App That Would Guide Users Away From High-Crime Areas Proves Controversial

[checkmatechamp13]

Microsoft App To Guide Users Away From High-Crime Areas Proves Controversial « CBS Dallas / Fort Worth

[Joe]

Let the statistics speak for themselves. Instead of whining about so-called "discrimination", why don't these elected officials work on fixing their shithole districts?

[SoSpectacular]

No point in stupid apps like these

[Locomotion69]

That would of came in handy when I got lost driving around in Irvington:eek:

[lilbluefoxie]

that seems handy

[B35 via Church]

I'm gonna put a different spin on this....

 

Wouldn't that aid in increasing traffic in the more desirable, or lower-crime areas?

Then the complaint would be, where's the influx of these vehicles coming from all of a sudden...

 

"AIR POLLUTION.... NOISE POLLUTION...."

[trainfan22]

This would be awesome! Would be really helpful when I try to busfan NJ Transit and Septa lol.

 

That's a fear I have is busfanning a route that ends in the middle of the hood (BX33 eastern terminal for example). Hempstead TC, Spring Valley bus terminal doesn't bother me, but a route then ends in the residential part of the hood would have me worried.

 

Reminds me of when I rode the 171 westbound when we got to Paterson, I was like, boy.... this is gonna be fun! But then the bus passed though this downtown BK/Harlem 125th street looking area and ended in a nice bus terminal, I took the other Paterson - PABT route (Not the 161) back to NY.

[lilbluefoxie]

well i mean, for now the best thing is to do your homework, look up towns on citydata and wikipedia and such and draw your own conclusions if its an area to avoid or not.

 

the other issue I could see with this is, everyones definition of whats an unsafe neighborhood is different, for example, a station or an area may be just fine for someone to go down there, for someone else they would be more cautious or avoid it altogether.

[Grand Concourse]

Amusing, but still won't stop the 'lone wolf' thugs that can walk up even the more affluent/safe areas. Just be fully aware of your surroundings no matter where you are. Plain and simple.

[lilbluefoxie]

Amusing, but still won't stop the 'lone wolf' thugs that can walk up even the more affluent/safe areas. Just be fully aware of your surroundings no matter where you are. Plain and simple.

 

like years ago when someone robbed a house in Great Neck, the good thing was the cops were there quite fast and they had a helicopter and everything, and they caught the guy pretty quickly.

[checkmatechamp13]

This would be awesome! Would be really helpful when I try to busfan NJ Transit and Septa lol.

 

That's a fear I have is busfanning a route that ends in the middle of the hood (BX33 eastern terminal for example). Hempstead TC, Spring Valley bus terminal doesn't bother me, but a route then ends in the residential part of the hood would have me worried.

 

Reminds me of when I rode the 171 westbound when we got to Paterson, I was like, boy.... this is gonna be fun! But then the bus passed though this downtown BK/Harlem 125th street looking area and ended in a nice bus terminal, I took the other Paterson - PABT route (Not the 161) back to NY.

 

I remember somebody saying: Whenever you hit a street with the name "Martin Luther King Jr", you know you've reach the bad side of town. (In this case, it's MLK Drive)

 

Sad, but true (of course there are exceptions, like the MLK Expressway in SI). I mean, after his death, you had a lot of riots in mostly Black neighborhoods, and most of them were poor, crime-filled areas at the time. Of course, things change, but a lot of the neighborhoods are crime-filled to this day.

 

well i mean, for now the best thing is to do your homework, look up towns on citydata and wikipedia and such and draw your own conclusions if its an area to avoid or not.

 

the other issue I could see with this is, everyones definition of whats an unsafe neighborhood is different, for example, a station or an area may be just fine for someone to go down there, for someone else they would be more cautious or avoid it altogether.

 

On city-data, they sometimes have crime maps of the city. The most dangerous areas are dark red, and the safest areas are green. So you might have somebody who feels fine in any area except one which would be labeled dark red, and you might have somebody who only feels fine if the area is would be labeled green.

 

What they could do is just put the violent crime stats, and base it off of that. The thing is that (aside from fudging the facts), they could be inaccurate when you consider it in reality.

 

For instance, technically, the most dangerous neighborhoods in NYC are Midtown Manhattan. Why? Because there are a lot of people and opprtunities for crime to occur, but the actual population (people who live in Midtown) is very low, so it looks like it is dangerous.

 

For instance, (just making up random numbers), you have two neighborhoods: Brownsville and Midtown. There are, say 40,000 people living in Brownsville, but only 10,000 living in Midtown. However, there are 40,000 people passing through Midtown every day, and only 10,000 passing through Brownsville (who don't live there).

 

So say Brownsville has 1,000 crimes per year, and Midtown has 250 crimes per year. Their crime rates would be the same on paper (40,000/1,000 = 40, and 10,000/250 = 40). However, the crime rate when you consider the amount of people passing through is in favor of Midtown, as it should be (50,000/1,000 vs. 50,000/250)

 

No offense to Fresh Pond.

 

So I guess you can either label Midtown as dark red and hope people have the common sense to figure out that it is very safe, or you can try some different methodology to account for people passing through.

 

But then of course, you run into the problem of precincts covering different areas. For instance, the 120th precinct in SI covers areas like Stapleton, and areas like Westerleigh and Silver Lake, so you have to do it at a more localized level (maybe by census tract rather than precinct)

 

Of course, it usually is pretty obvious when you've wandered into a rough area. You'll either see boarded up homes, seedy people hanging out, or a combination of the two. The app is intended to avoid those neighborhoods in the first place.

[MHV9218]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[checkmatechamp13]

The thing is that not all ghettoes look bad. In the Los Angeles area, there are ghettoes that actually look pretty nice, and they have very few abandoned homes and things like that. The same thing in Florida, though the homes don't look as nice (they're all spread out, so if you're from the Northeast and you're used to run-down apartment buildings and rowhouses, you might not even realize you're in the ghetto, especially with all the palm trees they have there)

 

And the idea is so that you avoid the area in the first place, if at all possible. You could get off at a certain exit, and it takes you a few blocks before you realize "Something ain't right here" and now you have to pass through the area again to get back onto the expressway/main street to get out.

[CenSin]

Microsoft App To Guide Users Away From High-Crime Areas Proves Controversial « CBS Dallas / Fort Worth

It's funny that the article goes out of its way to avoid using the terms "Black" and "Latino" (or equivalents of those terms), while making note that people are worried for places named after Martin Luther King. (That guy would be saddened to see what his name has become.) The comments, however, are far more revealing of the general consensus.

 

Here are a few statistics on term frequency:

Ghetto               217Martin Luther King   28MLK                  262Black                418AA                   1African              21Negro                27Mexican              3Latino               8Asian                7Chinese              3

 

(A few instances of the term "Asian" were actually part of the term "Caucasian", so the term was actually used even less.)

 

I'm surprised Latino-related terms were far less frequent than I predicted. And looking into the usage of the terms, Asians are looked upon favorably:

…andAsians commit violent crimes at about one quarter the white rate.

 

…which makes me wonder if those protesting the app actually meant to say it'd be harmful to Black and Latino neighborhoods but used the broader term "minority" as to not appear racist. I'm lead to believe that the very protesters themselves believe that white people are not crime-prone, ironically.

[checkmatechamp13]

That's interesting. I guess that with a Latino neighborhood, a White person won't really stick out too much, compared to a Black neighborhood, so they feel it's safer even if the crime rate is similar.

 

By the way, try looking for the frequency of the term "Hispanic" in the comments. That would be one of the reasons why you're getting fewer hits for Black-related terms than Latino-related terms (though I don't think it's going to make a whole lot of a difference)

[CenSin]

That's interesting. I guess that with a Latino neighborhood, a White person won't really stick out too much, compared to a Black neighborhood, so they feel it's safer even if the crime rate is similar.

 

By the way, try looking for the frequency of the term "Hispanic" in the comments. That would be one of the reasons why you're getting fewer hits for Black-related terms than Latino-related terms (though I don't think it's going to make a whole lot of a difference)

There were only 8 occurrences of "hispanic".

 

 

It's also worth noting that some commentators pointed out (my paraphrasing) that the quickest way to turn a place into a crime-ridden ghetto is to name some geographical feature after a prominent black public figure like Martin Luther King, Jr. or Malcolm X. And jokingly, there's no place more dangerous than the intersection of Martin Luther King, Jr. Boulevard and Malcolm X Boulevard.

 

I don't know if they're joking or if there's any truth to it as I've never resided in any neighborhood where a street was renamed as such.

[Fresh Pond]

Meh, I've seen worse apps (like the one that points yo to the nearest bathroom)

 

...No offense to Fresh Pond B)

 

I see what you did there...and none taken lol.

 

Its all about how you carry yourself out in "dangerous" (notice the quotations) neighborhoods.

[East New York]

These types of conversations are so funny to me! #Fail

 

Amusing, but still won't stop the 'lone wolf' thugs that can walk up even the more affluent/safe areas. Just be fully aware of your surroundings no matter where you are. Plain and simple.

 

Period. Point blank.

 

If you can't see with your own two eyes when you're in the ghetto, you shouldn't be driving.

 

Who gives a damn! I wish I would avoid an area just because of some stupid app or crime statistics. Live a little people. The population is turning into pussies. Then again, I'm from the hood, so the only thing that scares me is God, and I'll go through any hood at anytime. I wish I would live my life in fear of anything!

 

This app will be good for those that need it though. If I ever see someone using it I'll probably just laugh at them! Those are the types of people that automatically look out of place with big "dark red bullseyes" on their heads. Lmao! If you need the app, you shouldnt be in the hood anyway!

 

Contoversial??? Why? Some people need this kind of assistance to help them navigate life. Not everyone has balls of steel, nor look like they do. Dont be mad because your district made the list. Do something about it.

[checkmatechamp13]

Meh, I've seen worse apps (like the one that points yo to the nearest bathroom)

 

I see what you did there...and none taken lol.

 

Its all about how you carry yourself out in "dangerous" (notice the quotations) neighborhoods.

 

Exactly. You just look like you have a purpose being there (don't go around looking lost with your head down) and don't do anything stupid (There are a bunch of people hanging out down that side street and it's midnight. Should I go down that street?)

 

I'm surprised Latino-related terms were far less frequent than I predicted. And looking into the usage of the terms, Asians are looked upon favorably:

 

 

EDIT: I knew I wanted to add something....

 

If you look at the demographics of Riker's Island, you'll see the Hispanics aren't really overrepresented in the prison.

 

Interactive map: 30 years of census data - The Washington Post

 

According to this (zoom into to see the demographics for Riker's Island), the population was 56.0% Black, 34.1% Hispanic, 7.1% White, and 0.3% Asian.

 

New York (city) QuickFacts from the US Census Bureau

 

By contrast, NYC overall was 33.3% White, 28.6% Hispanic, 12.7% Asian, and 25.5% Black (I think the Non-Hispanic Black category was a little over 23%)

 

So Blacks are way overrepresented as inmates, but Hispanics not so much.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

That's interesting. I guess that with a Latino neighborhood, a White person won't really stick out too much, compared to a Black neighborhood, so they feel it's safer even if the crime rate is similar.

 

By the way, try looking for the frequency of the term "Hispanic" in the comments. That would be one of the reasons why you're getting fewer hits for Black-related terms than Latino-related terms (though I don't think it's going to make a whole lot of a difference)

 

There could be some truth in what you're saying. I do generally feel safer and more comfortable in Latino neighborhoods, but then again the majority of my friends are Hispanics so I guess it's natural in my case. I've found that working in Latino neighborhoods, folks look out for you at least in my experiences and I have reciprocated the favor. Then again some thought I was Latino so who knows. I remember I was working in Williamsburg for a little while and this older Hispanic lady looks at me, waits a bit like she was confirming that I was Hispanic then asks me what time it was in Spanish and was waiting for a response. I responded back in Spanish of course to be respectful since she was an elderly lady and she seemed at ease. Had I not been able to respond, she looked like she would've been pissed like what's wrong with you, you don't know your own language. lol

 

I try not to lead on that I speak Spanish or Italian for that matter and sometimes it works. You get to hear all kinds of juicy details. I remember I was on line once in the Garden of Eden market and these Dominican chicks were gossiping like no tomorrow. When I went to pay I made some sarcastic remark in Spanish that let the chick know that I heard the whole conversation and she was so embarrassed that all she could do was laugh as did I. lol

[checkmatechamp13]

There could be some truth in what you're saying. I do generally feel safer and more comfortable in Latino neighborhoods. I've found that working in Latino neighborhoods, folks look out for you at least in my experiences. Then again some thought I was Latino so who knows. I remember I was working in Williamsburg and this older Hispanic lady looks at me, waits a while then asks me what time it was in Spanish and was waiting for a response. I told responded back in Spanish of course and she seemed at ease. Had I not been able to respond, she looked like she would've been pissed like what's wrong with you, you don't know your own language. lol

 

Yeah, both my parents feel that way too. For instance, I remember once my mom and I were coming from Snug Harbor and didn't realize the S44 would bring us directly home, so we took the S40 to the S59. The B/O didn't wait for us to make the connection, so we had to wait 20 minutes for the next bus. While we were waiting, my mom just commented how a lot of people were speaking Spanish in the area but she didn't feel uncomfortable. In fact to this day, she doesn't mind doing shopping by Port Richmond Avenue/Castleton Avenue.

 

Then another time she took the S46 and it went out of service by the Mariners' Harbor Houses, and she didn't listen to the B/O (who just said there's another bus to the West Shore Plaza in a few minutes) and wandered into Arlington, which is very similar to the northern part of Port Richmond except there are more Blacks, and she said she felt uncomfortable there (I was pissed because she used up another ride taking the S48 to the S59 when she could've just told the next S46 driver that the bus went out of service and gotten on for free, but whatever....)

 

And my dad said that felt more comfortable in East Harlem rather than Central Harlem, even though East Harlem has the higher crime rate, because he wouldn't stick out as much.

 

My mom's Hispanic and my dad's White just for reference.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Yeah, both my parents feel that way too. For instance, I remember once my mom and I were coming from Snug Harbor and didn't realize the S44 would bring us directly home, so we took the S40 to the S59. The B/O didn't wait for us to make the connection, so we had to wait 20 minutes for the next bus. While we were waiting, my mom just commented how a lot of people were speaking Spanish in the area but she didn't feel uncomfortable.

 

Then another time she took the S46 and it went out of service by the Mariners' Harbor Houses, and she didn't listen to the B/O (who just said there's another bus to the West Shore Plaza in a few minutes) and wandered into Arlington, which is very similar to the northern part of Port Richmond except there are more Blacks, and she said she felt uncomfortable there (I was pissed because she used up another ride taking the S48 to the S59 when she could've just told the next S46 driver that the bus went out of service and gotten on for free, but whatever....)

 

Yep, I was working briefly in the area while I was preparing to go to Italy (was still technically a college student at the time, although I had taken a semester off to prepare for my study abroad) and I was working over there from 00:00 until 06:00. I used to have folks ask me I wanted food and such and some even gave me money. lol

 

I did my part too though. Had this dude that was hungry... He approached me and I immediately blew him off but he got all emotional so I asked him what he needed and he said just some food, so I took him to a diner (one of the few places opened at that time in the morning) and told the Latinas there to get him whatever he wanted and left money there to pay for it. He was thanking me so much and hugging me. B) He was clearly just having a rough time and not a druggie or anything so I figured I'd help him out.

[B35 via Church]

I remember somebody saying: Whenever you hit a street with the name "Martin Luther King Jr", you know you've reach the bad side of town. (In this case, it's MLK Drive)

Yeah, there is truth to it.

 

...but I can bet 10 bucks that that person meant - "....you know you've reached the black side of town."

can't stand when mf-ers sugarcoat things....

 

The pussification of this nation continues....

----------------

 

 

far as this app goes.... I can imagine a roundtable discussion....

'Wouldn't it be great to avoid minority areas... Should we working class (white) citizens have to be subjected to SEEING and being NEAR such destitution... humpf...'

 

man, No one can convince me that the thought process behind the making of this app aint have a racial element/undertone to it.... and I still say it'll backfire b/c you're gonna have more pussies clogging up roads in their prissy little neighborhoods.... Won't be such a great idea then, now will it....

 

That's what happens when you think of short-sighted inventions like this....

[checkmatechamp13]

Yeah, there is truth to it.

 

...but I can bet 10 bucks that that person meant - "....you know you've reached the black side of town."

can't stand when mf-ers sugarcoat things....

 

The pussification of this nation continues....

----------------

 

 

I think the guy genuinely meant the bad side. It's plainly obvious that all MLK (Blvd, Street, Avenue, etc) are going to be on the Black side of town, considering that MLK was a Black historial figure.

 

But the thing is that most of the Black neighborhoods that were clamoring for the streets to be renamed after him were violent neighborhoods. I mean, you don't see any streets named after him in SE Queens or any other nonviolent, middle class Black areas in the region (like say, the White Plains area in Westchester or Montclair or Teaneck in NJ)

 

I mean, Harlem was getting bad back in the early 1970s, and you have MLK Blvd in Newark and East Orange (2 seperate ones), then another one in Paterson and probably a few more in areas that are crime-filled (or at the very least, at the time of their naming, they were crime-filled)

 

In any case, it didn't sound like the guy was too serious anyway.

[B35 via Church]

I think the guy genuinely meant the bad side. It's plainly obvious that all MLK (Blvd, Street, Avenue, etc) are going to be on the Black side of town, considering that MLK was a Black historial figure.

lol... that's exactly my point.

 

whoever made the statement didn't wanna mention the race, regardless of how obvious it is....

I wouldn't put any stock into how passive/not serious such a person was; I direct you to your nearest closet racist.