MTA Bus Operations: Fleet & Depots

[RSMG106]

The upcoming battery electric order for the will go to New Flyer. The base order calls for 187 XE40s and 18 XE60s. The first option order would include 193 XE40s and 72 XE60s. The second option order would add up to 950 more buses. This brings up to 1,420 buses.

The pilot for the base order will be delivered in January 2025. The XE40 order will start in September of that year, and be completed by July 2027. The XE60 order will be delivered from September to October 2025.

https://new.mta.info/document/129196 (See pages 75-77).

[MysteriousBtrain]

14 minutes ago, RSMG106 said:

The upcoming battery electric order for the will go to New Flyer. The base order calls for 187 XE40s and 18 XE60s. The first option order would include 193 XE40s and 72 XE60s. The second option order would add up to 950 more buses. This brings up to 1,420 buses.

The pilot for the base order will be delivered in January 2025. The XE40 order will start in September of that year, and be completed by July 2027. The XE60 order will be delivered from September to October 2025.

https://new.mta.info/document/129196 (See pages 75-77).

Seems MTA will go straight NF as Proterra and Nova Bus are shifting operations to a point where they aren't able to "build buses anymore". Also to note BYD also provided proposals but doesn't seem like they are able to meet MTA qualifications.

[RSMG106]

3 minutes ago, MysteriousBtrain said:

Seems MTA will go straight NF as Proterra and Nova Bus are shifting operations to a point where they aren't able to "build buses anymore". Also to note BYD also provided proposals but doesn't seem like they are able to meet MTA qualifications.

Basically we will be getting all New Flyers for this, and the diesel artic order then.

Edited December 21, 2023 by RSMG106

[xD4nn]

Looks like it's a New Flyer Monopoly

[MysteriousBtrain]

This got me thinking, if Nova Bus isn't gonna be compatible with the Buy America Act, is the 5 LFSe+ still on their way to delivery? Iirc the 5 buses were to be delivered 4th quarter 2023/early 2024 but plans may have shifted after the fact of no more American operations.

[xD4nn]

44 minutes ago, MysteriousBtrain said:

This got me thinking, if Nova Bus isn't gonna be compatible with the Buy America Act, is the 5 LFSe+ still on their way to delivery? Iirc the 5 buses were to be delivered 4th quarter 2023/early 2024 but plans may have shifted after the fact of no more American operations.

From what nova said, they are closing their plant in 2025 which fits their deadline. However, I don't know if the contract is binding and if the MTA still wants the buses since it's not really useful at this point. 

[limitednyc]

On 12/19/2023 at 3:21 PM, NBTA said:

It’s a widespread issue. Some depots (like a certain depot in queens) just simply don’t care, while others can’t combat it due to traffic.

100 percent true. Also spoke to a up driver who told me only 1/3 of new highers make it through training and probation. 

[limitednyc]

It's back to to the future,  just like the 1990's when nyct was all RTS.

[Brillant93]

3 hours ago, RSMG106 said:

The upcoming battery electric order for the will go to New Flyer. The base order calls for 187 XE40s and 18 XE60s. The first option order would include 193 XE40s and 72 XE60s. The second option order would add up to 950 more buses. This brings up to 1,420 buses.

The pilot for the base order will be delivered in January 2025. The XE40 order will start in September of that year, and be completed by July 2027. The XE60 order will be delivered from September to October 2025.

https://new.mta.info/document/129196 (See pages 75-77).

I'm assuming the redesign for BK will be finalized by 2025 then since this order probably will work within that time frame. 

[Kingsbridgeviewer382]

5 hours ago, limitednyc said:

It's back to to the future,  just like the 1990's when nyct was all RTS.

I don't think there was ever a time where the MTA was all RTS in the 90s. The rebuilt Blitz units were around in the early 90s and the Orion V's came in starting in '93.

[limitednyc]

Do these orders tell us that we are at the end of the xn era.

[Cait Sith]

On 12/21/2023 at 5:47 PM, MysteriousBtrain said:

This got me thinking, if Nova Bus isn't gonna be compatible with the Buy America Act, is the 5 LFSe+ still on their way to delivery? Iirc the 5 buses were to be delivered 4th quarter 2023/early 2024 but plans may have shifted after the fact of no more American operations.

The buses are already built. They will be delivered.

[Bill from Maspeth]

On 12/17/2023 at 8:02 PM, The TransitMan said:

That Q58 needs artics. I agree with you...IF that's what you're implying.

FP can't handle artics in the maintenance area.  There is just no room.  The main depot is used for storage only.  Grand Ave. can't handle any more artics because they just barely have enough room for 60' maintenance bays for the B38 fleet.  

[Bill from Maspeth]

On 12/18/2023 at 9:06 AM, Ultimategamer12c said:

Yes that was what I was implying, and also to the fact that I would like to see the Q54 get some artics in exchange.  There's a large chunk of routes that Brooklyn Depots can benefit from if they were to run artics I've been keeping a close eye on most routes as of late and specifically those routes I've mentioned and they definitely need them. It's only a mater of time if they'll give the green light on it and make a change.

FP maintenance area does not have room for artics.  Storage only inside the depot.  Grand Ave. only has enough 60' lifts for the B38 fleet.

[Bill from Maspeth]

On 12/18/2023 at 9:11 AM, limitednyc said:

Only during peak school riding , all they have to do in run all scheduled  service on time .

On time?  LOL!  If the Met bridge goes up for marine traffic there is a delay on the Q54.  Metro Ave. is narrow 2 way street in Queens.  Traffic (cars and trucks) regularly double park making one lane for 2 way traffic.  Worse delays between Met/Cooper and Met/Hillside due to the traffic and double parking.   

[Bill from Maspeth]

On 12/21/2023 at 5:35 PM, xD4nn said:

Looks like it's a New Flyer Monopoly

Who else is available?  Nova is curtains in the US.

Edited December 26, 2023 by Bill from Maspeth

[RSMG106]

Apparently, the decided to cancel the 155 CNG order for New York City Transit. As for Bus, the 228 CNG order has been reduced to 110. The reason for this is because they wanted to fund the Bus XD40s and LFSes.

It is very disappointing to hear because they are confident in buying more electrics then to add one last CNG order into their fleet. Originally they were to get 383 CNGs. 155 for NYCT, and 228 for Bus Co. Now this is not the case, as Bus Co. will only have 110 CNGs to replace most C40LFs. Spring Creek will get the bulk of that order, while College Point will get some. If the gets awarded with more electrics, then College Point will get the bulk of it to replace their remaining C40LFs.

Edited December 26, 2023 by RSMG106

[MysteriousBtrain]

15 minutes ago, RSMG106 said:

Apparently, the decided to cancel the 155 CNG order for New York City Transit. As for Bus, the 228 CNG order has been reduced to 110. The reason for this is because they wanted to fund the Bus XD40s and LFSes.

It is very disappointing to hear because they are confident in buying more electrics then to add one last CNG order into their fleet. Originally they were to get 383 CNGs. 155 for NYCT, and 228 for Bus Co. Now this is not the case, as Bus Co. will only have 110 CNGs to replace most C40LFs. Spring Creek will get the bulk of that order, while College Point will get some. If the gets awarded with more electrics, then College Point will get the bulk of it to replace their remaining C40LFs.

That's info from the latest committee book or something?

 

I did remember hearing about a proposal for 200+ cngs for MTA, don't remember about NYCT; thought they were gonna be phased out by AEBs (specifically, the WF batch)

Edited December 26, 2023 by MysteriousBtrain

[NBTA]

1 hour ago, RSMG106 said:

Apparently, the decided to cancel the 155 CNG order for New York City Transit. As for Bus, the 228 CNG order has been reduced to 110. The reason for this is because they wanted to fund the Bus XD40s and LFSes.

It is very disappointing to hear because they are confident in buying more electrics then to add one last CNG order into their fleet. Originally they were to get 383 CNGs. 155 for NYCT, and 228 for Bus Co. Now this is not the case, as Bus Co. will only have 110 CNGs to replace most C40LFs. Spring Creek will get the bulk of that order, while College Point will get some. If the gets awarded with more electrics, then College Point will get the bulk of it to replace their remaining C40LFs.

I still think that getting alternate fuel buses will be more useful in the long run. Having a fleet full of electrics will backfire (in my opinion).

[Cait Sith]

1 hour ago, RSMG106 said:

Apparently, the decided to cancel the 155 CNG order for New York City Transit. As for Bus, the 228 CNG order has been reduced to 110. The reason for this is because they wanted to fund the Bus XD40s and LFSes.

It is very disappointing to hear because they are confident in buying more electrics then to add one last CNG order into their fleet. Originally they were to get 383 CNGs. 155 for NYCT, and 228 for Bus Co. Now this is not the case, as Bus Co. will only have 110 CNGs to replace most C40LFs. Spring Creek will get the bulk of that order, while College Point will get some. If the gets awarded with more electrics, then College Point will get the bulk of it to replace their remaining C40LFs.

You need to stop listening to whoever keeps giving you bad information.

The funds for the MTA Bus order were secured years ago through MTA Bus's capital plan.

[RSMG106]

6 minutes ago, Cait Sith said:

You need to stop listening to whoever keeps giving you bad information.

The funds for the MTA Bus order were secured years ago through MTA Bus's capital plan.

I don't know whether or not it is updated or not.

[Cait Sith]

1 minute ago, RSMG106 said:

I don't know whether or not it is updated or not.

Where, or what is your source anyway?

[RSMG106]

4 minutes ago, Cait Sith said:

Where, or what is your source anyway?

I checked the latest update from the board book. There was nothing there. *sigh*. It really gets me that people give me information that would change, but doesn't on the long run.

[MysteriousBtrain]

I never read up on anything about NYCT getting another CNG order after the XN60s. Only AEB, Diesel, and/or Diesel Hybrid. 

I have 110 CNGs for MTA in my latest update, but the last time I did an update was months ago, around the MTA LFS and Xcelsior options were exercised. These buses were not included in the 2020-24 or 2025-29 plans iirc, just proposals.

Edited December 26, 2023 by MysteriousBtrain

[Cait Sith]

2 minutes ago, MysteriousBtrain said:

I never read up on anything about NYCT getting another CNG order after the XN60s. Only AEB, Diesel, and/or Diesel Hybrid. 

I have 110 CNGs for MTA in my latest update, but the last time I did an update was months ago, around the MTA LFS and Xcelsior options were exercised. These buses were not included in the 2020-24 or 2025-29 plans iirc, just proposals.

They have more CNG orders on the pipeline that's not published in public materials.