Megabus double deck coach slams into low rail bridge, 4 killed.

[Zman]

So let me get this straight:

 

The bridge can handle a full load of cars, lined up one after another, but with one school bus the bridge would collapse?

[Y2Julio]

That sign is easy to see, even in the dark. However, some people ignore signs. Once, I saw a full sized school bus on the Brooklyn Bridge. Thankfully, the bridge didn't collapse.

*facepalm* The Brooklyn Bridge has a load capacity of 18,700 tons (37,400,000 Lbs).

[SoSpectacular]

Heh, a rookie driver! There had to be some other option for getting off the highway besides smashing into a bridge, damn it!

[theaveragejoe]

agreed ive been on other transit forums and never and i mean never! have i seen members fight about this bull shoot this is a transit forum! where everyone can come together and discuss and heck if you trust the person enough you even meet them have lunch and enjoy fanning together, common guys lets just drop all of this, please.

 

 

and i was considering MEGABUS from Montreal to Toronto but im not sure either does MegaBus Canada have a bad safety record?

 

Trentway Wager (Coach Canada) has not really had any problems on its Toronto to Montreal Via Kingston Megabus service other then sometimes not all runs are covered by the Van Hools

[theaveragejoe]

Back on topic...I live in Syracuse. I work at one of the local TV stations here.

 

Here's what we know.

 

It appears the driver just missed the exit for the Syracuse Bus Station (Regional Transportation Center), and followed the Interstate 81 exit (its one of those 3 exit in one exits) for Onondaga Lake Parkway.

 

The bus (about 13 1/2 feet high) proceeded Northbound on Onondaga Lake Parkway toward an ancient train bridge with a clearance of 10-9.

 

The bus smashed into that bridge, killing four passengers. 27 passengers were on the bus.

 

 

 

The bus departed Philadelphia on Friday at 10:00 p.m. The destination was Toronto, with stops scheduled in Syracuse and Buffalo. The accident happened around 2:30am.

 

John Tomaszewski, the driver of the Megabus that crashed as been released from the hospital. He suffered head injuries in the accident. The Onondaga County Sheriff did not comment on what sort of information he has provided to the investigation.

 

Tomaszewski has been employed with Megabus since December 2009 and Philadelphia-Toronto is his regular route.

 

 

TROUBLED ROAD:

As many locals in Syracuse will tell you, the bridge that the bus driver smashed into is no stranger to truck accidents.

 

Saturday's accident is the most recent of eight accidents involving the bridge over the last five years. Many times, tractor-trailers accidentally get onto the highway, miss the 10+ warning signs, and their trailer gets ripped apart under the bridge.

 

 

In my opinion, one of the questions that has to be raised is, has the NYSDOT done enough to provide ample warning that the road is a parkway, and not suitable for buses.

 

Most warning signs say "CLEARANCE 10-9" and NO TRACTOR-TRAILERS.

 

Here's a look at the approach:

The driver should have taken the PARK STREET ramp. He missed it. It was the middle of the night, and he's likely now lost, off-route.

 

 

The warning signs before the entrance ramp to Onondaga Lake Parkway

 

 

The last ramp for the bus to get off and take another road, before the parkway. The bridge is about 1 mile away at this point.

 

 

A look at the bridge that the bus driver smashed into. The bridge is at such an angle, that the driver may have not seen it until he was a few hundred feet away, that is IF he ignored all the warnings signs.

 

Here's a link to the coverage we've done on this accident so far.

http://www.9wsyr.com/news/local/story/Firefighters-sort-through-deadly-Megabus-crash/LiNwgSPQkkyL0gzAwfLlJg.cspx

 

Right now, no criminal charges have been filed against the driver of the bus. After all the evidence is collected, the DA will look at the case.

 

 

 

Wow with all those pictures with those warning signs I can not see how the driver could have drove under that bridge

[theaveragejoe]

werent those just coach USA buses repainted tho ?

 

Yes Coach Canada has done the same on the new Toronto to Niagara Falls route

[theaveragejoe]

greyhound Canada is a reliable service with the exception of its sub company VCL ( Voyageur Coach Lines ) their Montreal Ottawa run is always backed up, never have enough buses and the employees are very rude, but riding GCL themselves i would give them 8/10

VCL = 4.5/10 at most

 

 

 

 

but i cant wait to ride this http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/9c/Kingston_Bus_Terminal.JPG/800px-Kingston_Bus_Terminal.JPG

 

Greyhound Canada has a huge bus shortage due to huge amount of buses being NIS due to work needed on them or good buses being sold off/retired. At all the garages they have buses tired up that need major work to get them back into service and the shop guys dont have time as they have been trying to keep the in service buses in service. Also it doesnt help that First Group hasnt really be investing in more new buses for Greyhound Canada except for a small order of Prevost and huge amount of ex Greyhound Lines MCI's (most of which are in bad shape)

[BklynBusMan08]

Latest news this morning:

- Megabus driver suspended without pay

- John Tomaszewski, 59, of Yardville, N.J., is expected to face a traffic violation of failure to obey traffic signs after the 2:30 a.m. crash, because he passed many warnings about the height of the bridge. Accident investigators are also researching if he can be charged with hitting the bridge itself

- While Tomaszewski said he was driving 35 mph, the GPS system showed he was going faster than that but under the speed limit of 55 mph

- Tomaszewski told investigators he was using GPS to find his way after missing the entrance to the Regional Transportation Center. But the GPS in the Megabus is equipped only to send data back to a company office and does not include any mapping software, said Don Carmichael, senior vice president of Coach USA, which owns Megabus.

- Tomaszewski was released Sunday night from Upstate University Hospital and returned home to New Jersey

 

http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2010/09/megabus_driver_suspended_witho.html

 

Anybody know the real deal about GPS on Megabus?

[buswizard]

Did you catch the fleet number of that bus? it was too far away to see in the picture. It looks like it's getting scrapped.

 

And he would DEFINITELY be going faster than 35 miles an hour because the damage wouldnt have been so severe if it was going that slow.

[BklynBusMan08]

The number on the back is DD090.

[buswizard]

HA!!!!! I wanted to see if I got a picture of that bus before its fate!!!! Click full size to see details such as license plate

[Zman]

Wow with all those pictures with those warning signs I can not see how the driver could have drove under that bridge

 

Driver fatigue. He probably didn't get a decent night's sleep and wasn't paying attention. After all, the accident happened at 2:30 AM.

[metsfan]

It should be noted that while they do offer 1 dollar fares, not everyone on board is paying $1, you can get up to 45 dollars if you book late.

 

Also, i agree the driver is at fault. Yes, you can have an obscured view from a tall vehicle in front of you, but if you're unfamiliar with a route, you don't follow that close or go so fast as to not be able to stop in time. The real question remains, why did this driver diverge from the route, and what can practically be done about it?

 

As far as no more double deck busses, i see no need to eliminate a product from the market if it's working as advertised. Besides, there are only a few places they can't go, all of them not located on any route that would be an issue. The park ave (NYC) and mccarter highway (PRR) viaducts come to mind for me, and not even standard height busses can fit under there till in the PRR case you get to newark penn, which was designed specifically to allow taller vehicles to pass under.

 

- A

[Cait Sith]

Update: Megabus driver was using personal GPS in crash that killed four on Onondaga Lake Parkway

 

Update: The driver of a Megabus was using a personal global positioning system when he crashed into the Onondaga Lake Parkway railroad bridge Saturday, killing four people, Sheriff Kevin Walsh said this morning.

 

Authorities were unclear until now if he had his own GPS, or was using a device built into the bus itself.

 

Company officials have said it violates policy for drivers to use any GPS devices while driving. -- 11:50 a.m.

 

Salina, NY -- The driver of a double-decker bus that crashed into a rail bridge Saturday on Onondaga Lake Parkway was removed from the road by Megabus and won’t be paid while authorities investigate the crash that killed four people, a company official said Monday.

 

John Tomaszewski, 59, of Yardville, N.J., is expected to face a traffic violation of failure to obey traffic signs after the 2:30 a.m. crash, because he passed many warnings about the height of the bridge. Accident investigators are also researching if he can be charged with hitting the bridge itself, Onondaga County Sheriff Kevin Walsh said.

 

But District Attorney William Fitzpatrick said he wouldn’t make any decision on charges until scientific testing is completed. That would include an accident reconstruction and testing on blood obtained from the bus driver, he said.

 

Walsh has said there was no apparent involvement of drugs or alcohol in the crash, but Fitzpatrick said that might have been difficult to know since the driver suffered a head injury.

 

Killed in the crash were former Camillus resident Deanna Armstrong, 18, of New Jersey; Kevin Coffey, 19, of Kansas; Ashwani Mehta, 34, of India; and Benjamin Okorie, 35, of Malaysia. Two others remained hospitalized locally: Lo Wah Chu, 55, of Pennsylvania, in critical condition at University Hospital, and Mabel Tabb, 79, in stable condition at Crouse Hospital. Another man, Carl Kerr, 51, was transferred from Crouse Hospital to a hospital near his hometown of Philadelphia.

 

A mystery emerged Monday about the role of a global positioning system in the crash.

 

Walsh said Tomaszewski told investigators he was using GPS to find his way after missing the entrance to the Regional Transportation Center. But the GPS in the Megabus is equipped only to send data back to a company office and does not include any mapping software, said Don Carmichael, senior vice president of Coach USA, which owns Megabus.

 

Any use of company or private GPS systems for directions by drivers is prohibited, Carmichael said. Investigators are still determining what Tomaszewski was doing.

 

While Tomaszewski said he was driving 35 mph, the GPS system showed he was going faster than that but under the speed limit of 55 mph, Carmichael said.

 

Tomaszewski has been “withheld from driving” without pay during the investigation, Carmichael said.

 

The state Department of Transportation, which operates the road and has taken responsibility for the safety measures on the parkway, refused to give interviews Monday.

 

Onondaga County Executive Joanie Mahoney sent a letter Monday to the Syracuse Metropolitan Transportation Council asking that the council immediately launch a safety study of the parkway, “with a specific focus on incidents like the one that occurred this past weekend.”

 

“While we recognize that no road in any jurisdiction can be made completely accident proof,” Mahoney wrote, “Saturday’s accident absolutely points to the fact that more can and should be done to make this corridor safer.”

 

Martin Skahen, speaking for Mahoney, said the parkway is a state road and the county has no formal involvement.

 

By Monday afternoon, all of the survivors who were not seriously injured in the crash had reached their destinations, Carmichael said. Coach USA made arrangements for some people to leave Syracuse Sunday and the rest left Monday, he said.

 

The company also provided transportation for relatives to visit those in the hospital. Travelers did not have to take Coach USA buses, but could take other transportation, such as air travel, Carmichael said.

 

Tomaszewski was released Sunday night from Upstate University Hospital and returned home to New Jersey, Carmichael said. Company officials had not yet questioned him at length about the crash.

 

Source: http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2010/09/megabus_driver_suspended_witho.html

[Locomotion69]

On google maps I just viewed the stretch of road and the bridge where the accident happened and you see a yellow school bus driving under that bridge. Looks like 1ft or less of clearance, school buses are around 9.6ft-10ft in height.

 

But the warning signs were big and in yellow, they should revoke his CDL at the very least.

[BZGuy]

This is what happens when guys buy TomToms and think they can get away with it. Personal GPSes will not keep commercial vehicles off of prohibited roads. Most drivers buy the personal GPSs because they are only like 100 bucks and commercial GPSs run 250-500 bucks.

 

That being said I think Mr. Tomaszewski's days of being a coach driver are over. As far a Megabus is concerned he's gone....4 dead,multiple injuries,a coach destroyed and the fact that this had made national news means there is no way they could keep him. Plus is name is out there, so I don't think any reputable company will touch him

 

Also, I think Megabus holds some responsiblity for what happened. I was still working for DATTCO when the TD925s were first introduced and I remember the VP for Motorcoach saying that only certain drivers would be trained for the DDs. Here Megabus is putting guys in the seat of a DD with a fresh CDL. I don't think that's smart....but that is just my opinion.

[metsfan]

This would be more effective and less of a hassle as far as low bridges. I don't know why there aren't more of these in MegaBus' fleet

 

 

That would have hit the bridge too. It was 12 feet.

 

- A

[Forest Glen]

I don't think anyone would've died since it only has a single level. However, that's not a reason to get rid of ALL TD 925's.

[RokuSix]

Obviously a case of either bad judgment or some other sort of issue. Not a reflection on the entire company, but perhaps the company should train drivers better?

[SevenEleven]

I don't think anyone would've died since it only has a single level. However, that's not a reason to get rid of ALL TD 925's.

 

Not necessarily, you can still get killed by the flying debris and glass.

[TransitStop]

the question i still would like to know is what is their stand on training operators do they train them 6 weeks ( which i think is standard for OC Transpo double deckers ) or is it just " your bus is this tall that bridge is that tall..... dont go under that bridge"

[Paul P]

No thanks, I'll take the train.

[NovaBUSRTS9145]

This would be more effective and less of a hassle as far as low bridges. I don't know why there aren't more of these in MegaBus' fleet

 

When they first started here in NYC, all they had was D4505s! AS time went on, they sent the 4505s to Olympia, which is now used for airport service, and bought them Double Deckers, which i must say, are HORRIBLE for big people...I am a tall guy, and those buses are VERy uncomfortable for big people.....the drivers they have are horrible, the buses themselves look horrible....they're just bad! i would never use them again unless I had no other alternative!

[Grand Concourse]

I'm 5' 9" and the 2nd level of a DD bus = head bumper. They need to be a bit taller to accomodate even average height people. I'm no expert, but I just don't think I'd want to ride them on the highway.

[w8Hou]

I'm 5' 9" and the 2nd level of a DD bus = head bumper. They need to be a bit taller to accomodate even average height people. I'm no expert, but I just don't think I'd want to ride them on the highway.

 

There is a taller US dd bus maker called Alexander Dennis' Enviro500... 14 feet high. Can not make it on river tunnels in NY area or the els.

 

It is much better bus then Van Hools.