IAlam Posted January 14, 2023 Share #2401 Posted January 14, 2023 16 minutes ago, mfs NJT459 said: PTC is already installed, it’s just a software update on the DE/DM 30 AC locomotives, Multilevel Cab cars that will prevent them from entering the tunnels Really, was that whole waiver thing for? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 14, 2023 Share #2402 Posted January 14, 2023 11 hours ago, mfs NJT459 said: PTC is already installed, it’s just a software update on the DE/DM 30 AC locomotives, Multilevel Cab cars that will prevent them from entering the tunnels Your telling me all those notices, signals, switches, etc etc isn't enough to tell them to not go in there? LMAO 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xD4nn Posted January 14, 2023 Share #2403 Posted January 14, 2023 7 hours ago, Lawrence St said: Your telling me all those notices, signals, switches, etc etc isn't enough to tell them to not go in there? LMAO The FRA requires this kind of system to be installed. For example, this system is installed on NYAR locomotives. It prevents NYAR locomotives from entering zone 1. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xD4nn Posted January 14, 2023 Share #2404 Posted January 14, 2023 19 hours ago, IAlam said: I wonder if they're fully installing PTC before they open it this time, since they missed the deadline there's no reason to rush and start the shuttle. There still is a rush. They want to open as soon as possible. They are following all FRA orders so I does not matter. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N6 Limited Posted January 15, 2023 Share #2405 Posted January 15, 2023 On 1/13/2023 at 7:21 AM, Lawrence St said: On another note, yesterday a lot of trains kept getting late from the amount of crowds getting to Elmont-USB. The rational for refusing to run Belmont Park service is starting to become an issue. Select trains were 15-20 minutes late yesterday from the crowds. Eastbound or westbound trains? Do you know which branches? And where were the crowds coming from? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
checkmatechamp13 Posted January 15, 2023 Share #2406 Posted January 15, 2023 17 hours ago, xD4nn said: There still is a rush. They want to open as soon as possible. They are following all FRA orders so I does not matter. I think the waiver expires 2/15/23 if I'm not mistaken. So if the date is anything past that point they need to have the full system installed. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 15, 2023 Share #2407 Posted January 15, 2023 13 hours ago, N6 Limited said: Eastbound or westbound trains? Do you know which branches? And where were the crowds coming from? Westbound, it was PJ and RK from USB-Elmont. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N6 Limited Posted January 15, 2023 Share #2408 Posted January 15, 2023 1 hour ago, Lawrence St said: Westbound, it was PJ and RK from USB-Elmont. That would support their rationale, no? Service to Belmont Park ran a shuttle from Jamaica, and would not be a “local fare” to those coming from the east. If the passengers had to back track, they’d probably just drive. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 15, 2023 Share #2409 Posted January 15, 2023 1 minute ago, N6 Limited said: That would support their rationale, no? Service to Belmont Park ran a shuttle from Jamaica, and would not be a “local fare” to those coming from the east. If the passengers had to back track, they’d probably just drive. At the expense of others who need to do timed transfer connections? Not really. If I was a commuter I’d be mad if I missed the last bus of the night because my train was 15 min late from USB arena crowds. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
checkmatechamp13 Posted January 15, 2023 Share #2410 Posted January 15, 2023 1 hour ago, Lawrence St said: At the expense of others who need to do timed transfer connections? Not really. If I was a commuter I’d be mad if I missed the last bus of the night because my train was 15 min late from USB arena crowds. What are you talking about? Are you seriously saying that people are selfish for choosing to use mass transit to get to/from the arena? Maybe you'd prefer that they drive so that people on the n6 can get stuck in even more traffic and miss even more of their connections. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 15, 2023 Share #2411 Posted January 15, 2023 20 minutes ago, checkmatechamp13 said: What are you talking about? Are you seriously saying that people are selfish for choosing to use mass transit to get to/from the arena? Maybe you'd prefer that they drive so that people on the n6 can get stuck in even more traffic and miss even more of their connections. That’s not what I’m saying at all. I’m saying I would be mad at for not running the Belmont Park shuttles and having the crowds delay mainline trains. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lex Posted January 15, 2023 Share #2412 Posted January 15, 2023 2 hours ago, Lawrence St said: That’s not what I’m saying at all. I’m saying I would be mad at for not running the Belmont Park shuttles and having the crowds delay mainline trains. Earlier, you (basically) stated that the trains experiencing delays were westbound trains from Suffolk County. How would running those shuttles help if they don't even run east of the Queens/Nassau border? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 16, 2023 Share #2413 Posted January 16, 2023 38 minutes ago, Lex said: Earlier, you (basically) stated that the trains experiencing delays were westbound trains from Suffolk County. How would running those shuttles help if they don't even run east of the Queens/Nassau border? Because crowds would use Belmont Park and the Belmont Specials instead of crowding up Elmont-USB and delaying mainline trains operating west into NYC. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lex Posted January 16, 2023 Share #2414 Posted January 16, 2023 18 minutes ago, Lawrence St said: Because crowds would use Belmont Park and the Belmont Specials instead of crowding up Elmont-USB and delaying mainline trains operating west into NYC. And how would they do that from the east? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 16, 2023 Share #2415 Posted January 16, 2023 Just now, Lex said: And how would they do that from the east? I’m confused, where did East come from? The crowds were going to or from Belmont Park. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 16, 2023 Share #2416 Posted January 16, 2023 Wait I just realized, RK & PJ trains don’t stop at Elmont, so how they heck are they delayed? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted January 16, 2023 Share #2417 Posted January 16, 2023 1 hour ago, Lawrence St said: Wait I just realized, RK & PJ trains don’t stop at Elmont, so how they heck are they delayed? (Certain) Ronkonkoma and PJ Branch trains stop have been stopping at Elmont in both directions since November... Also, Elmont receives decent usage from Main Line trains that stop there from what I've seen. Those people would need to backtrack to Jamaica if there wasn't a stop at Elmont. 6 hours ago, Lawrence St said: That’s not what I’m saying at all. I’m saying I would be mad at for not running the Belmont Park shuttles and having the crowds delay mainline trains. Ironically, running Belmont Park shuttles would also delay Main Line trains, and I'd argue even worse than. There's limitations to the speed and tph in the Belmont Spur because of the signal type and configuration. And those slow speeds coming out of Belmont Park and onto the Main Line would loom disastrous to OTP. There's a reason why there's only one event a year where they actually run full fledged service (Belmont Stakes). IINM it's only because of NYRA funds service. IDK if you're aware how service operates on that day, but the Hempstead Branch is reduced to bi-hourly as it uses one track (for trains from Belmont Park to layup). Also, Main Line branches use only use the northernmost two tracks, while Belmont Park trains use the southernmost two tracks, this avoiding any conflict in that section. Even then, eastbound Hempstead Branch trains have to skip Hollis Queens Village, and there may still be delays near Jamaica (although not as bad as if it was east of Queens Village). You're just moving the choke point to a different location. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xD4nn Posted January 16, 2023 Share #2418 Posted January 16, 2023 On 1/15/2023 at 3:56 PM, Lawrence St said: That’s not what I’m saying at all. I’m saying I would be mad at for not running the Belmont Park shuttles and having the crowds delay mainline trains. I have stated this before... Belmont Park shuttles are extremely hard to run. Running mass amounts of BP Shuttle trains requires Hempstead to be shut down which is not very reasonable... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danielhg121 Posted January 17, 2023 Share #2419 Posted January 17, 2023 Just curious, why is there a Train 698 but all the other PJ trains are usually low 600's or 650-672 around those ballparks. What makes Train 698 special? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jsunflyguy Posted January 17, 2023 Share #2420 Posted January 17, 2023 12 minutes ago, danielhg121 said: Just curious, why is there a Train 698 but all the other PJ trains are usually low 600's or 650-672 around those ballparks. What makes Train 698 special? It used to be trained 666, but someone didn't like the number so it was changed to the next available one. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 18, 2023 Share #2421 Posted January 18, 2023 I have a operating question, what exactly is the story with MNRR's west of hudson lines? Does MNRR own them up to the state line? If so, why is Suffern the only exception? And why does NJT operate the whole thing when it's MNRR branded & owned? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted January 19, 2023 Share #2422 Posted January 19, 2023 1 hour ago, Lawrence St said: I have a operating question, what exactly is the story with MNRR's west of hudson lines? Does MNRR own them up to the state line? If so, why is Suffern the only exception? And why does NJT operate the whole thing when it's MNRR branded & owned? Quote The line is operated by NJ Transit Rail Operations under a working agreement with Metro-North Railroad (MNRR). Norfolk Southern Railway (NS) shares the use of the track for local freight operations between Suffern and Port Jervis. The New York, Susquehanna and Western Railway operates over the line between Hudson Junction (east of Campbell Hall) and Port Jervis, and onward to Binghamton over the former Erie Railroad Delaware Division (now the Central New York Railroad). The tracks have been owned by NS since the 1999 split of Conrail, but were built by the Erie and incorporated into Conrail on its formation on April 1, 1976. Metro-North leased the entire line from NS in 2003, with the possibility of outright purchase after 2006. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_Jervis_Line Not that long ago, Metro-North threatened to eliminate all service unless it received more funding, which would've been a serious blow to residents that use the service. For years there has been a push to extend the rail service, but Metro-North has resisted. This is one reason that elected officials in that area are vehemently opposed to congestion pricing because they argue that they already have limited transit options as it is and some of their residents have no choice but to drive into Manhattan. Others that aren't near any West of Hudson service drive into Westchester and take either the Hudson Line or the Harlem line. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xD4nn Posted January 19, 2023 Share #2423 Posted January 19, 2023 3 hours ago, Lawrence St said: I have a operating question, what exactly is the story with MNRR's west of hudson lines? Does MNRR own them up to the state line? If so, why is Suffern the only exception? And why does NJT operate the whole thing when it's MNRR branded & owned? MNRR owns the trackage and station in New York. MNRR contracts NJT to run it since it is much easier that way and much cheaper. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QM1to6Ave Posted January 19, 2023 Share #2424 Posted January 19, 2023 55 minutes ago, xD4nn said: MNRR owns the trackage and station in New York. MNRR contracts NJT to run it since it is much easier that way and much cheaper. Has NJT ever tried to buy it off of MNRR? Seems like they could make more money if they own it outright 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrence St Posted January 19, 2023 Share #2425 Posted January 19, 2023 7 hours ago, xD4nn said: MNRR owns the trackage and station in New York. MNRR contracts NJT to run it since it is much easier that way and much cheaper. Why is Suffern in NY but not owned by MNR? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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