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limitednyc

b46sbs

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Hmm, news to me...

 

Hopefully because they're getting rid of it!!

My only educated guess could be the Williamsburg NIMBYS are complaining about their bus service and that bus service is mostly generated fro Dekalb to KP.

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My only educated guess could be the Williamsburg NIMBYS are complaining about their bus service and that bus service is mostly generated fro Dekalb to KP.

The main core of the ridership on that line is between Kings Plaza and Dekalb. It's not going to Willamsburg anytime soon.

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The main core of the ridership on that line is between Kings Plaza and Dekalb. It's not going to Willamsburg anytime soon.

Definitely I do know that. However, it's weird that the schedules are not up for the 46sbs. What I would like to see is some form of increased headways for the local. On Friday morning alone I spotted 8 SBS buses on the southbound direction of Avenue H and Utica.

Edited by Future ENY OP
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Definitely I do know that. However, it's weird that the schedules are not up for the 46sbs. What I would like to see is some form of increased headways for the local. On Friday morning alone I spotted 8 SBS buses on the southbound direction of Avenue H and Utica.

I could have sworn that the schedule was up when the fall pick had started.

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I could have sworn that the schedule was up when the fall pick had started.

You are correct. However, go on the website now and it's no dice. Only the 44SBS schedule is up.

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Definitely I do know that. However, it's weird that the schedules are not up for the 46sbs. What I would like to see is some form of increased headways for the local. On Friday morning alone I spotted 8 SBS buses on the southbound direction of Avenue H and Utica.

I don't even have to ask you in what timeframe you saw those 8 buses in one direction.... The worst I have seen so far is 7 straight SBS' without one local (coincidentally, this was also in the SB direction).... Was going to get some baked ziti at the local pizzeria (snyder/utica), and as I was sitting down waiting, I was counting the amt. of SBS' passing by.... After the 4th consecutive one, I started counting the amount of locals I'd see.....

 

Being out & about, I commonly see 4-5 SBS in a row... Not even exaggerating or joking.

I'm already anti-SBS, and seeing what's going on here with SBS on the B46 specifically, it's making me abhor SBS now.....

 

Shit like this is how you know the MTA is shoving SBS down riders throats... I would argue, it's how you know the MTA is being stubborn with just how wrong they were that SBS would be a cure-all for problems that plague the B46....

Maybe the MTA realized that service is so frequent on the B46 SBS that riders don't see to see a schedule.

...which would be an absolute slap in the face to the rider of any other bus route in the city.

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I don't even have to ask you in what timeframe you saw those 8 buses in one direction.... The worst I have seen so far is 7 straight SBS' without one local (coincidentally, this was also in the SB direction).... Was going to get some baked ziti at the local pizzeria (snyder/utica), and as I was sitting down waiting, I was counting the amt. of SBS' passing by.... After the 4th consecutive one, I started counting the amount of locals I'd see.....

 

Being out & about, I commonly see 4-5 SBS in a row... Not even exaggerating or joking.

I'm already anti-SBS, and seeing what's going on here with SBS on the B46 specifically, it's making me abhor SBS now.....

 

Shit like this is how you know the MTA is shoving SBS down riders throats... I would argue, it's how you know the MTA is being stubborn with just how wrong they were that SBS would be a cure-all for problems that plague the B46....

...which would be an absolute slap in the face to the rider of any other bus route in the city.

If the B46 has Bx12 syndrome (overcrowded SBS buses and underutilized locals) I wouldn't have too much of a problem with what I bolded in red. Along Pelham Parkway riders at Eastchester Rd and Williamsbridge Rd act like the local doesn't even exist most of the time. 

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And when they issue the B46 report, they will paint it as a huge success by selectively choosing their data and distorting the truth like they did with the B44 SBS. They proclaimed that ridership rose by 10 percent when that was totally misleading and inaccurate because it actually declined by two percent. See the third letter down.

 

http://www.brooklyndaily.com/stories/2016/44/all-letters-2016-10-28-bd.html

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If the B46 has Bx12 syndrome (overcrowded SBS buses and underutilized locals) I wouldn't have too much of a problem with what I bolded in red. Along Pelham Parkway riders at Eastchester Rd and Williamsbridge Rd act like the local doesn't even exist most of the time. 

The MTA is trying to inject "Bx12 syndrome" into the B46.....

 

Before SBS, there was clearly a healthy patronization of B46 locals to B46 LTD's.... Like I said, they are trying to force SBS down riders' throats - and out of all the SBS routes in existence, what they're doing (what they've done) with the B46 is by far the most glaring example of it....

 

The ratio of SBS' to locals out here is way too high..... Locals are jampacked & some SBS's in a lot of cases are running close to emptiness.... That's not happening in your neck of the woods w/ the Bx12.

 

And when they issue the B46 report, they will paint it as a huge success by selectively choosing their data and distorting the truth like they did with the B44 SBS. They proclaimed that ridership rose by 10 percent when that was totally misleading and inaccurate because it actually declined by two percent. See the third letter down.

 

http://www.brooklyndaily.com/stories/2016/44/all-letters-2016-10-28-bd.html

Oh, you know that's coming.... I expect nothing less.

Par for the course.

Edited by B35 via Church

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Lol, I can't even find it on google either. However, adding the "s" after the 6 on the B46 Local address will give you the SBS schedule.

 

As far as the B46 Local/B46 SBS distribution, yeah, I feel that it is over excessive too. I took the B46 Local from Kings Plaza to WBP. By around church, I saw an SBS with several standees. However, that local behind it was a sardine can. The bus also get crush loaded because of the riders (plus the farebeaters who don't want to wait on the line) past Church, until Eastern Parkway. Somewhere between those two points, a B46 SBS passed by, with an SRO load. Interestingly enough, I did not see any SBS buses going south for quite a while until past Fulton, and then there were a sea of them. At DeKalb, there were two on layover, and a third one making the right onto Broadway. And I did not see a single local until about Flushing Avenue (but I did see B47's, lol).

 

IDK if this is normal, but there were more riders from Kings Plaza using the SBS than the local; the bus I was on had about 5 riders (and the bus before left with 2 or 3), while the SBS left with about a dozen (more or less).

 

BTW, how frequent did the B46 Limited operate before?

Edited by BM5 via Woodhaven Bl

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If the B46 has Bx12 syndrome (overcrowded SBS buses and underutilized locals) I wouldn't have too much of a problem with what I bolded in red. Along Pelham Parkway riders at Eastchester Rd and Williamsbridge Rd act like the local doesn't even exist most of the time.

 

It's actually quite the opposite. Overcrowding on the local and excess capacity on the SBS.

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I wasn't making my point to comment on the B46 really, it was more of a point to say that if I saw a 4:1 or 5:1 ratio of SBS to local buses up in my neck of the woods I wouldn't be concerned at all. The riders up here have an irrational preference for the Bx12 Select where any alternatives to it are ignored by folks as if they don't even exist. I say this because it's not just the local suffering because of this. Bx5 service on weekends to Bay Plaza is woefully underused while Bx12 SBS service to and from is consistently packed most of the afternoon (especially on Saturdays). Even with the over-saturation of routes between Co-op City and PBP (6) on weekdays, Bx12 SBS buses carry consistently well within that section of the route and buses running crushed in and out of Co-op is not all that uncommon. I can't seem to wrap my head around why riders still sardine on Bx12 Select buses when less crowded and delay prone options present themselves for each section of the riderbase except Inwood. 

 

If riders want Bx12 Select buses no matter what up here I would have no problem with the MTA giving it to them. 

 

With the B46 I can't see what needs to be done besides cutting into SBS service and increasing local service. At least there the fix seems to be easy, the question is whether the MTA cares to act on it. Given SBS service runs at the same headways as the LTD did previously I get the sense that the shortening of the route has a lot to do with the service appearing a lot more often relative to locals so that's another variable that has to be dealt with.

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I feel like the 46 runs bad in the am . Buses are jammed pack bus after bus from Ave H - Fulton they are packed. Sometimes you will be waiting 20-25 waiting for a bus that has room. And SBS are always get delayed because of buses being over crowded. Plus the inspectors are always stop buses at the packed stops

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using NYC Transit Forums mobile app

Edited by Kingjunior34

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....With the B46 I can't see what needs to be done besides cutting into SBS service and increasing local service. At least there the fix seems to be easy, the question is whether the MTA cares to act on it. Given SBS service runs at the same headways as the LTD did previously I get the sense that the shortening of the route has a lot to do with the service appearing a lot more often relative to locals so that's another variable that has to be dealt with.

It's not about "appearing" with this; the SBS's are arriving more often (and that is by design)....

Yes, it's due to the SBS' not traveling the full route like the LTD's did....

--------

 

Long been tired of this crap; if SBS in general was so great, they wouldn't have to cut into a route's local service to give off the illusion (speaking of appearances) that it is as such.... Let the riders dictate what they need/want instead of you (meaning, the MTA) trying to determine it for them!! This is where they fail with so many of these route changes....

 

I'm not holding my breath for the MTA to rectify matters here....

 

BTW, how frequent did the B46 Limited operate before?

Headway wise, same as the SBS'... The difference is that the SBS' don't have to contend with the tie-ups that Broadway's plagued with.

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It's not about "appearing" with this; the SBS's are arriving more often (and that is by design)....

Yes, it's due to the SBS' not traveling the full route like the LTD's did....

--------

 

Long been tired of this crap; if SBS in general was so great, they wouldn't have to cut into a route's local service to give off the illusion (speaking of appearances) that it is as such.... Let the riders dictate what they need/want instead of you (meaning, the MTA) trying to determine it for them!! This is where they fail with so many of these route changes....

 

I'm not holding my breath for the MTA to rectify matters here....

 

Headway wise, same as the SBS'... The difference is that the SBS' don't have to contend with the tie-ups that Broadway's plagued with.

The thing is with the (MTA) they will not run one or the other evenly.  Either one will run and the other will be cut or vice versa.  Years ago when I worked in Chelsea, it was next to impossible to get a local bus down 5th Avenue below 23rd street.  I didn't use the local buses often, but when I needed one, I usually decided to just walk out of frustration.  I'd see several limited stop buses (M2's and M5's galore) and very few M1's and M3's).  Now fast forward and you see the opposite. The (MTA) has cut M2 service severely and now you have more local buses running up Madison and down 5th.  Ultimately they don't care about the riding public.  In their minds they think that SBS will maximize costs and so even if it isn't that great, if it is cheaper to run than more local buses, well then they're going to cut local bus service and run more SBS buses.  I see the same thing with the M15.  The B/Os also don't help with that either because you have some of them that simply don't want to pick up passengers, so if they're doing a local run, they will do everything possible not to stop.  This is a regular occurrence that I witness along 3rd Avenue with the M101 and M103.  If there's an M101 coming, the M103 will try to avoid stopping.  In fact I've seen several drivers refuse to even pull into the stop.  They just go right past and assume that no one wants the M103.  The issue is there aren't enough people speaking up about local bus service, and even then it's an uphill battle with the (MTA).  

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Maybe (MTA) forgot to put Bx46 SBS schedule back on Brooklyn schedule.

 

For (MTA) Fare/Tol Hike Public Hearing's Audio Location for Hicksville Station, (MTA) forgot to add NICE Bus's n20H and Hicksville-Wantagh Shuttle and n800/81 buses on list.

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I haven't ridden the B46 in many many years but in the 1950s and 60s it was "my" route. As a kid I would watch it for hours from my rooftop. I mention this because I would like those familiar with the route today to figure out if service today is really any better than it was 50 years ago so let me describe the service back then. The bus operated from Avenue N to the Bridge with short turns most of the time between Avenue H and Broadway. On weekends, the buses operated about every ten minutes on average. Of course bunching sometimes increased the wait but it was never bad.

 

Weekdays were a different story. During the day, buses operated like every six, eight, or ten minutes depending on which year you are looking at with less service as time went on. But during rush hours in peak direction between Kings Highway and Eastern Parkway, there was a scheduled two minute headway, but realistic service was more like four buses every eight minutes with several being too full to stop and pick up passengers. There were four or six buses that just operated between Avenue H and Eastern Parkway in the peak direction and operated light in the off peak direction using Schenectady to East NY Avenue in the AM. Not sure if the PMs used Troy or perhaps Rochester. Those buses were great because they made the off peak lite trip in half the peak direction running time.

 

Additionally, during the day, there were several buses from Avenue N that turned at Fulton Street and until about 1960, two buses operated from the Bridge only to Church Avenue turning using East 48th Street to Snyder which was left over from the old trolley route because I remember the trolley tracks on East 48 Street. In the early 50s there were probably even more Church Avenue trips.

 

The effect of all these short turns minimized the bad effects of bus bunching. Before exact fare which debuted in 1969, loading times were much longer and the buses although they had soft seats were less comfortable than they are today especially without air conditioning. The ride was also much rougher. But aside from that, I am wondering that with fewer short turns and with SBS and its bunching, and longer waits for locals, if any if you believe that the service today is better from how I described it fifty years ago.

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I haven't ridden the B46 in many many years but in the 1950s and 60s it was "my" route. As a kid I would watch it for hours from my rooftop. I mention this because I would like those familiar with the route today to figure out if service today is really any better than it was 50 years ago so let me describe the service back then. The bus operated from Avenue N to the Bridge with short turns most of the time between Avenue H and Broadway. On weekends, the buses operated about every ten minutes on average. Of course bunching sometimes increased the wait but it was never bad.

 

Weekdays were a different story. During the day, buses operated like every six, eight, or ten minutes depending on which year you are looking at with less service as time went on. But during rush hours in peak direction between Kings Highway and Eastern Parkway, there was a scheduled two minute headway, but realistic service was more like four buses every eight minutes with several being too full to stop and pick up passengers. There were four or six buses that just operated between Avenue H and Eastern Parkway in the peak direction and operated light in the off peak direction using Schenectady to East NY Avenue in the AM. Not sure if the PMs used Troy or perhaps Rochester. Those buses were great because they made the off peak lite trip in half the peak direction running time.

 

Additionally, during the day, there were several buses from Avenue N that turned at Fulton Street and until about 1960, two buses operated from the Bridge only to Church Avenue turning using East 48th Street to Snyder which was left over from the old trolley route because I remember the trolley tracks on East 48 Street. In the early 50s there were probably even more Church Avenue trips.

 

The effect of all these short turns minimized the bad effects of bus bunching. Before exact fare which debuted in 1969, loading times were much longer and the buses although they had soft seats were less comfortable than they are today especially without air conditioning. The ride was also much rougher. But aside from that, I am wondering that with fewer short turns and with SBS and its bunching, and longer waits for locals, if any if you believe that the service today is better from how I described it fifty years ago.

Your memory is still intact BrooklynBus. I can still remember back to back n/b B46s at the stop on Empire Blvd during snowstorms. The B/Os had a system where the northernmost bus would close it's doors but wouldn't take power until the follower closed it's doors. A B17 B/O told me that the reasoning was so that the bus in the lead wouldn't drift or slide backward while passengers were still boarding the bus in the rear. It was a safety measure the B/Os worked out among themselves I was told. I used the B46 five days a week, usually between Clarkson Avenue and Eastern Parkway in the reverse peak direction and I don't recall any major gaps in service in either direction. The few times I came to school from the Church Avenue end in the morning was when I encountered the bus dispatcher at the n/e corner of Utica who used to collect fares and transfers at the back door of the bus in front of the drug store. He had a portable fare box that was the same as the one on the bus itself. There were a few n/b B46s that went in service at Church Avenue and the dispatcher would make me wait for one of them while telling the B/O to let me off at Clarkson Avenue. He once told me that the Avenue N buses were too crowded for me and they sometimes would bypass the stops at Clarkson Avenue and Winthrop Street. I, too, wonder if there's been any real improvement in service since the extension to Kings Plaza. I still think the SBS variant should travel no further north than Fulton St only because of the width of Malcolm X Blvd ( Reid Ave) , not because of the demographics of that neighborhood. I'll leave the Surface planning to someone else I guess. Carry on.

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Your memory is still intact BrooklynBus. I can still remember back to back n/b B46s at the stop on Empire Blvd during snowstorms. The B/Os had a system where the northernmost bus would close it's doors but wouldn't take power until the follower closed it's doors. A B17 B/O told me that the reasoning was so that the bus in the lead wouldn't drift or slide backward while passengers were still boarding the bus in the rear. It was a safety measure the B/Os worked out among themselves I was told. I used the B46 five days a week, usually between Clarkson Avenue and Eastern Parkway in the reverse peak direction and I don't recall any major gaps in service in either direction. The few times I came to school from the Church Avenue end in the morning was when I encountered the bus dispatcher at the n/e corner of Utica who used to collect fares and transfers at the back door of the bus in front of the drug store. He had a portable fare box that was the same as the one on the bus itself. There were a few n/b B46s that went in service at Church Avenue and the dispatcher would make me wait for one of them while telling the B/O to let me off at Clarkson Avenue. He once told me that the Avenue N buses were too crowded for me and they sometimes would bypass the stops at Clarkson Avenue and Winthrop Street. I, too, wonder if there's been any real improvement in service since the extension to Kings Plaza. I still think the SBS variant should travel no further north than Fulton St only because of the width of Malcolm X Blvd ( Reid Ave) , not because of the demographics of that neighborhood. I'll leave the Surface planning to someone else I guess. Carry on.

What I wonder is if they still have those Eastern Parkway buses, especially the one way ones. Half the northbound passengers would get off at Eastern Parkway in the AM. To have all buses go to Broadway or the Bridge is dumb and inefficient even with SBS.

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What I wonder is if they still have those Eastern Parkway buses, especially the one way ones. Half the northbound passengers would get off at Eastern Parkway in the AM. To have all buses go to Broadway or the Bridge is dumb and inefficient even with SBS.

They still do have those short turns during the rush hour, well on the local.

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They still do have those short turns during the rush hour, well on the local.

I thought so, but do they still operate in one direction only during rush hours? That was the good part about them.

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