Basin and 9th St Local.

The 261 St extension is a bad idea for reasons I outlined above; the Gowanus/4 Av connection maybe less so? Also if you're doing that are you turning the (1) at South Ferry because you think that Gowanus only really needs 15tph peak? I'm uncertain of the wisdom here; I'd probably personally prefer to use the (9)to serve as a Fordham/Pelham crosstown north of Dyckman St because that's also a currently untapped market.

(4) Woodlawn to Floyd Bennett Field via Utica Ave Local and Flatbush Ave.

I'm not sure why you want to use the IRT to do this; it would make more sense to turn the BMT Jamaica Line into a full four-track trunk  built to IND standards (600' trains, 660' platforms) and have the Utica Av service function as a branch of that trunk.

(5) Eastchester-Dyre Ave to Sheepshead Bay-Voorhies Ave via Extended Nostrand Ave Line from Flatbush Ave-Brooklun College to Gerritsen Ave-Marine Park, Gerritsen Ave and Knapp St

That's also fine.

(6) Unchanged

(7) Chelsea-14th St to Bell Blvd via 11th Ave, 42nd St Local, Steinway Tunnel, Flushing Roosevelt Ave and Cocheron/35th Ave.

Crocheron-35 Av doesn't really need 20TPH because it's pretty low density, and I'd really rather keep the Flushing line as a 40TPH trunk.

:8: Chelsea-14th St to Little Neck Pkwy via 11th Ave, 42nd St Local, Steinway Tunnel, Flushing Roosevelt Ave and Northern Blvd.

See above.

 

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Edited by engineerboy6561
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