BM5 via Woodhaven Posted October 26, 2015 Share #3751 Posted October 26, 2015 (edited) Good points. Still think the B39 can benefit from some form of extension, even if it's just to be a Delancey/Kenmore mini crosstown. It was part of the B44 until some point in time. You can only imagine how unreliable that service could've been with the plethora of congestion points along the route. B39's tend to run behind schedule at times too. As for the B71, I didn't like its eastern end, kinda random if you ask me. IDK if the B45 needs help or not along St Johns Place, but I would extend it to Brownsville via St Johns place east of Franklin Avenue. If not, the B71 should end at Grand Army Plaza (if brought back). As for a B71 to South Ferry, I'm really 50/50 with that one. Edited October 26, 2015 by BM5 via Woodhaven 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted October 26, 2015 Share #3752 Posted October 26, 2015 It was part of the B44 until some point in time. You can only imagine how unreliable that service could've been with the plethora of congestion points along the route. B39's tend to run behind schedule at times too. The B39 runs on crap headways, and what for it's worth, not too many buses are running on-time these days anyway, so that doesn't say much overall. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MysteriousBtrain Posted October 26, 2015 Share #3753 Posted October 26, 2015 It was part of the B44 until some point in time. You can only imagine how unreliable that service could've been with the plethora of congestion points along the route. B39's tend to run behind schedue eat times too. I'm not asking for a major extension, but maybe a little bit more crosstown in Manhattan. As for the B71, I didn't like its eastern end, kinda random if you ask me. IDK if the B45 needs help or not along St Johns Place, but I would extend it to Brownsville via St Johns place east of Franklin Avenue. If not, the B71 should end at Grand Army Plaza (if brought back). As for a B71 to South Ferry, I'm really 50/50 with that one. As VG8 said, he posted an article about a revived B71. The eastern end seemed to be tampered with. I feel like the B71 should use Eastern Parkway til Ralph ave if there is no extension to south ferry. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted October 26, 2015 Share #3754 Posted October 26, 2015 It was part of the B44 until some point in time. You can only imagine how unreliable that service could've been with the plethora of congestion points along the route. B39's tend to run behind schedule at times too. As for the B71, I didn't like its eastern end, kinda random if you ask me. IDK if the B45 needs help or not along St Johns Place, but I would extend it to Brownsville via St Johns place east of Franklin Avenue. If not, the B71 should end at Grand Army Plaza (if brought back). As for a B71 to South Ferry, I'm really 50/50 with that one. Why Grand Army Plaza? That's not a place that I would end a bus at. It may seem like it's in the middle of something but it really isn't. The proposed B71 revival makes more sense, given the commercial activity happening and the places folks could go with it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted October 26, 2015 Share #3755 Posted October 26, 2015 I'm not asking for a major extension, but maybe a little bit more crosstown in Manhattan. Any extension would require at least one extra bus, because that schedule is tight as it is now. Even an extension one block down would require a second bus. I don't see extending it in Manhattan as an improvement at all; ridership wouldn't really increase much. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted October 26, 2015 Share #3756 Posted October 26, 2015 (edited) As VG8 said, he posted an article about a revived B71. The eastern end seemed to be tampered with. I feel like the B71 should use Eastern Parkway til Ralph ave if there is no extension to south ferry. However, this not only duplicates the , but it also duplicates the B45 (if it just duplicated the three, I wouldn't really mind). I mentioned the B45 part if it need more service (so then the B71 would run to Brownsville via St.Johns Place). Otherwise, the B71 doesn't need to be running east of Grand Army Plaza. It would also directly connect to the at Franklin Avenue, rather than either getting off and walking 2-3 blocks, or going to Downtown Brooklyn. Edited October 26, 2015 by BM5 via Woodhaven 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted October 26, 2015 Share #3757 Posted October 26, 2015 However, this not only duplicates the , but it also duplicates the B45 (if it just duplicated the three, I wouldn't really mind). I mentioned the B45 part if it need more service (so then the B71 would run to Brownsville via St.Johns Place). Otherwise, the B71 doesn't need to be running east of Grand Army Plaza. It would also directly connect to the at Franklin Avenue, rather than either getting off and walking 2-3 blocks, or going to Downtown Brooklyn. You should read some of the comments from folks that live in the area to see how they used the route and where they would go with it now. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted October 26, 2015 Share #3758 Posted October 26, 2015 You should read some of the comments from folks that live in the area to see how they used the route and where they would go with it now. My response was based on if the B71 was reverted to the former route, without the modifications. The new routing east of Grand Army though is much better IMO (but again, if B45 riders do need it, I would have an extension to Ocean Hill-Brownsville in the looks). That routing along Kingston though can be modified though. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TransitJusticeForAll Posted October 26, 2015 Share #3759 Posted October 26, 2015 As you all read my last post, I posted all the routes that were affected in the 2010 cuts. All of them should be restored or at least, modified to meet the demands of people that lived in areas affected by the service cuts. B37 to Court Street. B61 split form the B77. B57 split from the B75. B69 bus off from Flatbush, 7th, and McDonald Avs to Kensington. B49LTD should operate between KCC and Fulton, weekdays from 6am to 10pm. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooklyn Posted October 31, 2015 Share #3760 Posted October 31, 2015 As you all read my last post, I posted all the routes that were affected in the 2010 cuts. All of them should be restored or at least, modified to meet the demands of people that lived in areas affected by the service cuts. B37 to Court Street. B61 split form the B77. B57 split from the B75. B69 bus off from Flatbush, 7th, and McDonald Avs to Kensington. B49LTD should operate between KCC and Fulton, weekdays from 6am to 10pm. I don't agree that all of the routes you listed should be restored, but I definitely agree with the B61/B77.....They took an extremely reliable route (B77) and destoyed it. The cut back B61 was good too--they got it right when they seperated the route into the 61/62. The newer 61 looks good on paper and seems reasonable, but no understanding of traffic patterns went into it. The 71 should be brought back but with some modifications--I would send it through the Battery to Bowling Green (not South Ferry). That way it can 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrianQ60 Posted December 15, 2015 Share #3761 Posted December 15, 2015 Extend the b39 to ridgewood or broadway and myrtle ave via bushwick ave 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fresh Pond Posted December 15, 2015 Share #3762 Posted December 15, 2015 Extend the b39 to ridgewood or broadway and myrtle ave via bushwick ave Who would that serve to begin with 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrianQ60 Posted December 15, 2015 Share #3763 Posted December 15, 2015 Serve a lil bit of people on bushwick ave like the b13 use to 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted December 15, 2015 Share #3764 Posted December 15, 2015 Serve a lil bit of people on bushwick ave like the b13 use to There's no demand for such service. Waste of time, money, and you would make the B39 even more unreliable. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fresh Pond Posted December 16, 2015 Share #3765 Posted December 16, 2015 Serve a lil bit of people on bushwick ave like the b13 use to It was axed on Bushwick because the is right there. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hound Posted December 17, 2015 Share #3766 Posted December 17, 2015 There's no demand for such service. Waste of time, money, and you would make the B39 even more unreliable. It would make more sense to extend the B39 to the west side via Spring/Prince St(former M12 route). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B22viaAtlanticAv Posted December 17, 2015 Share #3767 Posted December 17, 2015 (edited) It would make more sense to extend the B39 to the west side via Spring/Prince St(former M12 route). At that point it would be renamed M39 Edited December 17, 2015 by B22viaAtlanticAv 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrianQ60 Posted December 17, 2015 Share #3768 Posted December 17, 2015 Trying to keep it b39 its need extend somewhere in brooklyn 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Around the Horn Posted December 18, 2015 Share #3769 Posted December 18, 2015 It would make more sense to extend the B39 to the west side via Spring/Prince St(former M12 route). I like your thinking... I'd run it to 6 Av via Spring and Broome 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted December 18, 2015 Share #3770 Posted December 18, 2015 Trying to keep it b39 its need extend somewhere in brooklyn Why does it need to be extended somewhere? Just because it's short doesn't mean it HAS to be extended into Brooklyn. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted December 20, 2015 Share #3771 Posted December 20, 2015 One small proposal for the Q59: The Q59 current makes what the MTA would describe as an "awkward turn" at Union Avenue/BQE, towards Williamsburg. Now, in order to streamline the service and to save time on making the turn over there and having to backtrack down to Metropolitan Avenue, I would have the Q59 turn at Union Avenue/Metropolitan Avenue directly onto Metropolitan, instead of heading up until the BQE, and then turning on Metropolitan Avenue again (unless there's a restriction on commercial vehicles making such turns). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
checkmatechamp13 Posted December 21, 2015 Share #3772 Posted December 21, 2015 One small proposal for the Q59: The Q59 current makes what the MTA would describe as an "awkward turn" at Union Avenue/BQE, towards Williamsburg. Now, in order to streamline the service and to save time on making the turn over there and having to backtrack down to Metropolitan Avenue, I would have the Q59 turn at Union Avenue/Metropolitan Avenue directly onto Metropolitan, instead of heading up until the BQE, and then turning on Metropolitan Avenue again (unless there's a restriction on commercial vehicles making such turns). A young woman was actually killed at that intersection (Union & Meeker) by a Q59 a few years ago. Part of me wants to just have the Q59 just follow the Q54 route down to Marcy Avenue, and reroute the B24 to run up Havemeyer instead of Rodney (for the purposes of keeping a route that crosses from the west side of the BQE to the east side, as crossing it on foot can be very unpleasant. But then again, I'm not sure how the current Q59 is used in the Williamsburg area. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted December 24, 2015 Share #3773 Posted December 24, 2015 (edited) I have an idea for the B20/Q24, but I don't think it's a good one: Cut the Q24 back to Broadway Junction and have the B20 short turns replace the Q24 west of BJ (no pun intended). What do you guys think? That might be an issue as B35 mentioned, since usage has increased since the Q24 had its cut restored. The B20's going to Lafayette would in his plan be extended Broadway Junction short turns that already are in the schedule.No Ridgewood bound buses would be rerouted or shortened. I still don't like it tho.I'm waiting for B35's opinion... Sorry to have kept you (ATH) waiting so long... Lol... - If we're talking strictly from a usage standpoint, sending B20's to Lafayette/Patchen over sending it to Ridgewood would be a good idea.... - If we're talking strictly from a time (savings) standpoint, sending B20's to Lafayette/Patchen over sending it to Ridgewood wouldn't be of much time savings.... That stretch b/w Lafayette & B'way Junction on the Q24 has gotten more commercial over the years (not like Broadway along the B46 route per se, but it's still a vast improvement over how dead that stretch of the Q24 used to be).... They're trying to build up that general part of Brooklyn anyway, but the development phase has been quite sluggish... ....then we get to your (S78's) suggestion of extending the B20 short turns to Lafayette/Patchen.... That wouldn't be much of a short turn if it would rival the runtime of the current B20 from the Bklyn. Mail Facility to Ridgewood - It would resemble a B20a/B20b type of deal, moreso than being a method to having buses getting back to serving the most utilized portion of the route quicker (which of course is Pennsylvania av)..... Hell, the B83 is only growing in ridership, while the B20 is losing it.... The MTA is running B83's like wildfire ever since the extension to Gateway, while the B20 (as it has for the longest) runs rather inconsistently.... My point is, if you give the B83 Pennsylvania av (all the way down, instead of the diversion that it currently does) & have B20's run to Lafayette/Patchen (instead of to Ridgewood) in lieu of cutting Q24 service short @ B'way Junction, that would be something to think about & possibly consider, as again, that stretch of Broadway is seeing more pax on the Q24.... Now how many of those riders (b/w the Q24 terminal & B'way junction) are riding it past (meaning, west of) B'way junction ever since the influx of ridership along Broadway, that IDK... But generally speaking, the Q24 & the Q56 have always been utilized as alternatives over the to get from Jamaica, all the way to B'way Junction (or Alabama av).... There are a lot of people doing this very commute than you might think..... It seems like the Q24 is preferred over the Q56 for that purpose, and I'm not exactly sure as to why that is, but I do have a theory.... ^^ Not to delve too far o/t, but yeah.... Sending current B20 short turns over to Lafayette/Patchen, nah... It defeats the purpose Edited December 24, 2015 by B35 via Church 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted December 24, 2015 Share #3774 Posted December 24, 2015 I don't agree that all of the routes you listed should be restored, but I definitely agree with the B61/B77.....They took an extremely reliable route (B77) and destoyed it. The cut back B61 was good too--they got it right when they seperated the route into the 61/62. The newer 61 looks good on paper and seems reasonable, but no understanding of traffic patterns went into it. I would replace the term with efficient (over reliable) when it came to the B77.... There were times where I waited over 20 mins. over there at 5th/10th for that thing (that's really the only negative I had about the old route), but overall I get your point & agree with it.... They knew how efficient the B77 was & they knew the ridership levels of the old B61 (the red hook - queens plaza one) b/w red hook & downtown alone (which was the first rendition of the B61)..... They caved in to the demands/cries of CB6 then, and CB6 got what they wanted with a split of that rendition of the B61.... But of course, to save money (of course they went overboard with it - trying to thwart Park Slopers from taking a route they freakin knew they wanted to bastardize (the B67)), they got rid of the B75 & merged the B61 (downtown - IKEA) with the B77 (knowing that the 77 was still favored over the 75 in Park Slope) to try to force all of that usage onto one bus (referring to the current B61)..... I hate to say this, but the situation with the B61 (of current) could actually be much worse... Luckily, it doesn't get anymore patronage b/w Bishop Ford (well, what used to be Bishop Ford... I didn't know the school had closed) & 7th av than the old B75 did, because those are the folks that are still drastically taking F's to get downtown over the B61 - and with good reason - as the B61 of today is far more indirect for that purpose than the B75 was.... Although I don't believe that the MTA knew that part of Brooklyn would end up thriving the way it has, still, I would not wince for once second if CB6 demanded that the MTA provide service once every 2-3 minutes on the B61 during rush hour... This is the monster that they created with that route... I can't put it anymore profoundly than that. The 71 should be brought back but with some modifications--I would send it through the Battery to Bowling Green (not South Ferry). The modification I've suggested is running it b/w Prospect Park & South Ferry.... You can't really end a bus route at Bowling Green itself... One small proposal for the Q59: The Q59 current makes what the MTA would describe as an "awkward turn" at Union Avenue/BQE, towards Williamsburg. Now, in order to streamline the service and to save time on making the turn over there and having to backtrack down to Metropolitan Avenue, I would have the Q59 turn at Union Avenue/Metropolitan Avenue directly onto Metropolitan, instead of heading up until the BQE, and then turning on Metropolitan Avenue again (unless there's a restriction on commercial vehicles making such turns). A young woman was actually killed at that intersection (Union & Meeker) by a Q59 a few years ago. Part of me wants to just have the Q59 just follow the Q54 route down to Marcy Avenue, and reroute the B24 to run up Havemeyer instead of Rodney (for the purposes of keeping a route that crosses from the west side of the BQE to the east side, as crossing it on foot can be very unpleasant. But then again, I'm not sure how the current Q59 is used in the Williamsburg area. The MTA was stubborn about sending the Q59 to WBP back when it used to end at Kent/Broadway.... I'm telling you right now that there is no need for the B32 & the Q59 running concurrently in the immediate areas that they do (by the waterfront).... You made this B32, now hand over that area to the B32 & focus on getting Q59 riders to/from WBP & be done with it.... That backtracking is the reason Brooklynites utilize the Q54 over the Q59 if they need Grand (st).... It's almost as if the Q59 is structured the way it is (and I've said this before on here) because they know the route is more or less a brief industrial stretch of being 100% supplementary - In Brooklyn to the Q54 & in Queens to the Q58.... The way it is used illustrates that.... I can understand expanding the footprint of a route, but there's not much of a point if the bus is an afterthought.... And this was BEFORE the hipsterism of Williamsburg with the substandard usage of the Q59 by the waterfront.... Of course you have the , but now the foot, the taxicab, and the bicycle trumps the public bus as far as preferred terms of getting around over there.... AFAIK, you have two plausible options for improvement: 1) Have the Q54 & the Q59 run the exact same routing in Brooklyn when they meet up @ Metropolitan/Grand.... 2) Have the Q59 turn up either Bushwick or Graham to serve Metropolitan.... then use Marcy/Rodney to get to/from WBP.... You don't need the Q59 on Union.... And then there's the antiquated routing of the B24 that plays a huge role in it all... I'll stop there..... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted December 25, 2015 Share #3775 Posted December 25, 2015 (edited) The MTA was stubborn about sending the Q59 to WBP back when it used to end at Kent/Broadway.... I'm telling you right now that there is no need for the B32 & the Q59 running concurrently in the immediate areas that they do (by the waterfront).... You made this B32, now hand over that area to the B32 & focus on getting Q59 riders to/from WBP & be done with it.... That backtracking is the reason Brooklynites utilize the Q54 over the Q59 if they need Grand (st).... It's almost as if the Q59 is structured the way it is (and I've said this before on here) because they know the route is more or less a brief industrial stretch of being 100% supplementary - In Brooklyn to the Q54 & in Queens to the Q58.... The way it is used illustrates that.... I can understand expanding the footprint of a route, but there's not much of a point if the bus is an afterthought.... And this was BEFORE the hipsterism of Williamsburg with the substandard usage of the Q59 by the waterfront.... Of course you have the , but now the foot, the taxicab, and the bicycle trumps the public bus as far as preferred terms of getting around over there.... AFAIK, you have two plausible options for improvement: 1) Have the Q54 & the Q59 run the exact same routing in Brooklyn when they meet up @ Metropolitan/Grand.... 2) Have the Q59 turn up either Bushwick or Graham to serve Metropolitan.... then use Marcy/Rodney to get to/from WBP.... You don't need the Q59 on Union.... And then there's the antiquated routing of the B24 that plays a huge role in it all... I'll stop there..... I'll agree with you on two things. The Q59 really does not need to run on Broadway and Kent Ave. Not many people have used the Q59 along that segment, so yeah, the B32 should ultimately cover that segment. It'll cut some travel time down, but with the delays the Q59 experiences, keeping the runtime as is would make a modified (shorter) route much more reliable. Also, I believe the Q59 should run along Metropolitan from Bushwick Avenue. However, I believe the B24 should run along Grand Street either towards WBP or in both directions. I believe that area should have something else besides the B24. However, the Q54 is slightly less frequent than the Q59 at several times of the day, so the B24 should run along Grand Street to make up for some of that service. However, I disagree with eliminating all Q59 east of the BQE. I would have the Q59 use Driggs and Bedford Avenue. There's a considerable amount of people that get on from east Driggs (before reaching the BQE), and the walk is quite a bit to/from Meeker/Marcy/Rodney. West of Driggs, there's not much of anyone on that bus. Edited December 25, 2015 by BM5 via Woodhaven 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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