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GreatOne2k

Subway service to Aqueduct may get a boost, may even get Airtrain stop

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If this plan happens

 

http://www.crainsnewyork.com/article/20120104/POLITICS/120109978/1072

 

 

Observers have discussed upgrading subway access to Aqueduct and possibly building an AirTrain spur to connect John F. Kennedy International Airport to the site. Mr. Cuomo controls the authorities that manage those systems—the Metropolitan Transportation Authority and the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey

 

 

 

Report: Cuomo to push for convention center, Vegas-style gaming at Aqueduct - PaulickReport.com

 

At least the (A) train may get a boost out of this, and Airtrain may get a new branch. (A) train would need a boost especially off peak with waits up to 15-20 minutes on the Far Rockaway Branch daytime.

Legalized gambling will make Aqueduct even bigger.

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If this plan happens

 

http://www.crainsnewyork.com/article/20120104/POLITICS/120109978/1072

 

 

 

 

 

Report: Cuomo to push for convention center, Vegas-style gaming at Aqueduct - PaulickReport.com

 

At least the (A) train may get a boost out of this, and Airtrain may get a new branch. (A) train would need a boost especially off peak with waits up to 15-20 minutes on the Far Rockaway Branch daytime.

Legalized gambling will make Aqueduct even bigger.

 

 

I am sure Wallyhorse is saying i 'told ya soon' lol about suggesting more frequent service on the (A) Howard Beach/Rockaway coordior. :(

Seriously even if that approves (the new covention center)that still a couple of years away before we discuss this. For now IMO the (A) only needs expanded service on the Rockaway coordior on summer weekends.

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Worse comes worse, they should short turn (A) trains at Howard Beach. There's only so many (A) trains they can run. [And before anyone says it: Please don't say: "run the (C) to Lefferts". It's been debated to death and it just won't work.]

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Worse comes worse, they should short turn (A) trains at Howard Beach. There's only so many (A) trains they can run. [And before anyone says it: Please don't say: "run the (C) to Lefferts". It's been debated to death and it just won't work.]

 

so lets extend the Rock Park (S) up there...that way, the 15 or so riders out there have a 1-seat ride up there

 

(if you do not sense the total sarcasm in this, then thats sad)

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Building the largest convention center in the nation would require a crap load of land. If anyone's been to the Orange County Convention Center in Orlando, you'll know what I mean. Aqueduct just might do it.

 

If this did somehow go through, the upgraded Subway on the A train would be essential. What if the Airtrain was extended from its Terminal in Howard Beach, onto the Rockaway Spur tracks, and then terminated at the Aqueduct station? Or better yet, have it go all the way into Manhattan as a quasi JFK Express. Not sure how that would work out since the Port Authority owns the Airtrain, but its a nice thought.

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Second New York Daily News Article on the Governor's plans for Aqueduct.

 

The Governor's plans I think could be enough to do the unthinkable: Force a re-activation of the LIRR Rockaway Branch for subway use with a connection from the Queens Boulevard Line, initially at least using existing provisions built in for such a branch on that line with considerations for future expansion that could include a new Queens super express using a new Queens tunnel from the SAS at 79th Street (that could include a station at 79th Street/York-1st Avenues as part of this) and use the never-previously used upper level of Roosevelt Avenue, connecting from there to the Rockaway branch. It's something I'd already be willing to partially pay for as the Casino operator, but if it also helped with Aqueduct being a full-blown convention center and casino, then it would be really worth doing, with perhaps connections to/from multiple subway lines besides Queens Boulevard, especially from subway lines originating in Manhattan.

 

If I were Cuomo, I'd be pushing this along with the expansion of the current Racino that would also include a total rebuild of the existing single-platform Aqueduct Racetrack station into a new, three-platform station (which I had previously proposed here and would include a total rebuild of the missing track on the line) that would allow for such a station to be a terminal when necessary because of work needing to be done on the Rockaway Branch. In addition, with a new convention center at Aqueduct, I'd be looking if possible into extending the Howard Beach branch of the AirTrain to Aqueduct to serve the new convention center as well.

 

This to me looks like the best, and only shot of ever getting the Rockaway Branch of the LIRR re-activated for subway use. The NIMBY's may not want it, but this is one time, especially if the Governor pushed for it as part of a package for a new convention center at Aqueduct that they could be overridden.

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Guest lance25

How about we see where this goes first. Then we can worry about subway service out there. Right now, all Governor Cuomo is doing is grandstanding and pitching his ideas. There's no guarantee he'll get approval, funds, or the developer(s) needed for this type of project.

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Kind of funny to raze the Javits Center, when that is the main attraction for the (7) extension and basically the anchor of the whole West Side development. Though, he says it would be replaced with "a mix of commercial, residential and culture space on the model of Battery Park City".

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Guest lance25

This just came to me. Wouldn't it make much more sense to build the new convention center/casino somewhere in midtown Manhattan, you know, where the people are, rather than basically in the middle of nowhere? Yeah, the new one would be closer to JFK Airport, but that's all that would be there. Would there even be a hotel there? If not, then it's even more stupid. The casino isn't going to bring the tourists Cuomo's expecting since they aren't going to schlep all the way from the middle of nowhere to their hotels in midtown.

 

And as Eric B stated, closing the Javits Center pretty much negates the need for the (7) line extension. We can't get the developers to build something there as it is. That won't get any better without the Javits Center. In fact, it will probably be even harder to attract developers without some type of anchor.

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Second New York Daily News Article on the Governor's plans for Aqueduct.

 

The Governor's plans I think could be enough to do the unthinkable: Force a re-activation of the LIRR Rockaway Branch for subway use with a connection from the Queens Boulevard Line, initially at least using existing provisions built in for such a branch on that line with considerations for future expansion that could include a new Queens super express using a new Queens tunnel from the SAS at 79th Street (that could include a station at 79th Street/York-1st Avenues as part of this) and use the never-previously used upper level of Roosevelt Avenue, connecting from there to the Rockaway branch. It's something I'd already be willing to partially pay for as the Casino operator, but if it also helped with Aqueduct being a full-blown convention center and casino, then it would be really worth doing, with perhaps connections to/from multiple subway lines besides Queens Boulevard, especially from subway lines originating in Manhattan.

 

If I were Cuomo, I'd be pushing this along with the expansion of the current Racino that would also include a total rebuild of the existing single-platform Aqueduct Racetrack station into a new, three-platform station (which I had previously proposed here and would include a total rebuild of the missing track on the line) that would allow for such a station to be a terminal when necessary because of work needing to be done on the Rockaway Branch. In addition, with a new convention center at Aqueduct, I'd be looking if possible into extending the Howard Beach branch of the AirTrain to Aqueduct to serve the new convention center as well.

 

This to me looks like the best, and only shot of ever getting the Rockaway Branch of the LIRR re-activated for subway use. The NIMBY's may not want it, but this is one time, especially if the Governor pushed for it as part of a package for a new convention center at Aqueduct that they could be overridden.

You get aroused pretty fast, don't ya?

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This just came to me. Wouldn't it make much more sense to build the new convention center/casino somewhere in midtown Manhattan, you know, where the people are, rather than basically in the middle of nowhere? Yeah, the new one would be closer to JFK Airport, but that's all that would be there. Would there even be a hotel there? If not, then it's even more stupid. The casino isn't going to bring the tourists Cuomo's expecting since they aren't going to schlep all the way from the middle of nowhere to their hotels in midtown..

 

For good gambling, people will go pretty far. Just think of of how strong a gambling addiction can be. I'm glad tat cuomo is not jus t focused on manhattan, and realizes the potential that queens has to bring in revenue and bring up the quality of life in the crummier parts of queens. The area around aqueduct can certainly use a good influx of cash and jobs.

 

Yes, they will need to increase transportation out there to get the full effect. Maybe get an express bus straight there from midtown. Tourists alreadypay for those stupid tour bus rides in midtown, no reason they would not get on an MCI for a similar ride. Just expanding subway service will not do so much good, since there are only so many new trains you can put on the tracks.

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This just came to me. Wouldn't it make much more sense to build the new convention center/casino somewhere in midtown Manhattan, you know, where the people are, rather than basically in the middle of nowhere? Yeah, the new one would be closer to JFK Airport, but that's all that would be there. Would there even be a hotel there? If not, then it's even more stupid. The casino isn't going to bring the tourists Cuomo's expecting since they aren't going to schlep all the way from the middle of nowhere to their hotels in midtown.

 

 

 

Yes there will be a hotel there, up to 3,000 rooms.

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/05/nyregion/cuomo-proposes-convention-center-at-aqueduct-in-queens.html

 

Under Mr. Cuomo’s proposal, the state would forge a joint venture with the Genting Group, the Malaysian company that has invested $800 million in opening a gambling hall at Aqueduct. Genting, not the state, would finance a $4 billion convention center, with a hotel and expanded gambling space, while the government would contribute the land in Queens.

 

“This will bring to New York the largest events, driving demand for hotel rooms and restaurant meals and creating tax revenues and jobs, jobs, jobs,” Mr. Cuomo said in his State of the State speech. “In addition to the new convention space, up to 3,000 hotel rooms will be developed. We will make New York the No. 1 convention site in the nation.”

 

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This just came to me. Wouldn't it make much more sense to build the new convention center/casino somewhere in midtown Manhattan, you know, where the people are, rather than basically in the middle of nowhere? Yeah, the new one would be closer to JFK Airport, but that's all that would be there. Would there even be a hotel there? If not, then it's even more stupid. The casino isn't going to bring the tourists Cuomo's expecting since they aren't going to schlep all the way from the middle of nowhere to their hotels in midtown.

 

And as Eric B stated, closing the Javits Center pretty much negates the need for the (7) line extension. We can't get the developers to build something there as it is. That won't get any better without the Javits Center. In fact, it will probably be even harder to attract developers without some type of anchor.

 

Try to pitch a casino to be built in Midtown Manhattan, and you won't be able to say "cha-ching" before you're backhanded by NIMBY-ism. Casinos are known to decrease land value and require additional police force. (Hence, they are often isolated and built in areas away from cities.) A casino by the Jacob Javits Center would be counterproductive to the main goal of the (7) Line Extension - to open up the area between Chelsea and Hell's Kitchen to high-end residential and commercial developers.

 

Also, people are used to traveling far for a decent casino [see: Atlantic City] -- one that you can take the subway to is already worth it.

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Try to pitch a casino to be built in Midtown Manhattan, and you won't be able to say "cha-ching" before you're backhanded by NIMBY-ism. Casinos are known to decrease land value and require additional police force. (Hence, they are often isolated and built in areas away from cities.) A casino by the Jacob Javits Center would be counterproductive to the main goal of the (7) Line Extension - to open up the area between Chelsea and Hell's Kitchen to high-end residential and commercial developers.

 

Also, people are used to traveling far for a decent casino [see: Atlantic City] -- one that you can take the subway to is already worth it.

 

Sorry Lance. I agree with West End. Having a casino in midtown manhattan will never be approved by the nimby's. Hell the far west side neighborhoods like Clinton, Hell's Kitchen and Chelesa stopped mega projects such as the Jets/Olympic Stadium and Westway. Having convention center/casino(not saying I agree with it) is best suited for Queens.

 

The Javitz center could still be used for smaller size conventions and events though along with what the Governor wants to bulid a new west side Battery Park type complex.

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Guest lance25
Try to pitch a casino to be built in Midtown Manhattan, and you won't be able to say "cha-ching" before you're backhanded by NIMBY-ism. Casinos are known to decrease land value and require additional police force. (Hence, they are often isolated and built in areas away from cities.) A casino by the Jacob Javits Center would be counterproductive to the main goal of the (7) Line Extension - to open up the area between Chelsea and Hell's Kitchen to high-end residential and commercial developers.

 

Also, people are used to traveling far for a decent casino [see: Atlantic City] -- one that you can take the subway to is already worth it.

 

Sorry Lance. I agree with West End. Having a casino in midtown manhattan will never be approved by the nimby's. Hell the far west side neighborhoods like Clinton, Hell's Kitchen and Chelesa stopped mega projects such as the Jets/Olympic Stadium and Westway. Having convention center/casino(not saying I agree with it) is best suited for Queens.

 

The Javitz center could still be used for smaller size conventions and events though along with what the Governor wants to bulid a new west side Battery Park type complex.

 

Okay, so a midtown casino or an expanded convention center is pretty much DOA. That still doesn't justify one being built in the middle of nowhere. Not unless there were also other types of entertainment in the area. West End, you mentioned how people are already used to commuting to a "decent" casino or what have you and you used Atlantic City as an example. The problem with that is Atlantic City has all of its main attractions within close distance. It would be at least a half-hour drive or around an hour train ride from the Casino/Convention Center to midtown, where everything else a tourist would want to see is. That's my main gripe with this idea.

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Okay, so a midtown casino or an expanded convention center is pretty much DOA. That still doesn't justify one being built in the middle of nowhere. Not unless there were also other types of entertainment in the area. West End, you mentioned how people are already used to commuting to a "decent" casino or what have you and you used Atlantic City as an example. The problem with that is Atlantic City has all of its main attractions within close distance. It would be at least a half-hour drive or around an hour train ride from the Casino/Convention Center to midtown, where everything else a tourist would want to see is. That's my main gripe with this idea.

 

There is the High Line and the Hudson Yards project so what are you talking about? The Hudson Yards project would include all these things.

 

relatedcos.png

 

So yes in the sense the (7) project is needed.

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This just came to me. Wouldn't it make much more sense to build the new convention center/casino somewhere in midtown Manhattan, you know, where the people are, rather than basically in the middle of nowhere? Yeah, the new one would be closer to JFK Airport, but that's all that would be there. Would there even be a hotel there? If not, then it's even more stupid. The casino isn't going to bring the tourists Cuomo's expecting since they aren't going to schlep all the way from the middle of nowhere to their hotels in midtown.

 

And as Eric B stated, closing the Javits Center pretty much negates the need for the (7) line extension. We can't get the developers to build something there as it is. That won't get any better without the Javits Center. In fact, it will probably be even harder to attract developers without some type of anchor.

 

Actually, the (7) extension becomes even more important if the Javits Center winds up redeveloped into the kind of property Cuomo envisions because there would be residents who would need that extension to get across town. That might even be enough to get the 41st/10th Avenue station on the (7) built as that area already has many new high rises even before this.

 

The new convention center at Aqueduct is expected to be privately funded by the Casino Company (Resorts World/Genting) and is expected to use land next to Aqueduct that either is deserted or severely underused (if you are familiar with the area, you know if you go out the back exit at North Conduit on the (A) to get to Aqueduct, you can see how deserted that part on the other side of the station really is). There were already plans for a hotel on the Aqueduct grounds even before Cuomo's plan came about, so that likely would also get built as part of this.

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Try to pitch a casino to be built in Midtown Manhattan, and you won't be able to say "cha-ching" before you're backhanded by NIMBY-ism. Casinos are known to decrease land value and require additional police force. (Hence, they are often isolated and built in areas away from cities.) A casino by the Jacob Javits Center would be counterproductive to the main goal of the (7) Line Extension - to open up the area between Chelsea and Hell's Kitchen to high-end residential and commercial developers.

 

Also, people are used to traveling far for a decent casino [see: Atlantic City] -- one that you can take the subway to is already worth it.

 

Las Vegas seems to do fine with a whole row of casinos next to each other and making up a significant portion of that city.

 

Atlantic City to me seems to be on the decline. There's not much to do there anymore. Sure they have the standard slots and table games, but Las Vegas shows that you can do more than just that and get people to fly/drive there. Plus that whole street just a block from the boardwalk at AC seems pretty shady. Houses are run down and it looks like some 'hoodies' gathered in one area at a time... I wouldn't walk down that street late at night.

 

As for the idea of having the convention center in Queens while razing the one on the west side: actually this could benefit me as it would be a Q35 to (S) to (A) ride compared to having to go all the way to Manhattan and then taking the (7) back or relying on the M34 bus route.

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Atlantic City to me seems to be on the decline. There's not much to do there anymore. Sure they have the standard slots and table games, but Las Vegas shows that you can do more than just that and get people to fly/drive there. Plus that whole street just a block from the boardwalk at AC seems pretty shady. Houses are run down and it looks like some 'hoodies' gathered in one area at a time... I wouldn't walk down that street late at night.

 

 

 

Vegas has its fair share of riff raff as well, 2pac got shot on the Las Vegas strip.... a few hours prior, people from pac record label jumped a gang member in the lobby of a casino right after a Mike Tyson fight ended!

 

I heard that whenever they have a big fight in Vegas, gang members attend those events since the late 80s, I would imagine

Vegas tries its best to keep riff raff on or around the strip out of the news so it won't hurt tourism.

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second new york daily news article on the governor's plans for aqueduct.

 

The governor's plans i think could be enough to do the unthinkable: Force a re-activation of the lirr rockaway branch for subway use with a connection from the queens boulevard line, initially at least using existing provisions built in for such a branch on that line with considerations for future expansion that could include a new queens super express using a new queens tunnel from the sas at 79th street (that could include a station at 79th street/york-1st avenues as part of this) and use the never-previously used upper level of roosevelt avenue, connecting from there to the rockaway branch. It's something i'd already be willing to partially pay for as the casino operator, but if it also helped with aqueduct being a full-blown convention center and casino, then it would be really worth doing, with perhaps connections to/from multiple subway lines besides queens boulevard, especially from subway lines originating in manhattan.

 

If i were cuomo, i'd be pushing this along with the expansion of the current racino that would also include a total rebuild of the existing single-platform aqueduct racetrack station into a new, three-platform station (which i had previously proposed here and would include a total rebuild of the missing track on the line) that would allow for such a station to be a terminal when necessary because of work needing to be done on the rockaway branch. In addition, with a new convention center at aqueduct, i'd be looking if possible into extending the howard beach branch of the airtrain to aqueduct to serve the new convention center as well.

 

This to me looks like the best, and only shot of ever getting the rockaway branch of the lirr re-activated for subway use. The nimby's may not want it, but this is one time, especially if the governor pushed for it as part of a package for a new convention center at aqueduct that they could be overridden.

 

Stop freaking pushing for a subway station at 79th and 1st. We yorkville residents don't want the subway that close to us, how many times must i say this.

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Stop freaking pushing for a subway station at 79th and 1st. We yorkville residents don't want the subway that close to us, how many times must i say this.

 

 

We get the message Gorgor. Still Please tone down on the fonts that even Stevie Wonder could read.:eek:

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We get the message Gorgor. Still Please tone down on the fonts that even Stevie Wonder could read.:eek:

 

Lmaooooo, ok sorry but I wanted to make my point clear. He used to push for a station there so much last year.

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Who are you to say what is built there [79th st]? Of course it's a pita now because of the construction disrupting everyday life, but would you use that station if it were built?

edit: nm, 79th and 1st Av? Yeah that guy is really smoking the good stuff.

 

Vegas has its fair share of riff raff as well, 2pac got shot on the Las Vegas strip.... a few hours prior, people from pac record label jumped a gang member in the lobby of a casino right after a Mike Tyson fight ended!

 

I heard that whenever they have a big fight in Vegas, gang members attend those events since the late 80s, I would imagine

Vegas tries its best to keep riff raff on or around the strip out of the news so it won't hurt tourism.

 

Well I didn't have any problems the two visits I had there. I was safe walking on the vegas strip even at night. Those instances aren't the norm and that 2pac thing could've happened anywhere.

 

So I'm not saying Vegas is perfect, but from my 2 weeks total, everything seemed pretty good. Each casino property will have their own security to make sure nothing happens on their place.

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It makes the (7) extension seem more of a waste than most people see it to be.

 

I wonder if Mr. Cuomo is using an 8 ball to decide the fate of the Javits Center. How can he be so sure the property can be sold and redeveloped so speedily? What if it sits empty for another 10 - 20 years before it gets redeveloped? I thought the whole 7 extension process was to bring/build life to the west side. If the rzaing goes thru the 7 train will have been extended for nothing. But at least there will be a one seat ride... to nowhereland. Population = homeless, derelicts and hippies.

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