Nightmare Friday commute possible as group plans to disrupt Transit

[trainfan22]

The NYPD is preparing for possible disruptions across the city's transit system Friday after a group announced a mass gathering to call for an end to targeted harassment by police.

Among demands of free transit and full accessibility in subways, Decolonize This Place encouraged New Yorkers to show up and move as a group to dismiss the MTA's $2.75 fare and advocate against cops in the transit system.

"The streets are ours. The trains our ours. The walls are ours. This moment is ours," the group said in a Twitter post accompanying its announcement video.

Protests were expected to take place over the course of the day -- and cops said they were prepared at all hours. Some subway access doors were chained open to allow people to go through without paying the fare. Profanity-laden graffiti already was scrawled on some subway stations before the sun fully came up -- and it may only get worse.

DecolonizeThisPlace@decolonize_this

Happening everywhere in the city now. Hop. Hold. Chain. #FTP3 #J31

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9:10 AM - Jan 31, 2020

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In an internal memo obtained by NBC New York, NYPD Chief Terence Monahan on Thursday told command staff, "While we will always protect people's right to protest, illegal conduct that puts law-abiding community and cops in danger will not be tolerated in New York City."

"It is imperative that officers take appropriate action and make arrests when they observe a violation of the law," he continued.

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Also in Monahan's memo, he said the group "will attempt to disrupt public transportation, cause disorder - and physically assault police officers."

Friday's gathering is the third one organized by Decolonize This Place. In November, dozens were arrested after a huge crowd of about 200 protesters converged in Harlem, with some of the participants leaving buses and police vehicles vandalized with anti-police messages.

Some confrontations with officers turned violent but no injuries were reported.

The rallies have been in response to the NYPD's presence and arrests in the subway, specifically against low-income New Yorkers and people of color.

Earlier this month, New York Attorney General Letitia James announced that her office is investigating the NYPD's fare-enforcement practices after the department found black and Hispanic people account for the majority of fare-related summonses and arrests.

"We've all read the stories and seen the disturbing videos of men, women, and children being harassed, dragged away, and arrested by officers in our city's subway system, which is why we are launching an investigation into this deeply troublesome conduct," James said in a statement.

NYPD spokeswoman Devora Kaye said officers "patrol day and night to keep 6 million daily riders safe and enforce the law fairly and equally without consideration of race or ethnicity."

 

Get real-time transit updates from all your key sources below.

Copyright NBC New York

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Link to rest of article...

 

https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/friday-commute-in-nyc-could-be-disrupted-as-group-rallies-for-free-transit-accessibility/2273792/

 

 

[trainfan22]

I think nothing major will happen... saw on the news the planners of this covering up their faces and alter their voices so they couldn't be ID'd. They tagged up 72nd on CPW with graffiti and such. 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

1 hour ago, trainfan22 said:

I think nothing major will happen... saw on the news the planners of this covering up their faces and alter their voices so they couldn't be ID'd. They tagged up 72nd on CPW with graffiti and such. 

Depends on what you mean by "nothing major"... Enough has already happened...

[Future ENY OP]

47 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Depends on what you mean by "nothing major"... Enough has already happened...

Cops already stationed in Brooklyn. 3 correction buses + a slew of NYPD on Atlantic & Flatbush. Hope their agenda works. While I understand the protest. However, doing it during rush hour will defeat its purpose. 

[trainfan22]

I was there, I didn't participate in the event just there as a lookie loo. Just seemed like your run of the mill protest, groups of people holding signs, yelling chants, whole bunch of cops, etc. Subways seemed to be unaffected, buses seemed to be delayed though, especially all the routes that travel on 42nd Street.

[JeremiahC99]

19 minutes ago, trainfan22 said:

I was there, I didn't participate in the event just there as a lookie loo. Just seemed like your run of the mill protest, groups of people holding signs, yelling chants, whole bunch of cops, etc. Subways seemed to be unaffected, buses seemed to be delayed though, especially all the routes that travel on 42nd Street.

I also saw the protests. One banner got taken away from the Grand Central balcony, and they also took some FTP balloons away as well. As for the subways, my trip home was also smooth rolling.

8 hours ago, trainfan22 said:

They tagged up 72nd on CPW with graffiti and such. 

Not only that, but they have also vandalized the new OMNY readers.

There has also been reports of glue in the MetroCard readers on the turnstiles preventing the turnstiles from working, emergency doors being stuck open with zip ties, etc.

Edited February 1, 2020 by JeremiahC99

[paulrivera]

“We’re gonna disrupt the subway!”

Protest held in Grand Central TERMINAL, the home of the Metro-North *Commuter Railroad*

These guys aren’t all that bright are they?

[JeremiahC99]

20 minutes ago, paulrivera said:

“We’re gonna disrupt the subway!”

Protest held in Grand Central TERMINAL, the home of the Metro-North *Commuter Railroad*

These guys aren’t all that bright are they?

Nope.

However, I saw them leave Grand Central and walk towards Bryant Park. I however went home when they passed Madison Avenue. When I got home, I watched news coverage of the protest and found out that they then hopped the turnstiles at 42nd Street-Bryant Park on the  lines.

 

[NewFlyer 230]

This protest was a little too much in my opinion. I can totally get behind being upset at the targeting of minorities, but defacing property isn’t necessary. There is a clear difference between a peaceful protest and acting like savages. These people acted liked like savages and that’s why they won’t get what they want. And good luck trying to get the subways free, our system of capitalism is the real culprit. Agencies like the MTA have to fall in line with the increases in the cost of living and just about everything else. Hey I wish the fare can be $1.50 or $2.00 in 2020, but we live in a country run by capitalism where unfortunately there is a huge wealth gap and the price for things keeps increasing at a rate faster than what a lot of people make and can afford.

[MHV9218]

Completely the wrong way to go about this. They've spoiled a completely legitimate message (it is a waste to spend money 500 cops) with their antics. Fare strikes have occurred in the past, and they can be legitimate. But this was closer to anarchy, which is a failed political system.

[Lawrence St]

13 hours ago, paulrivera said:

“We’re gonna disrupt the subway!”

Protest held in Grand Central TERMINAL, the home of the Metro-North *Commuter Railroad*

These guys aren’t all that bright are they?

Unfortunately

[B35 via Church]

Heavy on the makeup or not, Ali's looking like a whole snack to me right now....

Anyway, this is what happens when you amass a collective of misfits in one of the busiest parts of the entire city.... There's standing for a cause, and then there's carrying yourself like a bunch of god damn miserable, unfulfilled, knuckle dragging fu**in knuckleheads with nothing better to do than showcase their collective IQ points of any single subway line they ended up unlawfully gaining access to last night - And yes, this includes the "lettered" lines, which have a numerical value of ZERO.

#freelancingdidntworkout #myhandismygirl #thefishmarketsthatway # ismokeaboutapackaday #meowmeowmeowmeow #iranoutofsnackpacks #thatcrayonstoodeep #vapeordie #roomeez4life

 

Jackasses..... Every single person that showed their natural ass last night.

 

 

[Jemorie]

On 1/31/2020 at 11:54 PM, MHV9218 said:

Completely the wrong way to go about this. They've spoiled a completely legitimate message (it is a waste to spend money 500 cops) with their antics. Fare strikes have occurred in the past, and they can be legitimate. But this was closer to anarchy, which is a failed political system.

Yeah, they basically gave the  even more reason to put cops into the subway. Those vandalizes are so hypocritical to the point it added so much irony.

[T to Dyre Avenue]

On 1/31/2020 at 11:05 PM, NewFlyer 230 said:

This protest was a little too much in my opinion. I can totally get behind being upset at the targeting of minorities, but defacing property isn’t necessary. There is a clear difference between a peaceful protest and acting like savages. These people acted liked like savages and that’s why they won’t get what they want. And good luck trying to get the subways free, our system of capitalism is the real culprit. Agencies like the MTA have to fall in line with the increases in the cost of living and just about everything else. Hey I wish the fare can be $1.50 or $2.00 in 2020, but we live in a country run by capitalism where unfortunately there is a huge wealth gap and the price for things keeps increasing at a rate faster than what a lot of people make and can afford.

Free is definitely, and unfortunately, not an option. Believe it or not, NYCTA’s farebox recovery is 47 percent. While that’s far from great, the agency does need it. If that money is taken away, then it will have to come from somewhere else, most likely increased subsidies from Albany. And I can already see a substantial number of State pols yelling, “NO!” at their computers or smartphones if they are greeted with that prospect. 

On 1/31/2020 at 11:54 PM, MHV9218 said:

Completely the wrong way to go about this. They've spoiled a completely legitimate message (it is a waste to spend money 500 cops) with their antics. Fare strikes have occurred in the past, and they can be legitimate. But this was closer to anarchy, which is a failed political system.

True. That money could be spent to improve the system. However, we do seem to be having more assaults on Transit employees and riders too, and that’s got to be stopped. Is there another, better way to do it?

Edited February 4, 2020 by T to Dyre Avenue

[CenSin]

On 1/31/2020 at 11:05 PM, NewFlyer 230 said:

And good luck trying to get the subways free, our system of capitalism is the real culprit. Agencies like the MTA have to fall in line with the increases in the cost of living and just about everything else. Hey I wish the fare can be $1.50 or $2.00 in 2020, but we live in a country run by capitalism where unfortunately there is a huge wealth gap and the price for things keeps increasing at a rate faster than what a lot of people make and can afford.

I think this is the most on-point comment concerning the matter. To expand on that: there are really two opposing sides here: those who have no capital (a.k.a.: very low net worth or high debt) who have everything to gain from everything being free; and those who have capital (a.k.a.: have some positive net worth) who would feel cheated by society. But the interesting thing is that the two sides are not the rich and the poor, but the middle class and the poor! The rich don’t worry about taxes or the cost of transportation. They can pay for everything. I’m willing to bet that much of the indignation of opening transportation to the public for free comes from the middle class folks, because they feel the burden of laboring for a paycheck and they pay more taxes. At the same time, they see the poor getting benefits from government—something that’s sure to stir up indignation. It’s a situation that’s ripe for politicians to take advantage of to pit the middle class against the poor. Why, look at those good-for-nothing leeches mooching off your tax dollars! Pay no attention to the billionaires and corporations who are hiding their money from Uncle Sam!

It’s a very hard attitude for the middle class to shake off, especially when it’s so easy to become poor nowadays. People will kiss up to the bad system if it will oppress a group that is even worse off. Do I support free transportation? Hell no! That means the state has to find money for it somehow and it’s going to be coming out of my paycheck. Let the poor pay their share. You see how that mindset works?

There’s only one workable solution. I hate to say that DeBlasio has got something right for once: a millionaire tax. I don’t know if he’s sincere about it, but you and I know that the poor will never be able to shoulder the burden of taxes, the middle class will become poor if they shoulder most of the tax burden, but the rich can be taxed—and they will still be rich.

[bobtehpanda]

On 2/10/2020 at 8:23 PM, CenSin said:

There’s only one workable solution. I hate to say that DeBlasio has got something right for once: a millionaire tax. I don’t know if he’s sincere about it, but you and I know that the poor will never be able to shoulder the burden of taxes, the middle class will become poor if they shoulder most of the tax burden, but the rich can be taxed—and they will still be rich.

Don't tax income, income is gameable and easily moved around by changing residency and whatnot.

The real big bucks is property tax reform, since right now the effective rate of those crazy billionaire apartments on 57th St is .22%, lower than the lowest property tax jurisdiction in the US: https://www.mansionglobal.com/articles/nyc-billionaires-row-could-see-property-taxes-quintuple-under-proposed-system-211864

Heck, slap a vacancy tax on top of that and solve two birds with one stone.

----------

There are major issues with a free fare though.

• The MTA currently collects $6.2B in fares. The NYC budget is $95B. You can't just hike city revenues by 6.5% only by walloping rich people.
• The fare does serve to limit trivial usage of the subway. The subway in many parts is crowded, the buses even more so, and free transit will attract lots of new ridership that will need new trains and buses that will cost even more. Some train lines are also maxed out with track capacity, and the cost of new subways to relieve them will cost billions, if not tens of billions of dollars. Some cities have cancelled free transit after their transit system could not cope with demand.
• From a policy perspective, it turns out that new ridership generated from free fares generally switches from biking and walking, not driving. If you think about it, this makes sense because driving and parking in Manhattan is already either really expensive, a massive PITA or both, so the people doing it by choice are probably not doing it because the subway's too expensive. IMO this is not a productive policy goal.

It would be a lot easier to distribute reduced-fare cards based on eligibility for other city benefits like EBT or NYCHA, the way Fair Fares is supposed to work if the mayoral administration isn't dragging its feet.

Employers should also be compelled to meet certain drive-alone targets through any means necessary. Seattle has this law, so my employer pays for my monthly regional transit pass and doesn't take it out of my salary.

Edited February 12, 2020 by bobtehpanda

[Deucey]

On 1/31/2020 at 9:32 PM, paulrivera said:

“We’re gonna disrupt the subway!”

Protest held in Grand Central TERMINAL, the home of the Metro-North *Commuter Railroad*

These guys aren’t all that bright are they?

Or they caught on that to get changes made at a state agency, getting voters who live in districts outside the 5 boroughs to pay attention to the issue may lead to them contacting legislators to do something.

[CenSin]

On 2/12/2020 at 2:24 AM, bobtehpanda said:

Don't tax income, income is gameable and easily moved around by changing residency and whatnot.

The real big bucks is property tax reform, since right now the effective rate of those crazy billionaire apartments on 57th St is .22%, lower than the lowest property tax jurisdiction in the US: https://www.mansionglobal.com/articles/nyc-billionaires-row-could-see-property-taxes-quintuple-under-proposed-system-211864

Heck, slap a vacancy tax on top of that and solve two birds with one stone.

That’s interesting. The forces of capitalism apply to entire cities, state, and nations themselves. it’s a race to the bottom to see which city/state/country can provide the best deals to keep the wealthy within its borders.

On 2/12/2020 at 2:24 AM, bobtehpanda said:

• The fare does serve to limit trivial usage of the subway. The subway in many parts is crowded, the buses even more so, and free transit will attract lots of new ridership that will need new trains and buses that will cost even more. Some train lines are also maxed out with track capacity, and the cost of new subways to relieve them will cost billions, if not tens of billions of dollars. Some cities have cancelled free transit after their transit system could not cope with demand.
• From a policy perspective, it turns out that new ridership generated from free fares generally switches from biking and walking, not driving. If you think about it, this makes sense because driving and parking in Manhattan is already either really expensive, a massive PITA or both, so the people doing it by choice are probably not doing it because the subway's too expensive. IMO this is not a productive policy goal.

This is probably the biggest barrier. The limited supply of transit and the demand that comes with lowering the cost to $0 will necessitate an expansion, which we have neither the funds nor political will to do, not to mention that billions of funds annually will already be diverted to subsidizing the operation of the existing infrastructure.

Really, the policies that must be enacted have to reach into society more broadly than singularly taxing billionaires or banning cars in some areas. Because a gain in one area likely co-occurs with losses in another. So by necessity, the policies must be comprehensive to account for all the possible effects. As you mentioned, free transit doesn’t draw ridership from drivers in all cases.

On 2/12/2020 at 2:24 AM, bobtehpanda said:

It would be a lot easier to distribute reduced-fare cards based on eligibility for other city benefits like EBT or NYCHA, the way Fair Fares is supposed to work if the mayoral administration isn't dragging its feet.

My reaction to this is tepid. The Fair Fares program’s income eligibility is set pretty low: the federal poverty level. My opinion is that even 400% federal poverty level ($51,040) is low in New York City.

• The average $2,500/month rent is $30,000/year.
• After rent, someone making 400% FPI is left with $21,040.
• I consider retirement investment to be non-negotiable in this country. Pensions have gone the way of the dodo, and people really need to max out their contributions to ensure that they will have money in retirement. Currently, the max contribution legally allowed is $19,500 for 401(k) and 403(b) accounts. After retirement account contributions, this person is left with $1,540.
• A monthly MetroCard costs $1,524/year. Paying for a monthly MetroCard leaves this person with $16/year.

This hypothetical person’s situation is better than a lot of New Yorkers, but it’s still easy to see how living expenses and retirement contributions leave almost nothing around for discretionary spending.

[bobtehpanda]

2 hours ago, CenSin said:

My reaction to this is tepid. The Fair Fares program’s income eligibility is set pretty low: the federal poverty level. My opinion is that even 400% federal poverty level ($51,040) is low in New York City.

• The average $2,500/month rent is $30,000/year.
• After rent, someone making 400% FPI is left with $21,040.
• I consider retirement investment to be non-negotiable in this country. Pensions have gone the way of the dodo, and people really need to max out their contributions to ensure that they will have money in retirement. Currently, the max contribution legally allowed is $19,500 for 401(k) and 403(b) accounts. After retirement account contributions, this person is left with $1,540.
• A monthly MetroCard costs $1,524/year. Paying for a monthly MetroCard leaves this person with $16/year.

This hypothetical person’s situation is better than a lot of New Yorkers, but it’s still easy to see how living expenses and retirement contributions leave almost nothing around for discretionary spending.

I agree with you on the income limit, hence my caveat of "if the mayoral administration isn't dragging its feet."

Seattle has a low income fare program that people qualify for at 200% of federal poverty level. If New York wanted to set the threshold higher, it could. And as I said, another prong to this approach is mandating employer responsibility for their employees' commuting habits so that even if you are above the threshold, your employer pays for it out of their pocket.

These are some of many reasons why Seattle was one of the few cities to see sustained positive transit ridership growth over the last decade.

[CenSin]

1 hour ago, bobtehpanda said:

I agree with you on the income limit, hence my caveat of "if the mayoral administration isn't dragging its feet."

Seattle has a low income fare program that people qualify for at 200% of federal poverty level. If New York wanted to set the threshold higher, it could. And as I said, another prong to this approach is mandating employer responsibility for their employees' commuting habits so that even if you are above the threshold, your employer pays for it out of their pocket.

These are some of many reasons why Seattle was one of the few cities to see sustained positive transit ridership growth over the last decade.

Employers paying for it is kind of a win/lose thing if implemented incorrectly. There should be an exemption for smaller businesses so that they don’t have to make a decision between cutting jobs or paying for all their employees’ transportation costs. Small businesses in New York City these days aren’t very profitable, mainly due to the high rent. That probably has to be remedied as well.

[bobtehpanda]

24 minutes ago, CenSin said:

Employers paying for it is kind of a win/lose thing if implemented incorrectly. There should be an exemption for smaller businesses so that they don’t have to make a decision between cutting jobs or paying for all their employees’ transportation costs. Small businesses in New York City these days aren’t very profitable, mainly due to the high rent. That probably has to be remedied as well.

https://www.seattle.gov/transportation/projects-and-programs/programs/transportation-options-program/commute-trip-reduction-program/ctr-requirements#basicrequirementsforemployers

The threshold here is a minimum of 100 employees showing up to a single job site between 6-9am.

As far as vacancies go, just tax vacancies at a higher rate than occupied property. With a punitive enough rate landlords will be rushing to fill spaces.

Edited February 14, 2020 by bobtehpanda