N6 Limited Posted January 2, 2020 Share #251 Posted January 2, 2020 The plan shows avoidance of congested areas, service should be more reliable in that sense. Also, looking at the Jamaica routes, it seems like it may balance the loads between the and , more routes are designed to go to Hillside and not all descend upon Jamaica Center. This is why the QT18 is clever, it provides Merrick and Hillside with Frequent service while avoiding Archer Ave and having to Terminate in Jamaica, it'll connect to Union Turnpike as well. 12 minutes ago, Cait Sith said: Never did....that only happens when the Air Train is down. When it's down for service is that the entire network, or individual branches? 10 minutes ago, paulrivera said: You mean that overcrowded robotrain that costs $7.50? I'm gonna miss the Q10... On the plus side, in addition to the Q10 (QT14) the Q6 (QT20) will now connect to a free station in the airport. So, I know that many Airport employees use the Q3, Q10 and B15 to commute, but what percentage have terminal 5 as their destination? How many have to use the Airtrain anyway once they get to the airport? Also, I noticed that the QT68 (Q3) will be like a circulator, connecting a bunch of routes to the Hospital, Subway and Airport. Speaking of PANYNJ, the Bridge and Tunnel tolls are going up on Sun Jan 5th. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lex Posted January 2, 2020 Share #252 Posted January 2, 2020 2 hours ago, N6 Limited said: So, I know that many Airport employees use the Q3, Q10 and B15 to commute, but what percentage have terminal 5 as their destination? How many have to use the Airtrain anyway once they get to the airport? No clue, though if there's any good about that setup, it's the fact that it also provides access to the clockwise loop, which is confined to the airport. Federal Circle doesn't do that. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7LineFan Posted January 2, 2020 Share #253 Posted January 2, 2020 9 hours ago, paulrivera said: Anyone else notice they're proposing cutting the weekend hawk runs on the Q44? Last bus on Sat/Sun at 9:30?!? Like, are you kidding me? It's the little shit they're trying to sneak in like this that's going to make people lose even more faith in this agency, I swear. If they have their way Main Street will have no bus service at all during weekend nights. I've been on Q44s much later than 9:30 that are SRO. It's ridiculous. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 2, 2020 Author Share #254 Posted January 2, 2020 8 hours ago, paulrivera said: I think those buses went to an on-demand model or was otherwise severely curtailed. I'd like to know how the hell JFK is gonna end up having such mediocre public transit options when it's supposed to be the crown jewel of our airports? The fact that LaGuardia is going to look more attractive to me is pretty ass backwards tbh. Because LaGuardia always gets the better transit options then JFK, when JFK is the most used airport in the state. LaGuardia has what, two (soon three) SBS routes and one of them is a literal link for $2.75 while JFK has an overpriced AirTrain and no bus option to the . 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulrivera Posted January 2, 2020 Share #255 Posted January 2, 2020 25 minutes ago, 7LineFan said: If they have their way Main Street will have no bus service at all during weekend nights. I've been on Q44s much later than 9:30 that are SRO. It's ridiculous. Wait, not even whatever's replacing the Q20? This redesign's a borderline scam. At least the Bronx redesign maintained service spans and headways on the local side. 17 minutes ago, Lawrence St said: Because LaGuardia always gets the better transit options then JFK, when JFK is the most used airport in the state. LaGuardia has what, two (soon three) SBS routes and one of them is a literal link for $2.75 while JFK has an overpriced AirTrain and no bus option to the . Wasn't always like that. JFK was always on par with LGA, and once upon a time Airtrain was worth the money because it would show up every few minutes all the time. Saturday and Sunday is going to be a real chore for me to get to JFK no matter which way I go. The to Jamaica is infrequent (12 minutes), the Q14 is going to be infrequent (15-20 minutes), the out of Lefferts and Howard Beach are infrequent (20 minutes) , the Airtrain out of Jamaica and Howard Beach are infrequent (16 minutes), and I can't count on the Q44 after 9pm. Holy grail right there.... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7LineFan Posted January 2, 2020 Share #256 Posted January 2, 2020 1 minute ago, paulrivera said: Wait, not even whatever's replacing the Q20? This redesign's a borderline scam. At least the Bronx redesign maintained service spans and headways on the local side. The so-called QT86 is only planned to run 17 hours a day. Every day. Also take away Q44 overnight service on weekends and now you have no service on weekend nights. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7-express Posted January 2, 2020 Share #257 Posted January 2, 2020 4 minutes ago, paulrivera said: Wait, not even whatever's replacing the Q20? This redesign's a borderline scam. At least the Bronx redesign maintained service spans and headways on the local side. Wasn't always like that. JFK was always on par with LGA, and once upon a time Airtrain was worth the money because it would show up every few minutes all the time. Saturday and Sunday is going to be a real chore for me to get to JFK no matter which way I go. The to Jamaica is infrequent (12 minutes), the Q14 is going to be infrequent (15-20 minutes), the out of Lefferts and Howard Beach are infrequent (20 minutes) , the Airtrain out of Jamaica and Howard Beach are infrequent (16 minutes), and I can't count on the Q44 after 9pm. Holy grail right there.... The QT86 exists along Main Street but doesn't run to Jamaica or College Point. It only goes between Flushing and then onwards to Kew Gardens. And it has garbage headways of 20-30 minutes. Nowhere near the peak 8-10 minute frequency of the existing Q20A/B. The Q20A portion will get absorbed into the QT84 with garbage headways and lack of access to College Point/Linden Hill. The Q20B portion will be served by the new QT64 with similar headways as to what it gets now but no direct access to Flushing. The Union Street/Parsons Bvld portion of the Q20 will get absorbed into the QT16, which will still run to Jamaica but via a route similar to the existing Q65. It doesn't make a ton of sense. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7-express Posted January 2, 2020 Share #258 Posted January 2, 2020 51 minutes ago, 7LineFan said: If they have their way Main Street will have no bus service at all during weekend nights. I've been on Q44s much later than 9:30 that are SRO. It's ridiculous. They somehow believe the route is losing riders. They tried slashing service in 2019 but that got reversed when local politicians got a whiff of it: https://qns.com/story/2019/04/29/mta-changes-course-on-service-cutbacks-for-two-major-bus-lines-serving-eastern-queens-areas/ 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted January 2, 2020 Share #259 Posted January 2, 2020 (edited) 8 minutes ago, 7-express said: The QT86 exists along Main Street but doesn't run to Jamaica or College Point. It only goes between Flushing and then onwards to Kew Gardens. And it has garbage headways of 20-30 minutes. Nowhere near the peak 8-10 minute frequency of the existing Q20A/B. The Q20A portion will get absorbed into the QT84 with garbage headways and lack of access to College Point/Linden Hill. The Q20B portion will be served by the new QT64 with similar headways as to what it gets now but no direct access to Flushing. The Union Street/Parsons Bvld portion of the Q20 will get absorbed into the QT16, which will still run to Jamaica but via a route similar to the existing Q65. It doesn't make a ton of sense. It makes tons of sense. Discourage people from riding with crappy headways and poor connections, this way you deter ridership and save more, as you can cut service when people stop riding. I don't know why anyone is surprised by these changes. That's the goal here... Decrease costs... They don't care about passengers and their needs, and the people in Queens NEVER speak up on a large scale, so they will go on ahead with the changes in most cases. What will people do? Just get in their cars... All I'm hearing is this doesn't make sense. I don't hear anyone saying that they will gather to fight these changes... Edited January 2, 2020 by Via Garibaldi 8 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7-express Posted January 2, 2020 Share #260 Posted January 2, 2020 2 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said: It makes tons of sense. Discourage people from riding with crappy headways and poor connections, this way you deter ridership and save more as you can cut service when people stop riding. I don't know why anyone is surprised by these changes. That's the goal here... Decrease costs... They don't care about passengers and their needs and the people in Queens NEVER speak up on a large scale, so they will go on ahead with the changes in most cases. What will people do? Just get in their cars... This plan is basically what Thanos did with a snap of his fingers and we're left to pick up the pieces like in Endgame. It won't work. That's why I'll be writing to my lawmaker about the proposed changes to NE Queens. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted January 2, 2020 Share #261 Posted January 2, 2020 (edited) 3 minutes ago, 7-express said: This plan is basically what Thanos did with a snap of his fingers and we're left to pick up the pieces like in Endgame. It won't work. That's why I'll be writing to my lawmaker about the proposed changes to NE Queens. Well that's a start.... I've already been around on social media and some people are praising this plan, saying oh I'll just have to walk a little further. They haven't even looked at it. Queens is extremely bus dependent, and it boggles my mind how passive Queens residents are about bus service. We shall see how much push back the will receive. We had a lot of push back in the Bronx when we advocated and informed people. What annoys me is people saying well we can't do anything, as if the is a private company. They are using tax payer dollars (PUBLIC money), and this is what they want to provide the public, which is anyone who pays taxes. It's outrageous. Edited January 2, 2020 by Via Garibaldi 8 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooklynBus Posted January 2, 2020 Share #262 Posted January 2, 2020 18 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said: It makes tons of sense. Discourage people from riding with crappy headways and poor connections, this way you deter ridership and save more, as you can cut service when people stop riding. I don't know why anyone is surprised by these changes. That's the goal here... Decrease costs... They don't care about passengers and their needs, and the people in Queens NEVER speak up on a large scale, so they will go on ahead with the changes in most cases. What will people do? Just get in their cars... All I'm hearing is this doesn't make sense. I don't hear anyone saying that they will gather to fight these changes... And after the people get into their cars, the city will complain about increased traffic congestion and the MTA will praise the results claiming success because buses are running 1 mph faster. Sure, what's so hard about getting buses to run at 1 mph faster when you eliminate half the stops? What we have to do is organize a Facebook group like you did for Express bus routes to protest these changes and come up with an alternate plan most everyone can get behind. The MTA won't start making presentions to community boards until three months before the final plan is released. By then it will be too late. We have to start working now. I haven yet reviewed the plan in detail yet. There are probably a few good ideas in it, but from what I hear it is mostly back especially with long stretches of routes without bus stops. I hear they removed some very heavily used stops. Looks like they never even analyzed the data, but jus looked at a nap and are relying on the people who yell the most to determining which stops to put back. What an a**hole way to plan! I would guess 95 percent of the riders have no clue as to what is happening and half of them won't learn about the changes until ten days before they take affect when signs are posted on the buses. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted January 2, 2020 Share #263 Posted January 2, 2020 4 minutes ago, BrooklynBus said: And after the people get into their cars, the city will complain about increased traffic congestion and the MTA will praise the results claiming success because buses are running 1 mph faster. Sure, what's so hard about getting buses to run at 1 mph faster when you eliminate half the stops? What we have to do is organize a Facebook group like you did for Express bus routes to protest these changes and come up with an alternate plan most everyone can get behind. The MTA won't start making presentions to community boards until three months before the final plan is released. By then it will be too late. We have to start working now. I haven yet reviewed the plan in detail yet. There are probably a few good ideas in it, but from what I hear it is mostly back especially with long stretches of routes without bus stops. I hear they removed some very heavily used stops. Looks like they never even analyzed the data, but jus looked at a nap and are relying on the people who yell the most to determining which stops to put back. What an a**hole way to plan! I would guess 95 percent of the riders have no clue as to what is happening and half of them won't learn about the changes until ten days before they take affect when signs are posted on the buses. That is absolutely the problem... I remember when I went to one of the workshops. People were truly optimistic that the was trying to improve bus service.... Boy were they wrong... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N6 Limited Posted January 2, 2020 Share #264 Posted January 2, 2020 43 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said: Well that's a start.... I've already been around on social media and some people are praising this plan, saying oh I'll just have to walk a little further. They haven't even looked at it. Queens is extremely bus dependent, and it boggles my mind how passive Queens residents are about bus service. We shall see how much push back the will receive. We had a lot of push back in the Bronx when we advocated and informed people. What annoys me is people saying well we can't do anything, as if the is a private company. They are using tax payer dollars (PUBLIC money), and this is what they want to provide the public, which is anyone who pays taxes. It's outrageous. The planners are looking for feedback which is easy to give on the interactive Map. I think the Queens bus spaghetti map is in such a need of rehaul, that residents are willing to give this a chance to get around quicker and allow more connectivity. I like the plan so far, it addresses issues I've had with the network, especially connectivity. Currently, many routes are segregated, "I'll take you to Jamaica or Flushing and that's it, you'll have to transfer there to get anywhere else!" Hours of service can be addressed. 20 minutes ago, BrooklynBus said: And after the people get into their cars, the city will complain about increased traffic congestion and the MTA will praise the results claiming success because buses are running 1 mph faster. Sure, what's so hard about getting buses to run at 1 mph faster when you eliminate half the stops? What we have to do is organize a Facebook group like you did for Express bus routes to protest these changes and come up with an alternate plan most everyone can get behind. The MTA won't start making presentations to community boards until three months before the final plan is released. By then it will be too late. We have to start working now. I haven yet reviewed the plan in detail yet. There are probably a few good ideas in it, but from what I hear it is mostly back especially with long stretches of routes without bus stops. I hear they removed some very heavily used stops. Looks like they never even analyzed the data, but jus looked at a nap and are relying on the people who yell the most to determining which stops to put back. What an a**hole way to plan! I would guess 95 percent of the riders have no clue as to what is happening and half of them won't learn about the changes until ten days before they take affect when signs are posted on the buses. Seems like they're relying on feedback (which is somewhat good), but we know that MTA's hearings are held just to say they were held. They say that the planned stops are examples and are relying on feedback to make adjustments. Less stops = more parking, I wonder if they'll use that angle 😂 7 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said: That is absolutely the problem... I remember when I went to one of the workshops. People were truly optimistic that the was trying to improve bus service.... Boy were they wrong... Which aspects of the workshops did they realize that they were wrong about their optimism? Perhaps I'm falling into that trap? (Isn't this redesign outsourced? so maybe they are actually trying to improve the network?) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cait Sith Posted January 2, 2020 Share #265 Posted January 2, 2020 9 hours ago, N6 Limited said: When it's down for service is that the entire network, or individual branches? Usually when it's down between Jamaica & Federal Circle. When it's down for the rest of the network, they run shuttles from Jamaica to Federal Circle, and then other shuttles to separate terminals(one would run to Terminal 5/6, ect) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 2, 2020 Author Share #266 Posted January 2, 2020 1 hour ago, paulrivera said: Wait, not even whatever's replacing the Q20? This redesign's a borderline scam. At least the Bronx redesign maintained service spans and headways on the local side. Wasn't always like that. JFK was always on par with LGA, and once upon a time Airtrain was worth the money because it would show up every few minutes all the time. Saturday and Sunday is going to be a real chore for me to get to JFK no matter which way I go. The to Jamaica is infrequent (12 minutes), the Q14 is going to be infrequent (15-20 minutes), the out of Lefferts and Howard Beach are infrequent (20 minutes) , the Airtrain out of Jamaica and Howard Beach are infrequent (16 minutes), and I can't count on the Q44 after 9pm. Holy grail right there.... Yeah but $7.50 per ride? That's ridiculous. I'd rather leave early and take the Q10 then pay for an overpriced shuttle. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted January 2, 2020 Share #267 Posted January 2, 2020 4 minutes ago, N6 Limited said: The planners are looking for feedback which is easy to give on the interactive Map. I think the Queens bus spaghetti map is in such a need of rehaul, that residents are willing to give this a chance to get around quicker and allow more connectivity. I like the plan so far, it addresses issues I've had with the network, especially connectivity. Currently, many routes are segregated, "I'll take you to Jamaica or Flushing and that's it, you'll have to transfer there to get anywhere else!" Hours of service can be addressed. Seems like they're relying on feedback (which is somewhat good), but we know that MTA's hearings are held just to say they were held. They say that the planned stops are examples and are relying on feedback to make adjustments. Less stops = more parking, I wonder if they'll use that angle 😂 Which aspects of the workshops did they realize that they were wrong about their optimism? Perhaps I'm falling into that trap? (Isn't this redesign outsourced? so maybe they are actually trying to improve the network?) During the workshops, it was just asking people about their commutes. The didn't first released the routing, which wasn't terrible in some cases. The real kicker was the cuts to the spans in service. That was when people started to wake up. As far as Queens goes, I see a lot of problems with this re-design. I don't know how you can call this an improvement when some lines will stop running at 9:30 at night compared to midnight or longer. That is hours of service cut! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooklynBus Posted January 2, 2020 Share #268 Posted January 2, 2020 10 minutes ago, N6 Limited said: The planners are looking for feedback which is easy to give on the interactive Map. I think the Queens bus spaghetti map is in such a need of rehaul, that residents are willing to give this a chance to get around quicker and allow more connectivity. I like the plan so far, it addresses issues I've had with the network, especially connectivity. Currently, many routes are segregated, "I'll take you to Jamaica or Flushing and that's it, you'll have to transfer there to get anywhere else!" Hours of service can be addressed. Seems like they're relying on feedback (which is somewhat good), but we know that MTA's hearings are held just to say they were held. They say that the planned stops are examples and are relying on feedback to make adjustments. Less stops = more parking, I wonder if they'll use that angle 😂 Which aspects of the workshops did they realize that they were wrong about their optimism? Perhaps I'm falling into that trap? (Isn't this redesign outsourced? so maybe they are actually trying to improve the network?) Adding parking is politically incorrect these days. The city wants you to believe if they add parking, people will rush out and buy cars and congestion will increase. Some are too dumb to realize this is BS. That if they add parking congestion will be reduced because fewer car will be circling looking for parking spaces. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooklynBus Posted January 2, 2020 Share #269 Posted January 2, 2020 6 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said: During the workshops, it was just asking people about their commutes. The didn't first released the routing, which wasn't terrible in some cases. The real kicker was the cuts to the spans in service. That was when people started to wake up. As far as Queens goes, I see a lot of problems with this re-design. I don't know how you can call this an improvement when some lines will stop running at 9:30 at night compared to midnight or longer. That is hours of service cut! We need to force the MTA to provide existing and proposed service hours and miles so it is clear to everyone this is not Hang more than more service cuts disguised as improvements. There is no reason why to help a few you have to punish many. That is not an improvement but a bad plan destined to fail with further losses in patronage. You didn't answer my question about organzing people. Riders Alliance is good at that. Is there any way we can get them to realized this and help us? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted January 2, 2020 Share #270 Posted January 2, 2020 (edited) 48 minutes ago, BrooklynBus said: We need to force the MTA to provide existing and proposed service hours and miles so it is clear to everyone this is not Hang more than more service cuts disguised as improvements. There is no reason why to help a few you have to punish many. That is not an improvement but a bad plan destined to fail with further losses in patronage. You didn't answer my question about organzing people. Riders Alliance is good at that. Is there any way we can get them to realized this and help us? I organized on my own. When I first started the advocacy group, I reached out to the Riders Alliance about doing some things together. We've had a few conference calls as well. We agree fundamentally on a few things. They would be good particularly for the local buses. They have been advocating (and continue to advocate) for more funding for these redesigns. Edited January 2, 2020 by Via Garibaldi 8 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lex Posted January 2, 2020 Share #271 Posted January 2, 2020 (edited) 15 hours ago, JubaionBx12+SBS said: words For future reference, never invoke his name. You'll be eaten alive if you do. 14 hours ago, BM5 via Woodhaven said: "I am not going to look at the changes to the express buses, which are not an important part of the network anyway" Couldn't close the tab any faster. I know a lot of people may be anti-express bus for X reason (I've even heard the argument that it enforces racist institutions, outside this forum), but to say that express buses are not important in the Queens bus network is ignorant at best, and completely disingenuous at worst. Look, I'm not exactly a fan of the express buses (mostly because of the inherently higher costs of operation and, as a consequence, the affordability for anyone that lacks deep pockets), but am I glad that I never bothered to click the link. This guy's far more out of touch than the MTA... Edited January 2, 2020 by Lex 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted January 2, 2020 Share #272 Posted January 2, 2020 13 hours ago, BM5 via Woodhaven said: That was from Alon himself. It was in the second paragraph of his post. Who in the hell is Alon? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted January 2, 2020 Share #273 Posted January 2, 2020 (edited) 26 minutes ago, Lex said: For future reference, never invoke his name. You'll be eaten alive if you do. Look, I'm not exactly a fan of the express buses (mostly because of the inherently higher costs of operation and, as a consequence, the affordability for anyone that lacks deep pockets), but am I glad that I never bothered to click the link. This guy's far more out of touch than the MTA... If you have an issue with higher costs of operation then I suppose you aren't a fan of the new ferries or Metro-North or the LIRR. They all have high operating costs too... Prior to the City HIGHLY subsidizing the cost of the ferries, they were only really used by people with deep pockets, so when I hear that line used I laugh because the ignorance is mind boggling. Edited January 2, 2020 by Via Garibaldi 8 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
checkmatechamp13 Posted January 2, 2020 Share #274 Posted January 2, 2020 @N6 Limited What do you mean "outsourced"? My understanding is that this was done in-house with MTA planners (I know The Bronx and Staten Island express were in-house) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGA Link N Train Posted January 2, 2020 Share #275 Posted January 2, 2020 1 hour ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said: Who in the hell is Alon? Alon Levy. He blogs about Transit in a website called “pedestrianobservations.com” or something like that. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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