R211 Discussion Thread

[VIP]

13 hours ago, R32 3838 said:

this confirms that the numbers will be 4060-4499 for the base order R211A cars. I was Kinda right on the numbers but off by almost 100. makes me think the staten island cars are 3985-4059.

 

Hopefully Pitkin gets these first, Atleast the first 150, the rest could go to ether CI or Jamaica.

The SIR R211’s are not going to be four digit numbering. 

[T to Dyre Avenue]

1 hour ago, Missabassie said:

Why are they reverting back to 0-4, 5-9 numbering? I thought we solved this in the '80s, Should be 1-5, 6-0. I realise its not hugely important but.... just had to get that off my chest. 

As you were.  

I was thinking the same thing. Blame the “brain trust” at the MTA who gave us hundreds of R160s with 3-7, 8-2 numbering because they insisted on having the R160s directly continue the numbering started by the R143s. Then continued that practice with the R179s above 3237. 

[GojiMet86]

1 hour ago, VIP said:

The SIR R211’s are not going to be four digit numbering. 

 

4 minutes ago, T to Dyre Avenue said:

I was thinking the same thing. Blame the “brain trust” at the MTA who gave us hundreds of R160s with 3-7, 8-2 numbering because they insisted on having the R160s directly continue the numbering started by the R143s. Then continued that practice with the R179s above 3237. 

 

I would do 10000-11611 and get it over with. The 10000 series to represent something brand new and besides, many other systems use 5-digits and they have less rolling stock.

As it is now, I explained to someone how I think the numbering ***MIGHT*** proceed:

The R211A will most likely be 4060-4499 (440).

The R211S could be 3985-4059 (75).

The R211T could be 4500-4519 (20).

If the options (640+437) are excersied, you can have 3345-3984 (640) and 4520-4956 (437).

 

 

Now if what VIP is true, that the R211S won't be 4-digits (and instead 3-digits like the R44), then the initial 4060-4064 makes more sense:

R211S: 500-574 (75)

R211A: 4060-4499 (440)

R211T: 3400-3419 (20)

R211A or R211T option 1: 3420-4059 (640)

R211A or R211T option 2: 4500-4936 (437)

 

The R211 would be 500-574 and 3400-4936.

[TrainRider Railfan]

On 12/18/2020 at 10:15 PM, TrainRider Railfan said:

I've seen them running 60 footers before. They used 160s (too far to tell which kind from the sound), not sure if they were 4-car, 5-car, 8-car, or 10-car sets though.

I was there. I was also too far to tell which subtype but the trains were definitely 10 cars long so 5 or 10 car sets.

[trainfan22]

Beautiful train.

 

 

Interesting that they put the controller in the middle again..

 

 

Not a fan of the reduced seating, I wish they kept the doors the same size as the R160s.

 

 

Only bad news regarding the recent update is we gotta wait so long for the production cars to come! I wish the testing process was quick like the R142/142A and R143s were, pilot trains for those orders only tested for a few months and then the other cars started rolling in, oh well.

[Bosco]

9 minutes ago, trainfan22 said:

Only bad news regarding the recent update is we gotta wait so long for the production cars to come! I wish the testing process was quick like the R142/142A and R143s were, pilot trains for those orders only tested for a few months and then the other cars started rolling in, oh well.

To be fair, the R160 cars went through an entire year of qualification testing.  The other issue is that instead of jumping from pilot to production, we are making the pilot T cars, then pilot S cars, then production A and S cars.

[Lawrence St]

Don't forget the R179's as well. That took what, almost 2 years for qualification testing?

[Storm]

There are two possible scenarios as to what could happen with the delivery of the r211's

1) The r211's would be assigned to the E, F, M, R, A, C, G lines, and the most of the r160's would go back to C.I yard

2) Most of the R160A-2's and some of the R160B's would stay in Jamaica, while the r211's would go to the A, C, G, N, Q, and W lines

But which is more probable?

 

[Storm]

I dont think they'd move the R160's back to the  ,  and   because if they did, the yard swap would have been a waste of time.

[Bill from Maspeth]

21 hours ago, subwaycommuter1983 said:

6th Avenue will have to go CBTC once 8th Avenue CBTC is complete. What will happen to B/D service if both lines continue to use r68's after 8th Avenue CBTC is done and there is an issue on 6th Avenue?? 

Turn them at 59th St.

Yeah, it would screw up everything but that is their only choice.

[Storm]

5 minutes ago, Bill from Maspeth said:

Turn them at 59th St.

Yeah, it would screw up everything but that is their only choice.

I heard from a podcast that if both options of the R211 order were to be exercised, MAYBE there would be enough r211's to replace the  r68's that run on the , , , , , and  lines

[Bill from Maspeth]

2 hours ago, Lawrence St said:

Don't forget the R179's as well. That took what, almost 2 years for qualification testing?

That was because the cars had loads of defects.

[R32 3838]

1 hour ago, Bosco said:

They cannot convert a car to open gangway.  The carbody structure is entirely different, so even if they removed the bonnets, it still wouldn’t work.  

B ends not having seats I think is to be consistent with the recent R160 modifications where they were removed to increase capacity.  There are actually some lockers on the B ends, and they are designed in such a way that one could lean on them.  So they’re not quite seats, but they’re not entirely empty spaces like R160.

This Was said by that's why the B end of the cars are configured the way they are. Just look at how they there no seats and a hump on both sides.

 

35 minutes ago, Stormxx said:

I dont think they'd move the R160's back to the  ,  and   because if they did, the yard swap would have been a waste of time.

A good chunk of those r160's are going back. And it wouldn't be a waste of time, CBTC Training isn't a waste of time. by the time the option order cars come in, it'll be time to swap those r160's back to ether CI or somewhere else.

 

From the way it looks like, Pitkin, Jamaica and Coney Island will get these cars ENY will get the 8 car units for the

3 hours ago, GojiMet86 said:

 

 

I would do 10000-11611 and get it over with. The 10000 series to represent something brand new and besides, many other systems use 5-digits and they have less rolling stock.

As it is now, I explained to someone how I think the numbering ***MIGHT*** proceed:

The R211A will most likely be 4060-4499 (440).

The R211S could be 3985-4059 (75).

The R211T could be 4500-4519 (20).

If the options (640+437) are excersied, you can have 3345-3984 (640) and 4520-4956 (437).

 

 

Now if what VIP is true, that the R211S won't be 4-digits (and instead 3-digits like the R44), then the initial 4060-4064 makes more sense:

R211S: 500-574 (75)

R211A: 4060-4499 (440)

R211T: 3400-3419 (20)

R211A or R211T option 1: 3420-4059 (640)

R211A or R211T option 2: 4500-4936 (437)

 

The R211 would be 500-574 and 3400-4936.

 

5001-5480 is open as well, I could see them use 5001-5480 as well

they can use 5481-5664 once all the r46's are completely gone

 

I keep telling you guys, Jamaica will get a piece of this order.

 

open gangways is the obvious reason, are two lines that they're focused on getting those cars to. this is why I think Jamaica would get the r211T while the r211A's would be split between pitkin and coney (Base order) The could see the open gangway cars as well.

 

Also it's smart to make the 100% tech first vs. the CI lines because of upcoming CBTC plus if anything goes down on 8th ave, they can use 53rd st, (currently they can't now since its CBTC active now)

Edited January 19, 2021 by R32 3838

[Storm]

So ENY will get the 8 car units for the ,   and  or just the ?

[R32 3838]

1 minute ago, Stormxx said:

So ENY will get the 8 car units for the ,   and  or just the ?

 

It's mainly for the but could be used on the if they need a train.

[Storm]

The  and  already have some of the r143's, some r160's and some of the r179's. 

1 minute ago, R32 3838 said:

 

It's mainly for the but could be used on the if they need a train.

The  and  already have some of the r143's, some r160's and some of the r179's. So you are right because the  is in need of more cars

[Storm]

So the R211's will be used on the , , , , , , , , , , and  lines?

[Brighton Express]

32 minutes ago, Stormxx said:

So the R211's will be used on the , , , , , , , , , , and  lines?

Don't see it happening with the , but the  are going to get them for sure due to overcrowding.

If they're in Jamaica I'd also expect the  and possibly the  to use them as well. Don't know if ENY will get them, seems like they're finally getting the R179s under control

[R32 3838]

12 minutes ago, Brighton Express said:

Don't see it happening with the , but the  are going to get them for sure due to overcrowding.

If they're in Jamaica I'd also expect the  and possibly the  to use them as well. Don't know if ENY will get them, seems like they're finally getting the R179s under control

option order 2 there's gonna be 8 car units in part of the order, so ENY is getting a piece. The is out of ENY. These extra cars are for the , the MIGHT use them if they are just sitting in the yard and they need a train. the shares its R160's (8313-8376) and R143's.

Edited January 19, 2021 by R32 3838

[Storm]

probably the  would get the r160's back, while the  would get the r211's

[Storm]

Breakdown: (Yards getting the r211's)

C.I  () at least 15-20%

Jamaica () 30-40%

ENY () 5% (only if option 2 is exercised)

Pitkin () 40%

207 st () 10-20%

 

[Lex]

1 hour ago, Stormxx said:

I heard from a podcast that if both options of the R211 order were to be exercised, MAYBE there would be enough r211's to replace the  r68's that run on the , , , , , and  lines

That means someone is really bad at math. The 75 cars for Staten Island technically amount to a stock-equivalent shrinkage (enough cars to directly replace 60 R44s, which is less than the total number currently around, and that shrank from a somewhat higher number). The amount to fully replace the R46s is just barely covered by the rest of the base and both option orders. Worse, there are fewer R68As than R68s, and even that won't be adequately covered if added to the current R46 total.

[Storm]

11 minutes ago, Lex said:

That means someone is really bad at math. The 75 cars for Staten Island technically amount to a stock-equivalent shrinkage (enough cars to directly replace 60 R44s, which is less than the total number currently around, and that shrank from a somewhat higher number). The amount to fully replace the R46s is just barely covered by the rest of the base and both option orders. Worse, there are fewer R68As than R68s, and even that won't be adequately covered if added to the current R46 total.

Well, i mean you are right. The 752 R46's would need to be replaced with about 1K r211's. If the r160's do happen to come back to the , would there be enough r160's mostly-totally replace the r68/a's that run on the ?

[Storm]

@R32 3838 i know you wanna to see the  and  get the shaft being completely r68, but you gotta know this. As darkstar mentioned in the fleet swap discussion, the Ditmars blvd situation is a pain. With the R160's, you could just press a button and the rollsign changes. Yes, the  needs most of the r211s, but C.I yard needs some of the option order as well. The ,  and  need NTT's, not the 75 footers. If you want to point the middle finger at the  and , the riders will be pointing a middle finger at you.

[R32 3838]

4 minutes ago, Stormxx said:

@R32 3838 i know you wanna to see the  and  get the shaft being completely r68, but you gotta know this. As darkstar mentioned in the fleet swap discussion, the Ditmars blvd situation is a pain. With the R160's, you could just press a button and the rollsign changes. Yes, the  needs most of the r211s, but C.I yard needs some of the option order as well. The ,  and  need NTT's, not the 75 footers. If you want to point the middle finger at the  and , the riders will be pointing a middle finger at you.

I'm Not saying that, What i'm saying is that Pitkin should get em first, the only has 13 sets of R179's the rest of the line is still dominated by 45 year old r46's. CI just got the R46's and won't have them for long.

CI will get these cars but It's slated that the will likely get these first, then CI (Base order for standard cars might be split between pitkin and coney anyway) with the R211T's going to Jamaica.

Jamaica Will get a piece of this order, it's common sense. open gangway, CBTC and 58 inch doors. Why wouldn't they put them on their busiest B division lines which are the as well as the

And if CI does get these cars, they should go directly to the .