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Via Garibaldi 8

MTA chief: I made turnstile jumper buy a MetroCard

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METRO

MTA chief: I made turnstile jumper buy a MetroCard

By Danielle Furfaro

November 15, 2018 | 4:50pm

mta-chief-claims-he-personally-stopped-s

Andy Byford

Natan Dvir

 

Get him a cape!

New York City Transit boss Andy Byford boasted on Thursday that he personally stopped a subway fare beater.

“The other day I happened to be going through a turnstile at a station and right next to me in the turnstile, right next to me, someone climbed over the turnstile,” Byford said during an MTA board meeting on Thursday. “So I turned and in a non-confrontational manner I showed him my pass and said ‘Sir, you need to go and buy a ticket.’ And he did.”

Byford told the story during a conversation about fare evasion, which MTA officials say has been on the rise. Some MTA board members want the agency to take steps to squash fare beating so it can raise revenues rather than raising the rates for paying passengers.

“It’s not a declining ridership problem, it’s a fare evasion problem,” said Larry Schwartz, an MTA board member and adviser to Gov. Andrew Cuomo. . “The paying riders shouldn’t have to shoulder more of the burden.”

Still, Byford doesn’t think bus drivers should risk their safety to confront riders who skip out on fares.

“We can’t ask employees to do that, to say you must enforce a fare to the point of putting yourself in physical danger,” he said.

But a life-size Byford mockup might do the trick, says acting MTA Chairman Freddy Ferrer.

“We might even consider a cardboard cut-out of Andy Byford standing front of a turnstile with his arms crossed,” said Ferrer.

Source: https://nypost.com/2018/11/15/mta-chief-i-made-turnstile-jumper-buy-a-metrocard/?utm_campaign=iosapp&utm_source=facebook_app&fbclid=IwAR0PyfFa3yt-Fxlyk-pdvqw5qyf1kxEK8UaMsRyj3wDorgoJkSrRHNxpgVk

Edited by Via Garibaldi 8
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Finally, someone wants to put a stop to fare evasion. Since it's Byford, thats even better!!

I personally think that paying the fare should be enforced to the point there the (MTA) literally has their eyes glued on every commuter who dares to evade the fare.

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This whole fare evasion thing is just a distractor from the fact that ridership is dropping due to unreliable service. While the buses are a different story, I personally think people going nuts over subway fare evasion is rather ridiculous. In most cases it happens because of people can't pay, and this upcoming budget crisis isn't going to help.

Also, fare evasion enforcement costs more $ than the amount lost, so it would really be just another expense to add the MTA's financial woes, which means more fare hikes, which means more turnstile jumpers.

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Just now, R68OnBroadway said:

This whole fare evasion thing is just a distractor from the fact that ridership is dropping due to unreliable service. While the buses are a different story, I personally think people going nuts over subway fare evasion is rather ridiculous. In most cases it happens because of people can't pay, and this upcoming budget crisis isn't going to help.

Also, fare evasion enforcement costs more $ than the amount lost, so it would really be just another expense to add the MTA's financial woes, which means more fare hikes, which means more turnstile jumpers.

Well the answer isn't to make the paying riders pay more either. Those people are also leaving the system and you can't blame them. Why should they pay more AND pay for the fare beaters for piss poor service? 

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14 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Well the answer isn't to make the paying riders pay more either. Those people are also leaving the system and you can't blame them. Why should they pay more AND pay for the fare beaters for piss poor service? 

What I was saying was that while I do not support fare evasion, enforcement of it is more expensive than its effect, and it's often used more as a political excuse than a genuine one. It's also less prevalent than people think.

You also have to think how little a dent this is in the MTA's finances. Remember that most of their $ is needed for salaries, so anything like what Byford mentioned is more of a publicity stunt or PR gimmick than an actual solution to the MTA's woes.

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1 minute ago, R68OnBroadway said:

What I was saying was that while I do not support fare evasion, enforcement of it is more expensive than its effect, and it's often used more as a political excuse than a genuine one. It's also less prevalent than people think.

You also have to think how little a dent this is in the MTA's finances. Remember that most of their $ is needed for salaries, so anything like what Byford mentioned is more of a publicity stunt or PR gimmick than an actual solution to the MTA's woes.

I completely disagree. That (MTA) Board member is correct. They estimate that fare beating costs them millions each year.  I think it's at least $8 million a year from their own estimates and that's being conservative. The reality is the (MTA) doesn't know how much they lose from fare beating each year because they don't track it aggressively enough, so even in 5 years at $8 million a year that's $40 million dollars. That could go to improving service.  It's small change with regards to their budget, but not small change in terms of service improvements that help riders.

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Ridership did not drop by 191,000 people a day because of fare beaters...

Focusing on fare beating while ignoring the people choosing to switch to other forms of transportation (such as single occupancy vehicles) because of the deteriorating quality of service is a dereliction of duty...

Also perhaps fare beating is up because the quality of service isn't worth $2.75? 🤔

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Now if Byford had gotten punched in the face by this farebeater, that would have been all over the news. 

Does anyone know if Byford travels around with security guards, or was he really all by himself when he claims to have done this?

Also, kind of disappointing that the head of the MTA calls it a "ticket" instead of a Metrocard

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Try fixing the system the fare evasion has nothing to do with poor money management. Never meet deadlines, don’t complete projects, Tons of Bus Ops “supervisors” burning your money in gas doing jack Sh*t. The bus network is out of date for the service demands of today. 

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7 hours ago, BreeddekalbL said:

This might get the restorative justice advocates mad I would say upgrade fare evasions to a felony and strictly enforce it.

A felony? Are you nuts? It should be just a fineable offense.

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"It’s not a declining ridership problem, it’s a fare evasion problem,” said Larry Schwartz....

There is a declining ridership problem AND a fare evasion problem.

The problem with his statement is that it's being put out there as if it's THE problem..... It absolves the MTA of inadequately providing its customers with the quality of service - to the point where there wouldn't be anywhere near as many people ditching MTA services (in any capacity) or farebeating as there are now.....

When it comes down to analyzing & finding solutions to a problem{s}, seldom anybody ever wants to look inward.

 

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8 hours ago, QM1to6Ave said:

Now if Byford had gotten punched in the face by this farebeater, that would have been all over the news. 

Does anyone know if Byford travels around with security guards, or was he really all by himself when he claims to have done this?

Also, kind of disappointing that the head of the MTA calls it a "ticket" instead of a Metrocard

When I seen him at Flatbush Ave station he had bodyguards.

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3 hours ago, R68OnBroadway said:

A felony? Are you nuts? It should be just a fineable offense.

Here's the deal. If you make a felony. People will think twice to commit fare evasion.

I don't want to turn this to the haves and have nots. However, I will say this. If you can stand in line and buy $220.00 sneakers than you can definitely afford to pay into the system for $2.75. (Although the service stinks at this time but paying into the system is better than stealing into the system)

Also, I get the people who are just not workable and aren't able to contribute to society. However, something has to give with this issue of fare evasion.

We are going into 2019 with no solution to the problem. Both subways and buses are having problems. The emphasis is employee safety and that has to be #1 and resources needed to fund extra transit cops to strictly enforce fare evasion.

Edited by Future ENY OP
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1 hour ago, trainfan22 said:

When I seen him at Flatbush Ave station he had bodyguards.

Ha, that's what I figured. If I had bodyguards, I'd yell at farebeaters too...

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18 minutes ago, QM1to6Ave said:

Ha, that's what I figured. If I had bodyguards, I'd yell at farebeaters too...

(In a British accent): Did you buy your bloody ticket??? lol

---

A quick note about the fair fares program... Supposedly the reduction in the cost only applies to passes (7 day or month passes), not pay-per-ride Metrocards, which has some groups that pushed for this up in arms. They claim that the people with more money can afford the passes, and those that are truly poor need to pay day-to-day.

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7 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

 

(In a British accent): Did you buy your bloody ticket??? lol

---

A quick note about the fair fares program... Supposedly the reduction in the cost only applies to passes (7 day or month passes), not pay-per-ride Metrocards, which has some groups that pushed for this up in arms. They claim that the people with more money can afford the passes, and those that are truly poor need to pay day-to-day.

 

Ooh interesting. Yeah, that's the argument I've heard a lot, and there is truth to it. I'm not a fan of this program, as you know, but if you are going to do it, at least do it in the most effective way...

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5 hours ago, R68OnBroadway said:

A felony? Are you nuts? It should be just a fineable offense.

When it was finable offense you still had the problem of evasion plus people ducking their fines and little to nothing was done to them

2 hours ago, Future ENY OP said:

Here's the deal. If you make a felony. People will think twice to commit fare evasion.

I don't want to turn this to the haves and have nots. However, I will say this. If you can stand in line and buy $220.00 sneakers than you can definitely afford to pay into the system for $2.75. (Although the service stinks at this time but paying into the system is better than stealing into the system)

Also, I get the people who are just not workable and aren't able to contribute to society. However, something has to give with this issue of fare evasion.

We are going into 2019 with no solution to the problem. Both subways and buses are having problems. The emphasis is employee safety and that has to be #1 and resources needed to fund extra transit cops to strictly enforce fare evasion.

I agree you make it a felony and strictly enforce it it will scare em 

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2 minutes ago, BreeddekalbL said:

When it was finable offense you still had the problem of evasion plus people ducking their fines and little to nothing was done to them

I agree you make it a felony and strictly enforce it it will scare em 

People are always going to fare evade. There is nothing you can do about. 

Making fare evasion a felony has to be the most ridiculous and draconian punishment for it. Legalism sounds good on paper but does not work well in practice. Should I be discriminated against and even potentially have rights stripped if I had to jump the turnstile once or twice when I didn't have enough for the fare? 

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15 minutes ago, R68OnBroadway said:

People are always going to fare evade. There is nothing you can do about. 

Making fare evasion a felony has to be the most ridiculous and draconian punishment for it. Legalism sounds good on paper but does not work well in practice. Should I be discriminated against and even potentially have rights stripped if I had to jump the turnstile once or twice when I didn't have enough for the fare? 

I think they should increase the fine and enforce the fare and call it a day. 

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1 hour ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

A quick note about the fair fares program... Supposedly the reduction in the cost only applies to passes (7 day or month passes), not pay-per-ride Metrocards, which has some groups that pushed for this up in arms. They claim that the people with more money can afford the passes, and those that are truly poor need to pay day-to-day.

That's why they've also been advocating for fare capping like London with the NFPS. In that case, you could pay day to day and they if you hit the "monthly" cap in a 30 day period, you would receive pass benefits for the rest of that 30 day period (essentially paying for an Unlimited in increments instead of paying $120 at once) 

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3 minutes ago, Around the Horn said:

That's why they've also been advocating for fare capping like London with the NFPS. In that case, you could pay day to day and they if you hit the "monthly" cap in a 30 day period, you would receive pass benefits for the rest of that 30 day period (essentially paying for an Unlimited in increments instead of paying $120 at once) 

I don't know, I mean I've never thought about it that way. I look at it as those of us that can afford the more expensive passes give the (MTA) our money in advance and when there's a problem, we have to pay again until we are refunded, while pay-per-ride users are generally refunded on the spot with a new card.  

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6 hours ago, R68OnBroadway said:

People are always going to fare evade. There is nothing you can do about. 

Making fare evasion a felony has to be the most ridiculous and draconian punishment for it. Legalism sounds good on paper but does not work well in practice. Should I be discriminated against and even potentially have rights stripped if I had to jump the turnstile once or twice when I didn't have enough for the fare? 

I agree for those who don't enough or are short on the fare they should be exempt from being penalized

Those who make an active effort to avoid paying the fare (including turnstile jumping) should be arrested

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This is such a stupid fear mongering topic. Most people nowadays just wait for someone with an unlimited to swipe them in. How about focus on improving the service. Because its annoying how the service consistently gets worse yet raises the fare all the time.

Edited by subwaykid256
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