Bronx Division Bus Proposals/Ideas

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Off topic, but the dramatic hills that you see in the Palisades, the Bronx and Upper Manhattan are largely due to glaciers from the last ice age proceeding down towards the south and scraping away at the landscape (and depositing boulders from further north in the area, hence why the parks often have such large boulders.) In fact, those glacial sheets reached about as far as roughly the middle of Long Island, which is why Long Island has a pretty noticeable ridgeline running across the middle.

Well it sure as hell cuts up a lot of areas, that's for sure.  Makes buses a necessity.

[IAlam]

 Out of everything, the express buses see the most use on weekends, since most are going shopping, to Lincoln Center for plays, restaurants and the like in the city.  It's just easier and much nicer to take the express bus.  You even have entire families that take the BxM2 to the museums or Central Park.  Mother and father board with the little ones and the stroller.  There are also folks that come up to visit and they're advised to take the express bus apparently, given the groups that get on. That goes for the elderly too that travel in packs.

On top of that taking the MNRR to Riverdale is horrible. I made the mistake of doing that once, that hill you have to go up is insane. Without the Rail Link, there is no reason to take the MNRR unless they're really in a hurry, or they want to get a good workout. The buses on the other hand, since they already go up the hill it makes everything much easier. 

[WestFarms36]

I would suggest making the Bx36 LIMITED exclusively articulated, that route is SARDINE HELL in there. There is more than enough artics to cover the LIMITED, hopefully by the time the XN60s come in we get a permanent solution but from now to March 2018 that's what needs to happen to just balance out the route, it's too crowded but at least it's on time on a average basis.

 

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[Fresh Pond]

I would suggest making the Bx36 LIMITED exclusively articulated, that route is SARDINE HELL in there. There is more than enough artics to cover the LIMITED, hopefully by the time the XN60s come in we get a permanent solution but from now to March 2018 that's what needs to happen to just balance out the route, it's too crowded but at least it's on time on a average basis.

 

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It's not feasible given the way many of the runs are set up. You could do a trip one way as a limited, and your next trip out could be a local, and vice versa.

[WestFarms36]

It's not feasible given the way many of the runs are set up. You could do a trip one way as a limited, and your next trip out could be a local, and vice versa.

Well RIP Bx36 1947 - 2017

 

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[Via Garibaldi 8]

It's not feasible given the way many of the runs are set up. You could do a trip one way as a limited, and your next trip out could be a local, and vice versa.

Well if they're getting more artics to address overcrowding then you make the changes necessary for it to work. Yet another reason bus service is in the toilet... No one wants to ride packed buses like that and those 40 footers have such little standing room. I've tutored near the end of the Bx36 line and those buses appear to fill up fast. I would check out the crowds while walking up to the BxM8 along Bruckner and between the bunching and the crowds, the Bx36 would benefit from going all artic most of the time. Edited July 8, 2017 by Via Garibaldi 8

[Via Garibaldi 8]

On top of that taking the MNRR to Riverdale is horrible. I made the mistake of doing that once, that hill you have to go up is insane. Without the Rail Link, there is no reason to take the MNRR unless they're really in a hurry, or they want to get a good workout. The buses on the other hand, since they already go up the hill it makes everything much easier.

 

Well it took me years to figure out a reasonable way to take MNRR back to Riverdale and walk home. I'm a 15-25 minute walk from the Spuyten Duyvil station depending on how fast I walk and what shortcuts I take, but out of the two, you can do the Spuyten Duyvil station if you take the shortcuts, otherwise it can be just as brutal as the Riverdale station. I have walked to and from both and they both have their pluses and minuses, but yes the Riverdale station uphill is brutal but a good workout. I walked from the Spuyten Duyvil station a few weeks ago and people were sighing in frustration because of the stairs to get to Palisade Avenue. I figured out a little trick though, because the stairs you can get used to buy if you take the stairs and then have to go up that hill on Independence Avenue. Forget it. I walk along Palisade and go up to the other part of Independence and stay on that and then come over that way. It's the best way I've found out of all of the ways I've gone that is doable if you are used to the hills and stairs and allows you to skip any local bus or Hudson Raillink.

[WestFarms36]

Well if they're getting more artics to address overcrowding then you make the changes necessary for it to work. Yet another reason bus service is in the toilet... No one wants to ride packed buses like that and those 40 footers have such little standing room. I've tutored near the end of the Bx36 line and those buses appear to fill up fast. I would check out the crowds while walking up to the BxM8 along Bruckner and between the bunching and the crowds, the Bx36 would benefit from going all artic most of the time.

Well if the problem is the setup of the run, then the runs on the Bx36 should be restructured to accomodate use of artics for the LIMITED, Garibaldi makes sense on this it is inexcusable that runs can't be restructured to accomodate them. If the Bx12 Local & SBS are treated as separate routes for Bus fleet accomodations then the Bx36 LOCAL and LIMITED should be treated as separate routes to make it work.

 

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[Fresh Pond]

 

 

Well if the problem is the setup of the run, then the runs on the Bx36 should be restructured to accomodate use of artics for the LIMITED, Garibaldi makes sense on this it is inexcusable that runs can't be restructured to accomodate them. If the Bx12 Local & SBS are treated as separate routes for Bus fleet accomodations then the Bx36 LOCAL and LIMITED should be treated as separate routes to make it work.

 

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Local routes and their respective SBS counterparts are considered separate routes for a reason. Your whole day is either on one or the other. Besides, the entire line is 100% artics

 

I've already explained to you the other day about local and limited routes

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Local routes and their respective SBS counterparts are considered separate routes for a reason. Your whole day is either on one or the other. Besides, the entire line is 100% artics

 

I've already explained to you the other day about local and limited routes

So what's the process when a route that runs 40 footers becomes all artics? You make it sound like it's so complicated. It shouldn't be, especially if it compromises the quality of service.

[WestFarms36]

So what's the process when a route that runs 40 footers becomes all artics? You make it sound like it's so complicated. It shouldn't be, especially if it compromises the quality of service.

Exactly my point, if it's because of the runs then they should work on restructuring these runs so that way the process of adding artics is not a nightmare and can improve and facilitate service quality.

 

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[WestFarms36]

The Bx36 needs an intermediate solution because the 2017 - 2018 School year is right around the corner and those buses get packed during the school year and March 2018 is 8 months away which is too long and honestly those buses look like sardine cans, 2 Months ago on my way home I was standing and holding myself next to a farebox because the bus was completely packed and this has been a known issue for YEARS, and there is no way something as simple as rotating the fleet to accomodate a route seems complicated as hell, if the Bx36 operates on a run based system (Local - Limited and vice versa) then restructure the runs to make accommodations and tweaks to the route, and your statement was like saying a D60HF on the Bx12 Local goes +SBS+ back. Bx12 Local and SBS are basically the same routes but their fleet is not interfering with both services on the route, same should be for the Bx36 LIMITED and Local, LIMITED with artics and Local with 40 Footers that simple it ain't rocket science, it just requires adjustments and reconfigurations of the route setup.

 

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[MysteriousBtrain]

The Bx36 needs an intermediate solution because the 2017 - 2018 School year is right around the corner and those buses get packed during the school year and March 2018 is 8 months away which is too long and honestly those buses look like sardine cans, 2 Months ago on my way home I was standing and holding myself next to a farebox because the bus was completely packed and this has been a known issue for YEARS, and there is no way something as simple as rotating the fleet to accomodate a route seems complicated as hell, if the Bx36 operates on a run based system (Local - Limited and vice versa) then restructure the runs to make accommodations and tweaks to the route, and your statement was like saying a D60HF on the Bx12 Local goes +SBS+ back. Bx12 Local and SBS are basically the same routes but their fleet is not interfering with both services on the route, same should be for the Bx36 LIMITED and Local, LIMITED with artics and Local with 40 Footers that simple it ain't rocket science, it just requires adjustments and reconfigurations of the route setup.

 

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Smh. That's like saying the Q20A/B, Bx4/4A, etc should have their own fleet. Also not mentioning some drivers have no choice but to operate on a "different" route because there was a simply not enough time to pull out another bus from the depot to get that run (Q110 with XD60s when they first came). Plus the LTD is rush hours so you want the dispatchers to run them exclusively on a rush hour route when there may not even be enough time for the bus to sit around. Therefore the bus would just be sexy and wait for stops to get even more crowded before taking off.

 

Doesn't take rocket science to figure this $#!+ out.

[WestFarms36]

Smh. That's like saying the Q20A/B, Bx4/4A, etc should have their own fleet. Also not mentioning some drivers have no choice but to operate on a "different" route because there was a simply not enough time to pull out another bus from the depot to get that run (Q110 with XD60s when they first came). Plus the LTD is rush hours so you want the dispatchers to run them exclusively on a rush hour route when there may not even be enough time for the bus to sit around. Therefore the bus would just be sexy and wait for stops to get even more crowded before taking off.

 

Doesn't take rocket science to figure this $#!+ out.

No one is saying it should have it's own fleet and show off the route, obviously bus drivers get different routes, and you are not getting the point, the Bx36 LIMITED is crowded and needs articulated buses to mitigate overcrowding like now.

 

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[Via Garibaldi 8]

No one is saying it should have it's own fleet and show off the route, obviously bus drivers get different routes, and you are not getting the point, the Bx36 LIMITED is crowded and needs articulated buses to mitigate overcrowding like now.

 

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I don't understand why these two are making such a big stink about it as if routes don't switch from 40 footers to artics because of overcrowding. That's why they're ordering more artics anyway...

[MysteriousBtrain]

I don't understand why these two are making such a big stink about it as if routes don't switch from 40 footers to artics because of overcrowding. That's why they're ordering more artics anyway...

If that's what this is about why complain? We all already know the Bx36 is getting converted into a route almost as soon as the XN60s arrive. I'm saying right now it's not possible. With the new artics coming, obviously the Bx36 will get converted, just in a year or two.

[Gotham Bus Co.]

I don't understand why these two are making such a big stink about it as if routes don't switch from 40 footers to artics because of overcrowding. That's why they're ordering more artics anyway...

 

Are the new artics coming in to accommodate ridership growth, or are they merely replacing older artics?

[Via Garibaldi 8]

If that's what this is about why complain? We all already know the Bx36 is getting converted into a route almost as soon as the XN60s arrive. I'm saying right now it's not possible. With the new artics coming, obviously the Bx36 will get converted, just in a year or two.

I actually agree with him.  It's not as if they're aren't artics available.  Why can't they allocate some to the line as needed now to alleviate the overcrowding?  The line serves a rather dense area of Castle Hill/Soundview.  It's no secret that there are lots of housing projects there and other low income places where people have no alternative to that bus and they need to get to the train.  Aside from that, from what I've seen while walking to and from the BxM8 express bus from my tutoring sessions, those buses bunch a lot and come late, adding to the overcrowding.  I tutored in the area where it was mainly homeowners, and those people don't really use the buses like that since they're kind of middle class.  They'll drive instead. It's the low income folks that need it the most.  Mind you, I haven't tutored in that area for over a year, and I can only imagine that the situation has worsened since then, as more people move over there to find affordable housing.  

 

 

Are the new artics coming in to accommodate ridership growth, or are they merely replacing older artics?

It's supposed to be for both reasons.  The  is converting all of the fleet to become low floor and more environmentally friendly, which quite frankly is a must.  It will lower costs, allow for faster boarding, and hopefully speed up service and make things run a little faster.

Edited July 9, 2017 by Via Garibaldi 8

[Fresh Pond]

I don't understand why these two are making such a big stink about it as if routes don't switch from 40 footers to artics because of overcrowding. That's why they're ordering more artics anyway...

He wants only the Limited trips to use artics, and that just isn't feasible without completely changing the way every single run is set up.

 

I'll use an example...

 

Operator X starts his day and his first trip to Hunts Point is on the local. Going by his logic, he naturally should get a shorty (we'll say 7746). He finishes his first trip, and his next trip going to Washington Heights is also a local. Finishes that trip also with no problem.

 

Now his next trip to Hunts Point is a limited trip. Once again, going by his logic, he's supposed to have an artic. Operator X has 7746 and has a limited trip to do to Hunts Point. Now what is he to do?

 

That's the whole point I'm trying to make...

[Via Garibaldi 8]

He wants only the Limited trips to use artics, and that just isn't feasible without completely changing the way every single run is set up.

 

I'll use an example...

 

Operator X starts his day and his first trip to Hunts Point is on the local. Going by his logic, he naturally should get a shorty (we'll say 7746). He finishes his first trip, and his next trip going to Washington Heights is also a local. Finishes that trip also with no problem.

 

Now his next trip to Hunts Point is a limited trip. Once again, going by his logic, he's supposed to have an artic. Operator X has 7746 and has a limited trip to do to Hunts Point. Now what is he to do?

 

That's the whole point I'm trying to make...

Now I get it. I agree... That's stupid.  Unless the buses are packed to the rafters, you have to use what's available.  It would be best to identify which trips are overcrowded, and put artics on them accordingly.  What I think needs to definitely be addressed though is how many buses are running late.  They need to address the bunching problem, which is likely a main reason why some trips are so packed.

[IAlam]

Well it took me years to figure out a reasonable way to take MNRR back to Riverdale and walk home. I'm a 15-25 minute walk from the Spuyten Duyvil station depending on how fast I walk and what shortcuts I take, but out of the two, you can do the Spuyten Duyvil station if you take the shortcuts, otherwise it can be just as brutal as the Riverdale station. I have walked to and from both and they both have their pluses and minuses, but yes the Riverdale station uphill is brutal but a good workout. I walked from the Spuyten Duyvil station a few weeks ago and people were sighing in frustration because of the stairs to get to Palisade Avenue. I figured out a little trick though, because the stairs you can get used to buy if you take the stairs and then have to go up that hill on Independence Avenue. Forget it. I walk along Palisade and go up to the other part of Independence and stay on that and then come over that way. It's the best way I've found out of all of the ways I've gone that is doable if you are used to the hills and stairs and allows you to skip any local bus or Hudson Raillink.

I'm cool with stairs my gripe is with steep hills.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I'm cool with stairs my gripe is with steep hills.

Then your only option is the Spuyten Duyvil station.  There really aren't any shortcuts you can take at the Riverdale station to avoid that steep long hill on 254th to get to Riverdale Avenue.  I generally like using that station at times when it isn't hot, so that I can go for a stroll if I want to get back to my apartment.  During the warmer months, it's just too hot doing that trek, but I don't mind doing it from the Spuyten Duyvil station. With some shortcuts it's tolerable to walk and the houses are beautiful so that takes my mind away from walking as well.

[IAlam]

Then your only option is the Spuyten Duyvil station.  There really aren't any shortcuts you can take at the Riverdale station to avoid that steep long hill on 254th to get to Riverdale Avenue.  I generally like using that station at times when it isn't hot, so that I can go for a stroll if I want to get back to my apartment.  During the warmer months, it's just too hot doing that trek, but I don't mind doing it from the Spuyten Duyvil station. With some shortcuts it's tolerable to walk and the houses are beautiful so that takes my mind away from walking as well.

At this point I just take the express bus in and the MNRR out 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

At this point I just take the express bus in and the MNRR out 

That's doable once you walk up the small hill from Riverdale Avenue, as long as it isn't icy.  In the wintertime, even going down hill there can be a bitch since it's so steep and slippery.  Where are you going anyway? I also go for walks from my apartment to Wave Hill to relax, which isn't too far from the Riverdale station. Once I reach the Parkway, I just cut over by 249th and walk over along Palisade Avenue from there.  Riverdale has no street grid, so you have to pick and choose what streets to take or you can be walking for quite a while unnecessarily.  

Edited July 9, 2017 by Via Garibaldi 8

[IAlam]

That's doable once you walk up the small hill from Riverdale Avenue, as long as it isn't icy.  In the wintertime, even going down hill there can be a bitch since it's so steep and slippery.  Where are you going anyway? I also go for walks from my apartment to Wave Hill to relax, which isn't too far from the Riverdale station. Once I reach the Parkway, I just cut over by 249th and walk over along Palisade Avenue from there.  Riverdale has no street grid, so you have to pick and choose what streets to take or you can be walking for quite a while unnecessarily.  

 

Well now I don't go there anymore, but when I did it was school related.