R179 Discussion Thread

[MysteriousBtrain]

24 minutes ago, Coney Island Av said:

Until I can verify this info from either @Dj Hammers or @RR503, I'm gonna take this with a huge grain of salt. 

 

11 hours ago, mine248 said:

Source? Lmao sure kinda sounds like that M8 situation with the two derailed cars. 

There's a reason why I said this was a rumor. There is no proof that there will be another 3015-3019 built. Also don't always expect the people who always give out news to deliver it right away.

[darkstar8983]

2 hours ago, Coney Island Av said:

Until I can verify this info from either @Dj Hammers or @RR503, I'm gonna take this with a huge grain of salt. I simply cannot believe this information because AFAIK, they're only at Bombardier for modifications, and not to be replaced. 

3020-3029 won't arrive until 3010-3019 conclude testing and all four-car sets are on property. The latter is a test train, while the former is a production car set. And in order for the production cars to be delivered, the test train has to pass 30-day testing. 

However, in the case of 3050-3057 and 3058-3065, both were considered test trains. If 3020-3029 was really considered a test train, it would've been on property by now. 

Anyways, in other R179-related news:

-3074-3077 and 3126-3129 are now in regular  service, which means 10 R179s in  service. 

-3130-3133 are gonna head to the Rockaways for testing soon.

-The R32s/R42s on the  will leave by September due to the fact that there are very few of them in service, and the R179s are coming in fast. 

P.S. The R46s on the  will leave for the  by the end of the year because the Jamaica-Coney Island swap will be happening soon. 

Thats terrible news regarding the removal of the R46s from Jamaica to the . Guess I'll have to start walking everywhere. So much for wasting money renovating the Astoria Line stations to give those routes one of the oldest and most unreliable cars in the system. 

Edited July 28, 2018 by darkstar8983

[Around the Horn]

2 hours ago, Coney Island Av said:

3020-3029 won't arrive until 3010-3019 conclude testing and all four-car sets are on property. The latter is a test train, while the former is a production car set. And in order for the production cars to be delivered, the test train has to pass 30-day testing. 

However, in the case of 3050-3057 and 3058-3065, both were considered test trains. If 3020-3029 was really considered a test train, it would've been on property by now. 

I wouldn't be so quick to say that... As long as 3058-3065 passed (as it did), they can deliver production cars of any type. They are choosing to deliver the 8 cars first since they need to make the  all NTT as soon as possible.

[RR503]

15 minutes ago, darkstar8983 said:

Thats terrible news regarding the removal of the R46s from Jamaica to the . Guess I'll have to start walking everywhere. So much for wasting money renovating the Astoria Line stations to give those routes one of the oldest and most unreliable cars in the system. 

A shame you avoid a line on some highly distorted notion of subway performance... As I and many others have said before, an almost irrelevant percentage of late trains are charged to car equipment.

I actually think that the 46s are perfect for the . Those lines don’t have the volume to justify 60’ equipment, but fluidity at Ditmars would certainly be helped with the exclusion of our rollsigned fleet. 46s meet all those requirements, and sure, they’re not 160s, but those are more needed elsewhere. 

[Railfan 007]

 

2 hours ago, Coney Island Av said:

3020-3029 won't arrive until 3010-3019 conclude testing and all four-car sets are on property. The latter is a test train, while the former is a production car set. And in order for the production cars to be delivered, the test train has to pass 30-day testing. 

However, in the case of 3050-3057 and 3058-3065, both were considered test trains. If 3020-3029 was really considered a test train, it would've been on property by now. 

Learned something new today, that there are 3 test sets, 2 8-car sets and 1 10-car set. Thanks

2 hours ago, Coney Island Av said:

3074-3077 and 3126-3129 are now in regular  service, which means 10 R179s in service. 

Speaking of which here is a video of this set running as a 

 

[LGA Link N Train]

31 minutes ago, darkstar8983 said:

Thats terrible news regarding the removal of the R46s from Jamaica to the . Guess I'll have to start walking everywhere. So much for wasting money renovating the Astoria Line stations to give those routes one of the oldest and most unreliable cars in the system. 

Geez, it's just a fleet of subway cars. Why make a big fuss over R46's on the and , either you can suck it up and deal with it or don't take the subway at all. Besides,we'll never know if R211's make it to the and

[Around the Horn]

I mean he's kinda got a point because a good number of the Jamaica ones are in pretty bad shape. If they were getting Pitkin ones, I'd say that his concern is unwarranted because those seem to be in better shape.

[Around the Horn]

36 minutes ago, darkstar8983 said:

So much for wasting money renovating the Astoria Line stations to give those routes one of the oldest and most unreliable cars in the system. 

Did they waste money on doing the  stations too since they've had R46s on the line for decades?

[darkstar8983]

30 minutes ago, Around the Horn said:

Did they waste money on doing the  stations too since they've had R46s on the line for decades?

actually they did waste money, just as Cuomo has wasted billions on "beautifying NYC" rather than address actual issues. Those stations along 4 Av were not in such bad shape.

[darkstar8983]

34 minutes ago, LaGuardia Link N Tra said:

Geez, it's just a fleet of subway cars. Why make a big fuss over R46's on the and , either you can suck it up and deal with it or don't take the subway at all. Besides,we'll never know if R211's make it to the and

Why can't they just wait an extra year for the R211s and outright retire the R46s from Jamaica and Pitkin? Makes much better sense

[darkstar8983]

56 minutes ago, RR503 said:

A shame you avoid a line on some highly distorted notion of subway performance... As I and many others have said before, an almost irrelevant percentage of late trains are charged to car equipment.

I actually think that the 46s are perfect for the . Those lines don’t have the volume to justify 60’ equipment, but fluidity at Ditmars would certainly be helped with the exclusion of our rollsigned fleet. 46s meet all those requirements, and sure, they’re not 160s, but those are more needed elsewhere. 

only the Queens Blvd Express is in absolute need of CBTC, not the local, so I think Jamaica can live with just the R160s they've got. 

Actually they do need as many R160s in Astoria because of the capacity constraints the  have. 

- fleet shortage

- Manhattan Bridge/Dekalb Junction (only 10  trains per hour because it has to share with the )

- Whitehall St as a terrible terminal (only 6 tph)

- Ditmars Blvd cannot reverse more than 14 tph

*Service cannot be increased in Astoria, so 60 foot cars are a must. Have you even ridden the  ? Literally, the least crowded Manhattan NON-shuttle line in the system

Edited July 28, 2018 by darkstar8983

[subwaycommuter1983]

1 hour ago, darkstar8983 said:

Thats terrible news regarding the removal of the R46s from Jamaica to the . Guess I'll have to start walking everywhere. So much for wasting money renovating the Astoria Line stations to give those routes one of the oldest and most unreliable cars in the system. 

FYI CPW is getting the same renovations and the oldest and most unreliable routes run on some of those lines. I don't think it's a bad idea to see r46's running on the Astoria line. However, this is a tentative plan.

If the r46's go to the N/W, it should come from the A/C. The A needs more 60ft and needs newer trains due to 8th Avenue becoming CTBC within the next five years. And lets not forget the MTA ''s bad decision of not ordering enough 10 car r179's.

3 hours ago, R68OnBroadway said:

No R46s will go to the  (as far as I know), and the R42s will kept as a reserve fleet until the  shutdown ends.

Bingo!! I knew that was going to happen with the r42's.

Edited July 28, 2018 by subwaycommuter1983

[S78 via Hylan]

Alright, let’s not turn this into the “Coney Island-Jamaica fleet swap” thread.

[LGA Link N Train]

1 hour ago, darkstar8983 said:

Why can't they just wait an extra year for the R211s and outright retire the R46s from Jamaica and Pitkin? Makes much better sense

Cause then we'll be with a fleet shortage. Just remember that at the end of the day, THEY'RE JUST TRAINS!

55 minutes ago, S78 via Hylan said:

Alright, let’s not turn this into the “Coney Island-Jamaica fleet swap” thread.

you mean the "Canarsie Shutdown Fleet Swap Thread" 

[subwaycommuter1983]

25 minutes ago, LaGuardia Link N Tra said:

You mean the "Canarsie Shutdown Fleet Swap Thread" 

The only thing that has been officially confirmed by the MTA is the C and G being full length and the M getting 50 additional cars. Everything else is tentative!!!

1 hour ago, S78 via Hylan said:

Alright, let’s not turn this into the “Coney Island-Jamaica fleet swap” thread.

How is this related to Canarsie???

Did everyone forget about 8th Avenue being CTBC?? And it's going to happen pretty much at the same time as QBL, thanks to Byford.

Right now, Canarsie shutdown has more priority and any fleet swap has to be related to this construction.

[subwaycommuter1983]

It's a possibility. The Q has r46'. Why??

In terms of CTBC fleet swap, nothing has been confirmed by the MTA. The only thing confirmed is that QBL, 8th Avenue and other parts of the subway will be CTBC within the next five years. 

I'm assuming that any fleet swaps happening within the next few weeks and months is related to the r179 and Canarsie.

[subwaycommuter1983]

For those who are speculating about CTBC related fleet swap read the article:

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/22/nyregion/nyc-subway-byford-proposal.html

In the event that the N, Q, W loses all r160's, some would go to Jamaica, some would go to Pitkin. Also, the 2 may lose their r142's in exchange of the r62s from the 6 and all r142's may need to be modified to be CTBC ready.

Lets see what happens. Again, nothing has been confirmed by the MTA in regards to CTBC fleet swap.

Right now the priority is the r179's and Canarsie.

[R32 3838]

The R42's are going to the , the will be R42,R46 and R68.

The R46's are gonna be on the and  as well.

The R32's are going to be only on the and lines. 

Im glad the is keeping some R32's, with the R179's the will have a decent balance of 60 foot cars.

I just hope they don't f**k the over and give those R179's to the or lines instead.

 

[mine248]

43 minutes ago, R32 3838 said:

The R42's are going to the , the will be R42,R46 and R68.

The R46's are gonna be on the and  as well.

The R32's are going to be only on the and lines. 

Im glad the is keeping some R32's, with the R179's the will have a decent balance of 60 foot cars.

I just hope they don't f**k the over and give those R179's to the or lines instead.

 

They better not....the (A) needs more capacity to handle the L crush. 

[subwaycommuter1983]

3 hours ago, Vtrain said:

When the Canarsie Tube reopens in Spring 2020, is the G train going to remain with the R160 cars (4 car/8 car train) & the L train remaining with all of the R143 & 64 R160 (4car/8 car trains) , the J/Z lines getting all the R179 (4 car/8 car trains) & some R160 (4 car/8 car train) & the M train still using the R160 (4car/8 car trains).

Yes, and the r32's will start to retire, the r42's will be history, and the r211s will start coming.

53 minutes ago, R32 3838 said:

The R42's are going to the , the will be R42,R46 and R68.

The R46's are gonna be on the and  as well.

The R32's are going to be only on the and lines. 

Im glad the is keeping some R32's, with the R179's the will have a decent balance of 60 foot cars.

I just hope they don't f**k the over and give those R179's to the or lines instead.

 

Lets see what happens. With Byfords New plan, things may change in terms of car assignments. Don't be surprised if these were the Canarsie shutdown car assignments:

J/Z: r179's

M: r160's

L: r143s

G: r160's, r32's

N, Q, W: r46s

A: r160's, r179's, r32's

R: r160's

😄

C : r46s and any leftover 10 car r160's.

Again let's see what happens. The important thing right now is the delivery of the r179's.

Edited July 29, 2018 by subwaycommuter1983

[FlushingExpress]

23 hours ago, Coney Island Av said:

. P.S. The R46s on the  will leave for the  by the end of the year because the Jamaica-Coney Island swap will be happening soon. 

I just love how people keep bringing up this dumb rumored swap, yet never provide a reliable source for it, and no, what comes out of a transit worker's mouth is not a reliable source. They are not psychics and cannot see the future

21 hours ago, darkstar8983 said:

Thats terrible news regarding the removal of the R46s from Jamaica to the . Guess I'll have to start walking everywhere. So much for wasting money renovating the Astoria Line stations to give those routes one of the oldest and most unreliable cars in the system. 

Yeah, I still avoid riding the R42s as much as possible due to my strong hate for them. Thankfully there are only 50 of those rusted tin cans and will be retired once all R179s are in service.

21 hours ago, RR503 said:

A shame you avoid a line on some highly distorted notion of subway performance... As I and many others have said before, an almost irrelevant percentage of late trains are charged to car equipment.

I actually think that the 46s are perfect for the . Those lines don’t have the volume to justify 60’ equipment, but fluidity at Ditmars would certainly be helped with the exclusion of our rollsigned fleet. 46s meet all those requirements, and sure, they’re not 160s, but those are more needed elsewhere. 

"Those lines don’t have the volume to justify 60’ equipment" Oh really? ride them yourself and you will they have way more ridership than the A, C, J/Z, M and R, especially on the Astoria Line, they will not want their awesome R160s replaced by fat old junks.

20 hours ago, darkstar8983 said:

Why can't they just wait an extra year for the R211s and outright retire the R46s from Jamaica and Pitkin? Makes much better sense

They will as CBTC on Queens Boulevard will not be ready for another 5-6 years. I love how everything thinks it will go off without a hitch, yet CBTC on Flushing and Canarsie were well over 4 years behind schedule. If the ultimate goal was for Jamaica to be all R160s, someone please explain why Jamaica has been persistently giving Coney Island its R160s over the past 7 years?

20 hours ago, darkstar8983 said:

only the Queens Blvd Express is in absolute need of CBTC, not the local, so I think Jamaica can live with just the R160s they've got. 

Actually they do need as many R160s in Astoria because of the capacity constraints the  have. 

- fleet shortage

- Manhattan Bridge/Dekalb Junction (only 10  trains per hour because it has to share with the )

- Whitehall St as a terrible terminal (only 6 tph)

- Ditmars Blvd cannot reverse more than 14 tph

*Service cannot be increased in Astoria, so 60 foot cars are a must. Have you even ridden the  ? Literally, the least crowded Manhattan NON-shuttle line in the system

Yep, hence it's dumb to give the fat R46s to the N/W when they have way more ridership than the R, though I would call an R46 on the W "Wario" because he wears yellow and has a black mustache (like the W logo) and is incredibly fat like an R46. Non CBTC equipment can still run on CBTC activated lines, hence it is not really urgent for the R to get R160s right now anyway. The F uses about 7-8 sets of R46s right now, so the five-car R179s can go to Coney Island, who will send enough R160s to Jamaica to make just the F all R160s.

 

16 hours ago, subwaycommuter1983 said:

For those who are speculating about CTBC related fleet swap read the article:

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/22/nyregion/nyc-subway-byford-proposal.html

In the event that the N, Q, W loses all r160's, some would go to Jamaica, some would go to Pitkin. Also, the 2 may lose their r142's in exchange of the r62s from the 6 and all r142's may need to be modified to be CTBC ready.

Lets see what happens. Again, nothing has been confirmed by the MTA in regards to CTBC fleet swap.

Right now the priority is the r179's and Canarsie.

R142s to the 6 and R62As to the 2? That would be a blessing considering how horrible the 6 has been since the crappy R62As took over.

12 hours ago, R32 3838 said:

The R42's are going to the , the will be R42,R46 and R68.

The R46's are gonna be on the and  as well.

The R32's are going to be only on the and lines. 

Im glad the is keeping some R32's, with the R179's the will have a decent balance of 60 foot cars.

I just hope they don't f**k the over and give those R179's to the or lines instead.

 

 

11 hours ago, mine248 said:

They better not....the (A) needs more capacity to handle the L crush. 

If Coney Island gives R160s to Jamaica, it better get all the five-car R179s in their place as the NTTs are the only cars that can handle the heavy loads along Brighton and 2nd Avenue on the Q, not to mention no SMEEs have the 96th Street rollsigns or programs and R46s cannot run on the northbound local track of Brighton due to residential complaints about noise and vibrations. I just love how people are such hypocrites, saying 60 footers are badly needed for the A because of crowding, yet 75 footers will do well on the more crowded N and Q trains, or how R68/68As will do well on the Q because it has the same terminals 24/7, but are horrible on the G even though it too has the same terminals 24/7. Reminds me of the time R32 3838 said on Facebook that when the G was transferred to Coney Island in 2011, it should have gotten R160s instead of R68/68As, which would have been dumb as the N needed the R160s more, being that it has way more ridership than the G and allowed Astoria to maintain a full R160 fleet. If all what he said is true, Coney Island would have too many different car types to handle. East New York has been complaining about that issue, which is why they are so happy the R32s and R42s will soon be off the J/Z. 

[subwaycommuter1983]

Another possible car assignments based on Canarsie and Byford's new plan:

A: r160's, r179's, r32's
B: r68's, r32's (MTAs plan for additional service)
😄

C : r46's, r160's (10 car)
😧

D : r68's plus r68's displaced from G (MTAs plan for additional service)
G: r160's, r32's
J/Z: r179's
L: r143's
M: r160's
N/Q/W: r46's
R: r160's, r46's

This is just a tentative plan. May or may not happen.
Most of the information that has been shared and discussed in this forum is subject to change due to Byford's plan and other factors that may arise. 
Remember the only information that is 100% confirmed by the MTA is the C and G being full length and the M getting 50 additional cars.

PS: ignore the emojis. They appeared by accident.

Edited July 29, 2018 by subwaycommuter1983

[RR503]

Alright, enough.

First off, QBL CBTC cannot be done just on the express or local tracks. If it could be, it still wouldn't be, as no service planner not high as Mount Kilimanjaro would want to have a situation where a local train couldn't run on the express tracks in the case of a service disruption. 

QBL CBTC is also not that far off. 2021 is the planned date of full cutover, and it has been publicly stated that the TA wants the 160s 100% equipped by 2020 so that part time/part route testing can commence. For those of you who can't math, 6/2020 is before the planned completion date of Canarsie, requiring that cars are positioned there for equipment installation and testing during the shutdown. And yes, there is a good chance CBTC will be delayed, but I really think that complaining about CBTC delays and then arguing against fleet positioning integral to the preservation of the CBTC schedule is extremely disingenuous.

Point being, the Jamaica/CI swap is not optional. When exactly it'll happen is yet to be determined, but there is no discussion here. The cars have to move. 

[subwaycommuter1983]

37 minutes ago, RR503 said:

QBL CBTC is also not that far off. 2021 is the planned date of full cutover, and it has been publicly stated that the TA wants the 160s 100% equipped by 2020 so that part time/part route testing can commence. 

That announcement was made prior to Byfords plan of making 8th Avenue and Lexington Avenue CTBC within the next five years. Work already has started on those lines as well.

This means that the 10 car r179's and all r142's will need modifications to become CTBC and don't be surprised if there is a fleet swap between the 2 and 6 trains.

Lets see what happens. There is a possibility that the C and R trains will get r160's, but will have to wait for the r211's for them to be completely NTT and for CTBC to be completed in QBL and 8th Avenue.

[U-BahnNYC]

On 7/28/2018 at 6:48 PM, Around the Horn said:

I mean he's kinda got a point because a good number of the Jamaica ones are in pretty bad shape. If they were getting Pitkin ones, I'd say that his concern is unwarranted because those seem to be in better shape.

I would think it's the other way around... Pitkin R46s are in disrepair compared to Jamaica's.