Q43LTD Posted January 12, 2015 Share #876 Posted January 12, 2015 you mean west end of m22. Plus that area has the M9. As for M106 you kind of have a point. The basis for that was to increase service hours on 106th street while making the M7 more manageable than it's current form plus compared to the current M5 it is not even close but I see your point the midtown segment of M7 might hurt this merged route. Ohh well. As for east end of M22 no change and it will go no further than 8th street heading north.Shut up please... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted January 13, 2015 Share #877 Posted January 13, 2015 (edited) MTA can try to make shorter more reliable routes though. : M102/103 can be adjusted to run more frequently with a truncation at 59th so neither is too long. M106 can be merged into M7 boosted M102&116 picking up the slack. M22 is practically duplicating the M9 I would have M22 replace M5 between chambers & east 8th. M5 is useless south of midtown 50th street. M4 is useless in upper Manhattan. It should go no further than Columbia university. LTD stop bus service on Broadway is an exercise in futility. Let bx11&35 take over fort Washington ave. With bx35 to cloister's museum & bx11 sharing a terminal with bx6. Distance riders on Broadway use block by block m5 as a local ending at 168th. As for m50 &12 not sure how 12 is doing reliability wise just wait and see. M50 hmm what parts are the most reliable? Few things dude... - In general, forget about combining north-south routes with solidified crosstowns... That's the WORST thing you can do to any portion of Manhattan's bus network.... Talking about merging M106 with M7, and running M22's to East 8th to somehow replace the M5..... - 59th is not a high turnover stop for the 3rd/Lex routes... You are just going to force more people onto subways & M101's by truncating the locals @ 59th..... - The M9 & the M22 more or less duplicates each other, but guess what - They serve different markets. Running the M22 to up to Greenwich Village via City Hall solves nothing...... - It's not that the M4 is useless in Upper Manhattan, it's that the MTA uses the drawn out M4 to supplement the M5 north of 3333 Broadway (a practice I don't care for much myself).... The obvious problem with what you're suggesting w/ the M4 though is that you can't end buses at Columbia (been over that already).... Also, speaking of "futility", sending any of those GWB routes to Cloisters would be just that - Futile.... There is no demand on either end for such a change; bronx riders don't want no hudson heights & hudson heights patrons tend to ride as far south as the Upper West Side - they are not trying to get to the heart of Dominican Heights; "err", Washington Heights..... As far as sending one of the GWB routes to Riverside drive with the Bx6, that would be one very circuitous routing for no real good reason.... Do the Bx6 to the M4 to the Bx11.... You are simply playing mapmaker without knowing how these routes are used, and it is blatantly obvious to me... All because you think Manhattan's routes in general are too long.... You can attempt to shorten the things, but the options you present here will drive current riders of the affected routes absolutely nuts..... Edited January 13, 2015 by B35 via Church 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted January 13, 2015 Share #878 Posted January 13, 2015 (edited) you mean west end of m22. Plus that area has the M9...... The M9/M22 west of city Hall, I can agree with you on; I would extend the M22 to where the M9 currently ends & cut the M9 back to City Hall.... This way, reliability increases tenfold with the M9 in the LES & East Village (which are no picnics), which needs it.... The side effect of running the M22 on down to commercial S. End av is that it would make the M20 virtually useless in BPC.... For all I care, to hell with 1 pl. (its old terminal before it got extended to S. Ferry), the M20 can be cut back to BMCC (or at best/furthest, to WFC (where the M22 ends) throughout most of the day, with only rush hour & weekend service running down to South Ferry.... The M5 is no where near as useless south of Rockefeller Ctr. (50th st) that you're proclaiming it to be..... Edited January 13, 2015 by B35 via Church 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted January 13, 2015 Share #879 Posted January 13, 2015 The M9/M22 west of city Hall, I can agree with you on; I would extend the M22 to where the M9 currently ends & cut the M9 back to City Hall.... This way, reliability increases tenfold with the M9 in the LES & East Village (which are no picnics), which needs it.... The side effect of running the M22 on down to commercial S. End av is that it would make the M20 virtually useless in BPC.... For all I care, to hell with 1 pl. (its old terminal before it got extended to S. Ferry), the M20 can be cut back to BMCC (or at best/furthest, to WFC (where the M22 ends) throughout most of the day, with only rush hour & weekend service running down to South Ferry.... The M5 is no where near as useless south of Rockefeller Ctr. (50th st) that you're proclaiming it to be..... OK that can work. The reasoning behind m5 truncation was that the M7,1/2/3/4(lesser) provide frequent service. & E 8th to chambers is shorter than it appears and that may service that area better than the m5. But your idea can work too. Question why does m9 need truncating? Based on observation people seem to like the m9 there and it does use side streets to Battery park. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted January 13, 2015 Share #880 Posted January 13, 2015 Few things dude... - In general, forget about combining north-south routes with solidified crosstowns... That's the WORST thing you can do to any portion of Manhattan's bus network.... Talking about merging M106 with M7, and running M22's to East 8th to somehow replace the M5..... - 59th is not a high turnover stop for the 3rd/Lex routes... You are just going to force more people onto subways & M101's by truncating the locals @ 59th..... - The M9 & the M22 more or less duplicates each other, but guess what - They serve different markets. Running the M22 to up to Greenwich Village via City Hall solves nothing...... - It's not that the M4 is useless in Upper Manhattan, it's that the MTA uses the drawn out M4 to supplement the M5 north of 3333 Broadway (a practice I don't care for much myself).... The obvious problem with what you're suggesting w/ the M4 though is that you can't end buses at Columbia (been over that already).... Also, speaking of "futility", sending any of those GWB routes to Cloisters would be just that - Futile.... There is no demand on either end for such a change; bronx riders don't want no hudson heights & hudson heights patrons tend to ride as far south as the Upper West Side - they are not trying to get to the heart of Dominican Heights; "err", Washington Heights..... As far as sending one of the GWB routes to Riverside drive with the Bx6, that would be one very circuitous routing for no real good reason.... Do the Bx6 to the M4 to the Bx11.... You are simply playing mapmaker without knowing how these routes are used, and it is blatantly obvious to me... All because you think Manhattan's routes in general are too long.... You can attempt to shorten the things, but the options you present here will drive current riders of the affected routes absolutely nuts..... actually the drawn out m4 is basically fooling people. Those going to UWS can take the . that is the reasoning behind that. Plus the shorter m5 won't need m4's help. That was what I was getting at. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MysteriousBtrain Posted January 13, 2015 Share #881 Posted January 13, 2015 (edited) Here are my ideas for Manhattan bus service: M12/31: merge these two routes: becomes M31 between Abingdon Square and Yorkville via 11/12 Avenue, 57 Street, and York Avenue. M39: Basically an extended B39 between Williamsburg and Grand Central. Runs via Williamsburg Bridge, Essex Street, Av B, 14 Street, and Park Avenue. Replaced old M1 on Park Avenue as well as Av B service on the M9. M98: Introduce midday service and extend it to Penn Station. M100: Extend it to the Bx1 terminal in the Bronx to provide a connection to the Bx1 and Bx9. M101: Add limited service between 116 Street and 163 Street-Amsterdam Avenue. Local service on 125 Street is retained. M102: Extend it to City Hall to support the M103, which will now be running every 15-20 min. Edited January 13, 2015 by MysteriousBtrain 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BxM4Woodlawn Posted January 13, 2015 Share #882 Posted January 13, 2015 Here are my ideas for Manhattan bus service: M12/31: merge these two routes: becomes M31 between Abingdon Square and Yorkville via 11/12 Avenue, 57 Street, and York Avenue. M39: Basically an extended B39 between Williamsburg and Grand Central. Runs via Williamsburg Bridge, Essex Street, Av B, 14 Street, and Park Avenue. Replaced old M1 on Park Avenue as well as Av B service on the M9. M98: Introduce midday service and extend it to Penn Station. M100: Extend it to the Bx1 terminal in the Bronx to provide a connection to the Bx1 and Bx9. M101: Add limited service between 116 Street and 163 Street-Amsterdam Avenue. Local service on 125 Street is retained. M102: Extend it to City Hall to support the M103, which will now be running every 15-20 min. M12/31: no, that wont work M39: yes I like that one a lot. pretty good. it serves an area that is currently empty M98: I like it a lot, also make it run out of MJQ Depot M100: I would say extend it even farther up to 246th St, replacing the Bx20 M101: I like this one a lot M102: I would say no, keep this one the way it is. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gotham Bus Co. Posted January 13, 2015 Share #883 Posted January 13, 2015 (edited) M100: I would say extend it even farther up to 246th St, replacing the Bx20 Have you forgotten the history of the M100? Before March 1989, it went to 246th during rush hours and to 263rd off-peak (Bx7 ran peak-only back then), and it was extremely unreliable the whole way. That's why it was split, the Bx20 was created, the Bx7 was enhanced. Each market gets its own bus. Here are my ideas for Manhattan bus service: M12/31: merge these two routes: becomes M31 between Abingdon Square and Yorkville via 11/12 Avenue, 57 Street, and York Avenue. M39: Basically an extended B39 between Williamsburg and Grand Central. Runs via Williamsburg Bridge, Essex Street, Av B, 14 Street, and Park Avenue. Replaced old M1 on Park Avenue as well as Av B service on the M9. M98: Introduce midday service and extend it to Penn Station. M100: Extend it to the Bx1 terminal in the Bronx to provide a connection to the Bx1 and Bx9. M101: Add limited service between 116 Street and 163 Street-Amsterdam Avenue. Local service on 125 Street is retained. M102: Extend it to City Hall to support the M103, which will now be running every 15-20 min. M12/M31: Headways don't match. If anything, combine M12 with either M21 or M8. M98: Extend only if M4 is shortened or split. Depot doesn't really matter, but it works better out of an uptown depot because that's where the morning riders come from. Edited January 13, 2015 by Gotham Bus Co. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BxM4Woodlawn Posted January 13, 2015 Share #884 Posted January 13, 2015 Have you forgotten the history of the M100? Before March 1989, it did go to 246th during rush hours and to 263rd off-peak (Bx7 ran peak-only then), and it was extremely unreliable. That's why it was split and the Bx20 was created and the Bx7 was enhanced. Each market gets its own bus. M12/M31: Headways don't match. If anything, combine M12 with either M21 or M8. M98: Extend only if M4 is shortened or split. Depot doesn't really matter, but it works better out of an uptown depot because that's where the morning riders come from. make it run to 246th st rush hours only 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q43LTD Posted January 13, 2015 Share #885 Posted January 13, 2015 (edited) Here are my ideas for Manhattan bus service: M12/31: merge these two routes: becomes M31 between Abingdon Square and Yorkville via 11/12 Avenue, 57 Street, and York Avenue. I don't think that will work. I don't care if they do come from the same depot now M39: Basically an extended B39 between Williamsburg and Grand Central. Runs via Williamsburg Bridge, Essex Street, Av B, 14 Street, and Park Avenue. Replaced old M1 on Park Avenue as well as Av B service on the M9. Leave the B39 as is. Do Park Av and Av B need bus service? M98: Introduce midday service and extend it to Penn Station. I don't think it needs midday service. If anything, send it back to 34 and Lex M100: Extend it to the Bx1 terminal in the Bronx to provide a connection to the Bx1 and Bx9. Why send the M100 back to the Bronx? There's a big reason why it was cut back to Inwood M101: Add limited service between 116 Street and 163 Street-Amsterdam Avenue. Local service on 125 Street is retained. Do that and you'd have to increase service on the M103 M102: Extend it to City Hall to support the M103, which will now be running every 15-20 min. Nope. Keep the M102 as is. Doesn't need to go back to City Hall Replies in red Edited January 13, 2015 by Q43LTD 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gotham Bus Co. Posted January 13, 2015 Share #886 Posted January 13, 2015 make it run to 246th st rush hours only Again, that would only recreate the same reliability problems that led to the M100 being split and shortened in the first place. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q43LTD Posted January 13, 2015 Share #887 Posted January 13, 2015 M12/31: no, that wont work M39: yes I like that one a lot. pretty good. it serves an area that is currently empty M98: I like it a lot, also make it run out of MJQ Depot M100: I would say extend it even farther up to 246th St, replacing the Bx20 M101: I like this one a lot M102: I would say no, keep this one the way it is. Have you forgotten the history of the M100? Before March 1989, it went to 246th during rush hours and to 263rd off-peak (Bx7 ran peak-only back then), and it was extremely unreliable the whole way. That's why it was split, the Bx20 was created, the Bx7 was enhanced. Each market gets its own bus. M12/M31: Headways don't match. If anything, combine M12 with either M21 or M8. M98: Extend only if M4 is shortened or split. Depot doesn't really matter, but it works better out of an uptown depot because that's where the morning riders come from. He (BxM4) wants the M98 out of MJQ for the sake of seeing RTS' on the route since Manhattanville doesn't have any high floor buses 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted January 14, 2015 Share #888 Posted January 14, 2015 He (BxM4) wants the M98 out of MJQ for the sake of seeing RTS' on the route since Manhattanville doesn't have any high floor busessadly we can agree on this. Why even bother repling to him? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fresh Pond Posted January 14, 2015 Share #889 Posted January 14, 2015 Replies in red Avenue B doesn't need it. With buses on Avenue A (M14A), Avenue C (M14D/M21, and Avenue D (M14D), one avenue without a bus in it isn't gonna do harm. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted January 14, 2015 Share #890 Posted January 14, 2015 Have you forgotten the history of the M100? Before March 1989, it went to 246th during rush hours and to 263rd off-peak (Bx7 ran peak-only back then), and it was extremely unreliable the whole way. That's why it was split, the Bx20 was created, the Bx7 was enhanced. Each market gets its own bus. M12/M31: Headways don't match. If anything, combine M12 with either M21 or M8. M98: Extend only if M4 is shortened or split. Depot doesn't really matter, but it works better out of an uptown depot because that's where the morning riders come from. how long were you lurking? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MysteriousBtrain Posted January 14, 2015 Share #891 Posted January 14, 2015 (edited) Replies in red Here are my ideas for Manhattan bus service: M12/31: merge these two routes: becomes M31 between Abingdon Square and Yorkville via 11/12 Avenue, 57 Street, and York Avenue. I don't think that will work. I don't care if they do come from the same depot now M39: Basically an extended B39 between Williamsburg and Grand Central. Runs via Williamsburg Bridge, Essex Street, Av B, 14 Street, and Park Avenue. Replaced old M1 on Park Avenue as well as Av B service on the M9. Leave the B39 as is. Do Park Av and Av B need bus service? M98: Introduce midday service and extend it to Penn Station. I don't think it needs midday service. If anything, send it back to 34 and Lex M100: Extend it to the Bx1 terminal in the Bronx to provide a connection to the Bx1 and Bx9. Why send the M100 back to the Bronx? There's a big reason why it was cut back to Inwood M101: Add limited service between 116 Street and 163 Street-Amsterdam Avenue. Local service on 125 Street is retained. Do that and you'd have to increase service on the M103 M102: Extend it to City Hall to support the M103, which will now be running every 15-20 min. Nope. Keep the M102 as is. Doesn't need to go back to City Hall M12/31: I guess that was a farshot. M39: Thought of the loss of service in 2010. M98: I think lex needs some help on weekdays. M100: I didn't think that small extension was as big as the 246 st deal. M101: I can live with that. M102: Another rusty idea I guess.... Edited January 14, 2015 by MysteriousBtrain 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYSubwayBuff Posted January 14, 2015 Share #892 Posted January 14, 2015 I like the M39 and I have beeb thinking about it for a while I think this bus route needs to be extended in both locations Shit id even make it a limited only line like the 103 but i think it has to run via the B32 routing from Williamsburg starting at Franklin and greenpoint to WBP, it would loop around the plaza and come over the Williamsburg bridge. In the city I would have it run up 2nd before terminating at 34th this bus would be mainly to serve the ppl in Williamsburg but if this provides supplemental service to the 15 (or even SAS?) Thats fine too 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gotham Bus Co. Posted January 14, 2015 Share #893 Posted January 14, 2015 (edited) He (BxM4) wants the M98 out of MJQ for the sake of seeing RTS' on the route since Manhattanville doesn't have any high floor buses Typical passengers don't care about that. As long as the bus is there and is able to move, they're happy. Edited January 14, 2015 by Gotham Bus Co. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q43LTD Posted January 15, 2015 Share #894 Posted January 15, 2015 Typical passengers don't care about that. As long as the bus is there and is able to move, they're happy.I know that but he's no typical passenger 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted January 15, 2015 Share #895 Posted January 15, 2015 I know that but he's no typical passengerhe is a nutcase 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BxM4Woodlawn Posted January 15, 2015 Share #896 Posted January 15, 2015 lol. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted January 15, 2015 Share #897 Posted January 15, 2015 I find it funnier that you're laughing at that, when it's directly stated to you ^^^^^ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BxM4Woodlawn Posted January 15, 2015 Share #898 Posted January 15, 2015 I find it funnier that you're laughing at that, when it's directly stated to you ^^^^^ look who its coming from, lol. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted January 15, 2015 Share #899 Posted January 15, 2015 look who its coming from, lol.stopyou're the last person who should be giving advice to anyone. Almost everything you come up with is a trainwreck and with bs logic and stupid mode bias based on bus model. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FamousNYLover Posted January 15, 2015 Share #900 Posted January 15, 2015 Here are my ideas for Manhattan bus service: M39: Basically an extended B39 between Williamsburg and Grand Central. Runs via Williamsburg Bridge, Essex Street, Av B, 14 Street, and Park Avenue. Replaced old M1 on Park Avenue as well as Av B service on the M9. Park Av northbound between 41st and 42nd St is CitiBike Station plaza. During summer time Park Av South at same block has outdoor cafe extended Will M39 turn around like via 39th, Madison, 42nd St, Lexington Av, 39th St? Or will M39 turn around via 41st St, 3rd Av, 42nd St, 5th Av, 40th St, Park Av? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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