Bronx Division Bus Proposals/Ideas

[paulrivera]

Nowhere within city borders because Connecticut has a special agreement with the . They pay the for such a setup.

This arrangement was grandfathered in from an agreement between the Harlem Line's predecessor (New York Central) and the New Haven Line's predecessor (NY, NH, & Hartford RR), which means (presumably) that this policy won't apply for the East Bronx stations.

 

Now lets get this back to buses...

 

Darryl Irick should resign from his post at the Department of Buses and should be banned from every bus depot in the system for the inadequate bus service being provided under his leadership. Also, I hope we find new leadership soon because this bloke is in charge of NYCT (yea, the subways too) while Hakim is interim director.

[Q43 Floral Park]

 

1. i don't deny that historically the area has lacked transit options, but part of that is because those folks are too busy keeping up appearances. As for the BxM10, I would expect to see more people using it than what I did,  but I will say a lot of the folks while nice that I interacted with came off as pretentious. They really painted themselves in a way that I found funny. I remember one lady who I waited with at 86th and 3rd. Somehow we started discussing our world travels and she made a point to note how she came to city and stayed at high-end hotels. In short the people up there seem to have other priorities. There aren't enough of them that use the BxM10 to advocate for an extension, and the masses are just trying to get from point A to point B.  What is that area anyway? Baychester? Have asked residents there a few times and have received different answers. 

 

Regarding the Bx9, where exactly would you turn it around then? Those folks only  have that bus to get to the subway.

 

As for the BxM3, fat chance of me being an influence in that regard. That line is what it is.  It would need more service and more SX trips to be attractive, neither of which are happening. 

 

As for Morris Park, who is going to Bay Plaza like that? If anything those folks go to Westchester for shopping. 

 

 

Acknowledging MTA failed to supply adequate service historically while implying its in any way due to population preferring to show off via cars isn't a very rational thought process but I don't want to keep going in circles. The BxM10 terminal is in Baychester but an extension to Edenwald or Eastchester would be beneficial because I doubt many people are willing to take a bus to the BxM7/10/11. In regards to MP, people who don't have cars aren't going to Westchester. They may go to Manhattan but with the out a lot, Bay Plaza is the nearest shopping area to Morris Park and those blocks are long.

 

We've discussed this on the thread before but every Bx9 going to 262 puts too much service up there and on the weekends the traffic between 230-238 snarls service along the whole thing. They need to short-turn buses back to WF at Bway-225.

 

All you have to do is tell someone the BxM3 (or any route) is there and where it goes... In my experience thats often enough to encourage ridership. 

 

 

Hell, I  don't agree with having the current Bx31 run up to Katonah/242nd, so having it & an extended Bx34 serve the   I most certainly can't concur with.....

 

MTA treated the Bx16 (and this is where I drive the point home) as if the bulk of the ridership existed b/w the   & the  , when the bulk of the ridership existed between Dyre   & the  !!!

 

Now that I mention it, usage actually isn't all that great on the Bx16 from the   in particular (same deal w/ the Bx10 btw, but that's neither here nor there.... It starts to pick up due north, at Gun Hill (again, same as the Bx10 - except that stop is on Gun Hill after the turn off Bainbridge, while the Bx16 stop is on Bainbridge, short of Gun Hill)....

 

The only real *thing* I still have with the Bx16 is that it uses Webster --> 233rd.... To me, it's a waste of time....

I mentioned this in another Bx16 discussion, but I would have buses from the east, continue on Nereid (which turns into McLean) to VCP East (no stops along VCP east), to regular route.... That would speed things up a bit for the current patrons of the route out there, instead of morphing it into a 233rd route & risk losing ridership overall in the NE Bronx - Which is a serious concern I'd have with extending the Bx34 & straightening the Bx16 to duplicate the Bx31 up there.....

 

 

The old Bx31 terminal never seemed efficient but I never used it. I've always wondered if it's faster to take the (4)/Bx16 than the (5)/Bx16. Re: the Bx16 riders who want the West side can get the first, and Bx10 riders use BPB. The Bx28/34/38 stop always seems more crowded at 206. Every time I've used the Bx16, someone has boarded on Webster but those lights on 233 are horrid and it ends up on top of a Bx34.

 

 

There's also the Q114, which stops in Five Towns in Nassau en route to Far Rockaway. It would be pointless to have all buses run the Q113 route just to avoid having them stop in Nassau.

 

 

Again, this was a service outside of city lines when MTA inherited it. Cutting service along the Q111/113 Local, BxM3, QM6, would have been more trouble than it was worth. They haven't added a new route across a city line since the S89. With Mount Vernon, in all seriousness what's up there that Bronx riders will want to access?

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Acknowledging MTA failed to supply adequate service historically while implying its in any way due to population preferring to show off via cars isn't a very rational thought process but I don't want to keep going in circles. The BxM10 terminal is in Baychester but an extension to Edenwald or Eastchester would be beneficial because I doubt many people are willing to take a bus to the BxM7/10/11. In regards to MP, people who don't have cars aren't going to Westchester. They may go to Manhattan but with the out a lot, Bay Plaza is the nearest shopping area to Morris Park and those blocks are long.

 

We've discussed this on the thread before but every Bx9 going to 262 puts too much service up there and on the weekends the traffic between 230-238 snarls service along the whole thing. They need to short-turn buses back to WF at Bway-225.

 

All you have to do is tell someone the BxM3 (or any route) is there and where it goes... In my experience thats often enough to encourage ridership.

1. It's both because they don't make any noise up there. Even that thesis that I read touched upon it. When you don't know who your elected officials are (some residents admitted) this, it makes it rather difficult to get any improvements.

 

2. That isn't going to happen. Even along Broadway, the consensus is that buses are needed to get folks to the subway. It may seem like a glut of service, but look at how frequent the train is and compare it to the Bx9. The buses in Riverdale have been elongating commutes, and thus the more frequent the service the better.

 

3. Even so, let's be honest here. Most Bronx neighborhoods are still rather separated in that people generally don't venture outside of their neighborhood. I know people that live in Morris Park, and they sure as hell don't go venturing to Bay Plaza. That's like someone in Riverdale venturing into Throggs Neck to shop. It all comes down to demographics.

 

4. I suppose so, but quite frankly usage should be better along Broadway. The BxM3 shouldn't have to rely upon Riverdale residents that live up in the hills, especially given how many sizable buildings (co-ops and the like) there are on Broadway.

This arrangement was grandfathered in from an agreement between the Harlem Line's predecessor (New York Central) and the New Haven Line's predecessor (NY, NH, & Hartford RR), which means (presumably) that this policy won't apply for the East Bronx stations.

 

Now lets get this back to buses...

 

Darryl Irick should resign from his post at the Department of Buses and should be banned from every bus depot in the system for the inadequate bus service being provided under his leadership. Also, I hope we find new leadership soon because this bloke is in charge of NYCT (yea, the subways too) while Hakim is interim director.

What exactly does he (Darryl Irick) do anyway? Why is he so highly praised? Edited March 13, 2017 by Via Garibaldi 8

[B35 via Church]

What exactly does he (Darryl Irick) do anyway? Why is he so highly praised?

He tends to gets the praise that he does, due to the fact that he started out as a b/o.... I'll leave it at that.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

He tends to gets the praise that he does, due to the fact that he started out as a b/o.... I'll leave it at that.

lol... Makes perfect sense...

[paulrivera]

He tends to gets the praise that he does, due to the fact that he started out as a b/o.... I'll leave it at that.

He started out at Kingsbridge of all places...

 

His bio on the MTA website: "Irick views the delivery of services as a business model"

 

The bean counters downtown must love him...

[Via Garibaldi 8]

He started out at Kingsbridge of all places...

 

His bio on the MTA website: "Irick views the delivery of services as a business model"

 

The bean counters downtown must love him...

What exactly does he do though to help bus service improve? That's what I don't understand.

[Around the Horn]

What exactly does he do though to help bus service improve? That's what I don't understand.

He doesn't. That's the point. They can just parade him around as an example of the "great" job mobility you have at NYCT.

[paulrivera]

What exactly does he do though to help bus service improve? That's what I don't understand.

Officially, he's the EVP of NYCT DOB, and President of MTA Bus. Nowadays, he's the interim Acting President of all of NYCT while they look for a new MTA Chairman.

 

In actuality, he just signs off on things. Under his leadership however, he's turned this "trim the fat" mentality the MTA has to the point of anorexia on the bus side.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Officially, he's the EVP of NYCT DOB, and President of MTA Bus. Nowadays, he's the interim Acting President of all of NYCT while they look for a new MTA Chairman.

 

In actuality, he just signs off on things. Under his leadership however, he's turned this "trim the fat" mentality the MTA has to the point of anorexia on the bus side.

It makes sense. I would really LOVE to see Kevin Ortiz resign.  He is the face to how horrid the has become in terms of providing better bus service.  His indifference and flat out denials of how horrendous service is is just appalling.  We need more people that are receptive to improving service and he isn't one of them.

[DS4Ever]

Cool

[DaTransitMan4608]

The mentality of your average suburbanite is why our transit network, especially when it comes to buses, is severely poorly interconnected (i.e, shit... Lol).... The urbanite's reponse is, and has always been 100% reactionary.... Hate to preach, but it's the quintessential example of two wrongs not making a right.... While I don't agree with how VG8 feels about it all, I do understand it..... Personally, I'd rather promote (or at least try to) suburban - urban travel (outside of high speed rail, that is), than to be on the other side of the coin of "f*** you, pay me", basically.....

 

- Urbanites are rather open about suburbanites being on buses & subways (the ones that do use them after coming off the LIRR/MNRR/NJT RR anyway)....

- Suburbanites OTOH not only stigmatize urbanites (even the ones living better off than most other urbanites), but stigmatize lower class suburbanites as well....

 

The have's have a tendency to look down on the have not's... What I find funny is you have the have not's that are better off in some cases than the have's (esp. in terms of character, but be there as it may...)...

 

Suburbia is an urban getaway.... Public transportation is supposed to be beneficial for all parties, but suburbanites use public transit to get to metropolis', where a large amount of them work (and "play", if you catch my drift)... Compare that to us urbanites' use of public transit; we don't just use it to get to/from work....

 

This is why I absolutely adore all these suburbanites that are running away from suburbia here in the 21st century.... Sucks when you don't have the almighty personal vehicle at your arsenal... I mean, how many people do you see taking to RR to go food shopping? There would be a silent lambasting (or amongst each other, if amongst a group) from just about anyone else in that particular RR car

 

Although I haven't given Jubai's particular idea any thought as of yet, in regards to what you're saying here, I'd go about matters on a case by case basis as to [whether some route should be extended across county lines], or [the creation of a new route that would transport folks across county lines]...

 

In other words, I'm not for extending routes over county lines willy-nilly just to support the cause (an eastward extension of the Q4 to..... wherever the hell some ppl. justify sending it in Nassau county, I categorize as such)....

 

To your other point, of course the n20 (regardless of now that it's been split) serves more NYC patrons than Nassau patrons... The folks that live in the part of Nassau county that the n20 serves, is car country USA...... The route that gets the most patronization in northern Nassau county is the n27 and... it's... not... even... close... But yeah, the splitting up of the n20 made the fact you're pointing out all the more conspicuous..... It's a reason why I was never fond of extending the Q12 to LIRR Great Neck....

B35, I'm gonna reply to your post more and elaborate on that sentiment a bit more when I arrive in the city. It's a pain trying to reply to posts on this app.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using NYC Transit Forums mobile app

[B35 via Church]

The old Bx31 terminal never seemed efficient but I never used it.

 

I've always wondered if it's faster to take the (4)/Bx16 than the (5)/Bx16. Re: the Bx16 riders who want the West side can get the first, and Bx10 riders use BPB. The Bx28/34/38 stop always seems more crowded at 206. Every time I've used the Bx16, someone has boarded on Webster but those lights on 233 are horrid and it ends up on top of a Bx34.

I'd say the current terminal is inefficient; after the MNRR station, it tends to carry little to no one through residential Woodlawn....  The turnaround for the prior terminal was inefficient; running all the way up to Nereid to then run back down on Bronx Blvd to get back to 231st was an absolute PITA (most my uses of the NB Bx31 were to ride it to the last stop).... Outside of leaving a gap (which would affect service to the hospital, walking up/down where it slopes along 231st), ending the route at WPR would also present an infeasible turnaround scenario....

 

I would've favored extending the route to the county line (on WPR, via WPR) than to where it ends now (even if it means "Bx9-ing" (Lol) how it ends up there).... It would easily get more usage [on WPR b/w 231st & the county line], compared to the use it gets b/w [MNRR Woodlawn & 242nd/Katonah].... And to boot, both of those extensions are around the same distance.....

 

 

To your inquiry, if I'm trying to get to Post Road Plaza (for example) & my options were to take the or the (2)/(5) to the Bx16, I'm taking the 100% of the time.... I'm not being bothered with taking the all the way up to Nereid, the serves too much territory w/i the borough..... Let's say we're starting from a mutual point in the Bronx - like 149th/GC subway....

 

- The from 149th/GC to Woodlawn is around 20-25 mins...

- The from 149th/GC to Nereid I'd say is around 35-40 mins...

# The Bx16 b/w Woodlawn & Nereid is around 15 mins...

 

This intra-borough scenario is more or less a wash.... Coming from Manhattan or Brooklyn (especially) though, there is more of an advantage to taking the to the Bx16 in terms of time (hell, it's why I answered the question the way I did!), simply due to the fact that the spends less time in Manhattan....

 

All those lights on 233rd is a reason I had/have that idea that involves running Bx16's nonstop along VCP east to 233rd, to speed things up on the route....

 

B35, I'm gonna reply to your post more and elaborate on that sentiment a bit more when I arrive in the city. It's a pain trying to reply to posts on this app.

Alright, cool.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

That's exactly who uses the Bx31... MNRR riders in Woodlawn. It also gives people access to the lines. Not many use it but some do.

[B35 via Church]

That's exactly who uses the Bx31... MNRR riders in Woodlawn. It also gives people access to the lines. Not many use it but some do.

So cab service is hurting up there because of the Bx31, I suppose.... I can't believe those same folks stopped taking taxi's to their homes from the RR station due to the extension of the route.....

 

The Bx34 is all they need up there; the issue with that route is & has been lack of service... Shit, if there was a way for it to double back to serve the MNRR, nobody up there would give a shit about getting to the ....

[Via Garibaldi 8]

So cab service is hurting up there because of the Bx31, I suppose.... I can't believe those same folks stopped taking taxi's to their homes from the RR station due to the extension of the route.....

 

The Bx34 is all they need up there; the issue with that route is & has been lack of service... Shit, if there was a way for it to double back to serve the MNRR, nobody up there would give a shit about getting to the ....

I have actually used it when coming from Westchester. I would get off at the Woodlawn MNRR station, transfer to the Bx31 and transfer to the BxM4. Usually I was driven to Woodlawn though for the BxM4, so I would check out the Bx31 and Bx34 while waiting. It doesn't see that much usage, but I also don't see Woodlawn giving up that bus without making a huge stink. Considering how small Woodlawn is, they have a lot of political clout. We're represented by the same politicians so I hear what goes on over there. They were the ones that got the BxM4 to start earlier during the morning. Edited March 19, 2017 by Via Garibaldi 8

[B35 via Church]

I have actually used it when coming from Westchester. I would get off at the Woodlawn MNRR station, transfer to the Bx31 and transfer to the BxM4. Usually I was driven to Woodlawn though for the BxM4, so I would check out the Bx31 and Bx34 while waiting. It doesn't see that much usage, but I also don't see Woodlawn giving up that bus without making a huge stink. Considering how small Woodlawn is, they have a lot of political clout. We're represented by the same politicians so I hear what goes on over there. They were the ones that got the BxM4 to start earlier during the morning.

What happens when you suddenly remove a newfound food "supply" from a stray cat? Won't be a pretty sight if that cat finds out it was you

 

Of course they're not going to give it up without a fight; it's extra bus service they don't have with the Bx34....

I mean, resorting to take the Bx31 to the because there isn't enough bus service on the Bx34 to get them to the is straight up bullshit.... I'd like to know how many of those few folks that are riding to the are actually from residential Woodlawn, and how much of them are descending down from your beloved Yonkers (Lol)....

 

Jokes aside, the problem up there (as far as local service goes) is really the lack of service on the Bx34... I can't even call the Bx31 a band-aid solution; it's more like putting suntan lotion on your body during the winter....

Edited March 20, 2017 by B35 via Church

[Via Garibaldi 8]

What happens when you suddenly remove a newfound food "supply" from a stray cat? Won't be a pretty sight if that cat finds out it was you

 

Of course they're not going to give it up without a fight; it's extra bus service they don't have with the Bx34....

I mean, resorting to take the Bx31 to the because there isn't enough bus service on the Bx34 to get them to the is straight up bullshit.... I'd like to know how many of those few folks that are riding to the are actually from residential Woodlawn, and how much of them are descending down from your beloved Yonkers (Lol)....

 

Jokes aside, the problem up there (as far as local service goes) is really the lack of service on the Bx34... I can't even call the Bx31 a band-aid solution; it's more like putting suntan lotion on your body during the winter....

Truth be told, it's the workers that come to Woodlawn (Mexicans, etc. working in those pubs and such), along with people from Yonkers (mix of workers, etc.) using those buses, but the elderly people especially want those buses so they can do shopping along Katonah or further north on McLean across the border. I will say they're a tight knit community. I've talked with various residents up there while waiting for the BxM4. One elderly lady asked where I lived, and commented about how she should move there because they don't get enough done in Woodlawn. LOL

 

When they run properly, the Bx31 and 34 seem to alternate.

Edited March 20, 2017 by Via Garibaldi 8

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

While I agree that the Bx31 is inefficient in that area of the NE/NW? Bronx, I think there's not much that can be done. I don't believe that rerouting buses to Wakefield will change much of anything either. You might get more people riding past the stop, but not by a lot, IMO.

 

Can it be possible to branch the Bx31 past White Plains Road? You can have alternating buses going to Woodlawn, and maintains direct service to the Woodlawn station for residents. Then, you can send the other buses going to Wakefield, and that would serve both areas with coverage headways at the very least. This would occur from 5:30 AM to about 10:00 PM on Weekdays, 7:30 AM to 7:30 PM on Saturdays. All other times, buses would serve one of the two terminals.

Edited March 20, 2017 by BM5 via Woodhaven Bl

[B35 via Church]

While I agree that the Bx31 is inefficient in that area of the NE/NW? Bronx, I think there's not much that can be done. I don't believe that rerouting buses to Wakefield will change much of anything either. You might get more people riding past the stop, but not by a lot, IMO.

 

Can it be possible to branch the Bx31 past White Plains Road? You can have alternating buses going to Woodlawn, and maintains direct service to the Woodlawn station for residents. Then, you can send the other buses going to Wakefield, and that would serve both areas with coverage headways at the very least. This would occur from 5:30 AM to about 10:00 PM on Weekdays, 7:30 AM to 7:30 PM on Saturdays. All other times, buses would serve one of the two terminals.

Don't agree; there's long been a] demand for bus service north of 241st that doesn't involve going all that deep into Mt. Vernon & b] those that don't want to go on a tour through residential Wakefield to get to the upper part of Wakefield/southerly part of Mt. Vernon... I've seen more than my fair share of ppl. taking the BL-42 NB for some real short distances (some of which are people getting off the Bx31, to boot); well before ever hitting MNRR Mt Vernon (east).... Although it serves for a near perfect layover spot along 241st, that was a problem with the (then) Bx41/now (Bx39).... The turnaround is the biggest obstacle to running service up there, so they [MTA] hand that area to Bee Line & call it a day....  Now I'm not saying running Bx31's up there is *the* answer, but again, I would have much preferred that, to running it up to residential Woodlawn where there was virtually no demand for even getting to the ... Hell, if there was, there would've been no way in hell that the Bx31 avoided residential Woodlawn like that for all that time....

 

IDK if it's supposed to be an attempt at diplomacy/compromisation or what, but I don't see what branching would solve - especially if you (also) believe it's inefficient in Woodlawn & would be just as inefficient in Wakefield..... For what you started out saying about not being much that could be done, they shouldn't have bothered extending the thing....

 

I don't wanna hear about lack of funds (not from you, but from the MTA) when you're sending buses where they don't need to be sent, but at the same time, completely getting rid of routes that had growing ridership when you decided to wash your hands with them....

 

Truth be told, it's the workers that come to Woodlawn (Mexicans, etc. working in those pubs and such), along with people from Yonkers (mix of workers, etc.) using those buses, but the elderly people especially want those buses so they can do shopping along Katonah or further north on McLean across the border. I will say they're a tight knit community. I've talked with various residents up there while waiting for the BxM4. One elderly lady asked where I lived, and commented about how she should move there because they don't get enough done in Woodlawn. LOL

 

When they run properly, the Bx31 and 34 seem to alternate.

That tight-knittedness is why it's so easy to determine/see what their transit needs are & FWIW, they have been more than vocal about them anyway!.... It's the same as down in Gerritsen Beach (well, sans the vocality).... But as far as who's doing the riding on the Bx31 up there, that makes sense.... And to your last point, I've noticed that also - almost like clockwork.... You're not gonna see two Bx34's leaving back to back anyway, but even with 2 Bx31's at the terminal, the both of them will not leave (in service anyway) before a Bx34 does......

 

I personally wouldn't live up there, but I always had what I guess you could call a soft spot for that part of the Bronx... Unlike the pretentious asses you get in (what Cait Sith calls) Cuntry club .... They really thought they were Fieldston with that whole noise (and air) pollution, we don't want all these buses running in our neighborhood, yada yada yada crap, back when the MTA had Bx8's going through there.... But I digress.....

[aemoreira81]

On the Bx46 route...there is a serious proposal for the Bx6 to become an SBS route. Might be worth it to have two branches of the Bx46 with a west end at Yankee Stadium and an east end at Hunts Point Market? The A route would follow the current Bx6 east of Yankee Stadium, while the B route would separate from the A route at Prospect Avenue and head to Longwood to follow the Bx46 route as it is. I did float the idea in my head of a circular route, but threw it out as unwieldy. With SBS on the Bx6, one might not need as many buses on the local section anymore.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

On the Bx46 route...there is a serious proposal for the Bx6 to become an SBS route. Might be worth it to have two branches of the Bx46 with a west end at Yankee Stadium and an east end at Hunts Point Market? The A route would follow the current Bx6 east of Yankee Stadium, while the B route would separate from the A route at Prospect Avenue and head to Longwood to follow the Bx46 route as it is. I did float the idea in my head of a circular route, but threw it out as unwieldy. With SBS on the Bx6, one might not need as many buses on the local section anymore.

I don't understand the proposal. It's already been stated that the Bx6 will have a local counterpart to the Bx6SBS.

[B35 via Church]

I don't understand the proposal. It's already been stated that the Bx6 will have a local counterpart to the Bx6SBS.

In laymens, nothing would be dubbed the "Bx6 local"..... All (branched) local service would run as Bx46's.

 

On the Bx46 route...there is a serious proposal for the Bx6 to become an SBS route. Might be worth it to have two branches of the Bx46 with a west end at Yankee Stadium and an east end at Hunts Point Market? The A route would follow the current Bx6 east of Yankee Stadium, while the B route would separate from the A route at Prospect Avenue and head to Longwood to follow the Bx46 route as it is. I did float the idea in my head of a circular route, but threw it out as unwieldy. With SBS on the Bx6, one might not need as many buses on the local section anymore.

How often would the 'A' route run (current Bx6 local portion), compared to the 'B' route (extended Bx46 portion to YS)?

Edited May 31, 2017 by B35 via Church

[Via Garibaldi 8]

In laymens, nothing would be dubbed the "Bx6 local"..... All (branched) local service would run as Bx46's.

I should've been clearer. When I said I didn't understand, I meant, I didn't understand the point of the proposal when the has already decided on the route. Extending the Bx46 west seems like a no-brainer, but maybe th wants it solely as a subway feeder to avoid having it become unreliable.

[B35 via Church]

I should've been clearer. When I said I didn't understand, I meant, I didn't understand the point of the proposal when the has already decided on the route. Extending the Bx46 west seems like a no-brainer, but maybe th wants it solely as a subway feeder to avoid having it become unreliable.

What I don't understand is the point of branching Bx6 local service with the Bx46... It sounds to me like he wants to take away from the current Bx6 local portion.... But I won't hold my breath for a response from him....