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BM5 via Woodhaven

Queens' Transit Troubles

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"Though the Metropolitan Transportation Authority last month unveiled a $13.1 billion preliminary budget that did not slash any services— and actually extended a train line — the cries for more train and bus service in Queens are as fervent as ever.

Feature_080212_trainstation.jpg

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Last week, elected officials and civic leaders in Astoria demanded the W train and QM22 bus route return to the borough, while a similar contingent in northeast Queens called for a bus extension to whisk residents of Bayside, Flushing and Whitestone to lower Manhattan. In the middle of the borough, an abandoned Long Island Rail Road line has become, for some transit advocates, a last ditch effort to drastically fix the flaws of a transit system that has frustrated residents for generations.

 

Bus lines meander across the entire borough; east-west train lines stop dead in their tracks at Jamaica. Even with an intricate bus system, traveling throughout Queens, depending on the destination, can be an exercise in confusion and futility: a roughly seven mile trip from Jackson Heights to Richmond Hill, without an automobile, requires an F train and a Q10 ride that can take upwards of 30 minutes. For the borough’s less affluent residents, traveling in any direction simply takes much more time.

 

Manhattan Transfer

Those more affluent residents want additional service, too. Residents and elected officials have banded together to demand a commuter bus extension that would allow people in Bayside, Whitestone and Flushing to travel by bus to lower Manhattan without transferring to another bus or train. The QM20 bus leaves from Bay Terrace, traveling via the Clearview Expressway to Flushing before terminating in midtown Manhattan at 57th Street and 3rd Avenue. The QM7, departing from Fresh Meadows, reaches Pearl Street in downtown Manhattan. According to Whitestone resident Ali Fadil, this turns the hushed Fresh Meadows neighborhood into a parking lot. “The MTA said to me, ‘look this is a great, we would love to do it, the only issue is money and right now the MTA has no money.’” Fadil said.

 

Since the MTA’s financial outlook is now somewhat rosier, though still precarious, Fadil and elected officials like Councilman Dan Halloran (R-Whitestone) and State Sen. Tony Avella (D-Bayside) have lobbied MTA Chairman Joseph Lhota to create the new downtown service. The MTA now has $29 million to allot to new or expanded services, but a QM20 extension will not be included, according to an MTA spokesman. The Q24, Q27, Q30, Q42, Q36 and Q76 will all have extended or restored service.

 

Despite forecasting slight surpluses over the next few years, the MTA is relying upon biennial fare and toll hikes, no labor cost increases and tax revenues, at times unreliable, to remain consistent. Governor Andrew Cuomo should be doing more to shore up the MTA’s finances himself, argued Michael Murphy, a spokesman for the public transit advocacy group Transportation Alternatives. State and local subsidies account for only 7 percent of the MTA’s budget. Dedicated taxes kick in another 36 percent.

 

“The solution is monetary,” Murphy said. “Until there is a secure, sustainable source of revenue and fund expansion, we won’t see any improvement. People will keep paying more for less.”

 

Integration

 

Despite repeated calls for the restoration of the W train, a service that allowed more people to access local stops between Astoria and Lower Manhattan, the MTA said that there are no plans to make the W a reality again because the Q runs on the same route. The MTA will also not restore the QM22 bus, which provided express service between Jackson Heights and Midtown Manhattan via Astoria. Ridership, MTA spokesman Kevin Ortiz said, was just too low.

 

Transportation experts agree that public transportation in the borough is not adequate. But they do not believe a simple restoration of a train line like the W is the remedy for slow, unreliable service. One quirk of Queens transit is its segregation: a more expensive Long Island Rail Road and a much cheaper subway system both serve Manhattan-bound commuters. George Haikalis, president of the nonprofit Institute for Rational Urban Mobility, believes integrating the LIRR and subway system into one fare structure is the first step towards rectifying the many peculiarities of Queens public transit. With a fare increase due for next year, Haikalis said that now may be the time for the MTA to begin contemplating such a proposal.

 

“Right now, we have a system that causes people to take long bus rides to subways and use overcrowded subways,” he said. “We really should be moving toward a one city, one fare kind of structure. A Metrocard would be good for a bus, subway and commuter rail. Riders could pick a combination of routes that work.”

 

Haikalis said he wants the MTA to “think regionally.” He envisions Long Island City, now filled with glittering hotels and upscale restaurants, as a regional hub that could handle trains speeding from Long Island through to New Jersey. Enhancing the train capacity of Penn Station, rather than undertake a costly LIRR extension to Grand Central Station, would have been a smarter move for the MTA, Haikalis said.

 

Transit experts have also proposed a train line, known as the Triboro Rx, which would travel over existing freight rail lines, joining southern and eastern Brooklyn with Middle Village, Jackson Heights and Astoria, before continuing over the Hell Gate Bridge into the Bronx.

 

Rail Revivals

 

Smothered with dead leaves, fallen branches and decades-old detritus, the Rockaway Beach Branch represents, for some transit advocates, the last great hope for a public transportation revolution in the borough. Trains have not thrashed across the tracks, spanning from Rego Park through Ozone Park and continuing to the Rockaways, in a half century. Were the line to be revived, Queens would have the north-south rail link urban planners called for decades ago; New York’s master builder Robert Moses scuttled plans for railways along the Van Wyck Expressway, as well as commuter rails that would have ran down the middle of the Long Island Expressway and linked up with subways in Queens.

 

Assemblyman Phil Goldfeder (D-Far Rockaway), along with Assemblyman Mike Miller (D-Woodhaven), have begun pressing for a return of the Rockaway Beach Branch, shuttered in 1962 because of a trestle fire and declining ridership.

 

The MTA’s budget does not call for sweeping investment any time soon. Goldfeder is hoping Genting, the international gambling giant that runs the Resorts World Casino at the Aqueduct Racetrack, will help finance a rail revival that would bring more patrons to Ozone Park. Commuting times for south Queens residents could be slashed dramatically if the line were revived, but despite Goldfeder’s delivery of 2,500 signature petitions to the MTA, Port Authority and the governor, any hope of reviving the line is many years away.

 

Community Board 9 Chair Andrea Crawford has spearheaded efforts to turn the former rail line into a “Queensway” equivalent to Manhattan’s High Line. With the rusted rails running across parking lots of an apartment building and little league ball fields, land would need to be condemned for a new rail line, making a greenway a less expensive alternative.

 

Still, residents in neighborhoods like Forest Hills would prefer the rails to be left alone. The potential noise of people or machines, they have said, would be just too much."

Edited by Shortline Bus

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LIRR/MNR fares with NYC should be kept at the price of an express bus ride at all times, no peak surcharges or offpeak discounts.

 

Currently:

 

Zone 1 peak $7.25

Zone 1 off peak $5

Zone 3 peak $4.50

Zone 3 off peak $3.25

Zone 1/3 peak $8.75

Zone 1/3 off peak $6.25

 

Monthly zone 1 $163

Monthly zone 3 $123

Monthly zone 1/3 $193

Edited by Amtrak7

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LIRR/MNR fares with NYC should be kept at the price of an express bus ride at all times, no peak surcharges or offpeak discounts.

 

Currently:

 

Zone 1 peak $7.25

Zone 1 off peak $5

Zone 3 peak $4.50

Zone 3 off peak $3.25

Zone 1/3 peak $8.75

Zone 1/3 off peak $6.25

 

Monthly zone 1 $163

Monthly zone 3 $123

Monthly zone 1/3 $193

 

I couldnt agree with you more. Make at Least the LIRR 5.50 or 6.00, BUT above nope. From Jamaica and places east still in Queens to Manhttan it should be 5.50 or 6.00 for the extremes.

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Last week, elected officials and civic leaders in Astoria demanded the W train and QM22 bus route return to the borough, while a similar contingent in northeast Queens called for a bus extension to whisk residents of Bayside, Flushing and Whitestone to lower Manhattan. In the middle of the borough, an abandoned Long Island Rail Road line has become, for some transit advocates, a last ditch effort to drastically fix the flaws of a transit system that has frustrated residents for generations.

 

Bus lines meander across the entire borough; east-west train lines stop dead in their tracks at Jamaica. Even with an intricate bus system, traveling throughout Queens, depending on the destination, can be an exercise in confusion and futility: a roughly seven mile trip from Jackson Heights to Richmond Hill, without an automobile, requires an F train and a Q10 ride that can take upwards of 30 minutes. For the borough’s less affluent residents, traveling in any direction simply takes much more time.

 

Manhattan Transfer

Those more affluent residents want additional service, too. Residents and elected officials have banded together to demand a commuter bus extension that would allow people in Bayside, Whitestone and Flushing to travel by bus to lower Manhattan without transferring to another bus or train. The QM20 bus leaves from Bay Terrace, traveling via the Clearview Expressway to Flushing before terminating in midtown Manhattan at 57th Street and 3rd Avenue. The QM7, departing from Fresh Meadows, reaches Pearl Street in downtown Manhattan. According to Whitestone resident Ali Fadil, this turns the hushed Fresh Meadows neighborhood into a parking lot. “The MTA said to me, ‘look this is a great, we would love to do it, the only issue is money and right now theMTA has no money.’” Fadil said.

 

Since the MTA’s financial outlook is now somewhat rosier, though still precarious, Fadil and elected officials like Councilman Dan Halloran (R-Whitestone) and State Sen. Tony Avella (D-Bayside) have lobbied MTA Chairman Joseph Lhota to create the new downtown service. The MTA now has $29 million to allot to new or expanded services, but a QM20 extension will not be included, according to an MTA spokesman. The Q24, Q27, Q30, Q42, Q36 and Q76 will all have extended or restored service.

 

Despite forecasting slight surpluses over the next few years, the MTA is relying upon biennial fare and toll hikes, no labor cost increases and tax revenues, at times unreliable, to remain consistent. Governor Andrew Cuomo should be doing more to shore up the MTA’s finances himself, argued Michael Murphy, a spokesman for the public transit advocacy group Transportation Alternatives. State and local subsidies account for only 7 percent of the MTA’s budget. Dedicated taxes kick in another 36 percent.

 

“The solution is monetary,” Murphy said. “Until there is a secure, sustainable source of revenue and fund expansion, we won’t see any improvement. People will keep paying more for less.”

 

Integration

 

Despite repeated calls for the restoration of the W train, a service that allowed more people to access local stops between Astoria and Lower Manhattan, the MTA said that there are no plans to make the W a reality again because the Q runs on the same route. The MTA will also not restore the QM22 bus, which provided express service between Jackson Heights and Midtown Manhattan via Astoria. Ridership, MTA spokesman Kevin Ortiz said, was just too low.

 

Transportation experts agree that public transportation in the borough is not adequate. But they do not believe a simple restoration of a train line like the W is the remedy for slow, unreliable service. One quirk of Queens transit is its segregation: a more expensive Long Island Rail Road and a much cheaper subway system both serve Manhattan-bound commuters. George Haikalis, president of the nonprofit Institute for Rational Urban Mobility, believes integrating the LIRR and subway system into one fare structure is the first step towards rectifying the many peculiarities of Queens public transit. With a fare increase due for next year, Haikalis said that now may be the time for the MTA to begin contemplating such a proposal.

 

“Right now, we have a system that causes people to take long bus rides to subways and use overcrowded subways,” he said. “We really should be moving toward a one city, one fare kind of structure. A Metrocard would be good for a bus, subway and commuter rail. Riders could pick a combination of routes that work.”

 

Haikalis said he wants the MTA to “think regionally.” He envisions Long Island City, now filled with glittering hotels and upscale restaurants, as a regional hub that could handle trains speeding from Long Island through to New Jersey. Enhancing the train capacity of Penn Station, rather than undertake a costly LIRR extension to Grand Central Station, would have been a smarter move for theMTA, Haikalis said.

 

Transit experts have also proposed a train line, known as the Triboro Rx, which would travel over existing freight rail lines, joining southern and eastern Brooklyn with Middle Village, Jackson Heights and Astoria, before continuing over the Hell Gate Bridge into the Bronx.

 

Rail Revivals

 

Smothered with dead leaves, fallen branches and decades-old detritus, the Rockaway Beach Branch represents, for some transit advocates, the last great hope for a public transportation revolution in the borough. Trains have not thrashed across the tracks, spanning from Rego Park through Ozone Park and continuing to the Rockaways, in a half century. Were the line to be revived, Queens would have the north-south rail link urban planners called for decades ago; New York’s master builder Robert Moses scuttled plans for railways along the Van Wyck Expressway, as well as commuter rails that would have ran down the middle of the Long Island Expressway and linked up with subways in Queens.

 

Assemblyman Phil Goldfeder (D-Far Rockaway), along with Assemblyman Mike Miller (D-Woodhaven), have begun pressing for a return of the Rockaway Beach Branch, shuttered in 1962 because of a trestle fire and declining ridership.

 

The MTA’s budget does not call for sweeping investment any time soon. Goldfeder is hoping Genting, the international gambling giant that runs the Resorts World Casino at the Aqueduct Racetrack, will help finance a rail revival that would bring more patrons to Ozone Park. Commuting times for south Queens residents could be slashed dramatically if the line were revived, but despite Goldfeder’s delivery of 2,500 signature petitions to the MTA, Port Authority and the governor, any hope of reviving the line is many years away.

 

Community Board 9 Chair Andrea Crawford has spearheaded efforts to turn the former rail line into a “Queensway” equivalent to Manhattan’s High Line. With the rusted rails running across parking lots of an apartment building and little league ball fields, land would need to be condemned for a new rail line, making a greenway a less expensive alternative.

 

Still, residents in neighborhoods like Forest Hills would prefer the rails to be left alone. The potential noise of people or machines, they have said, would be just too much.

Took the text at the beginning and grew it into a more read-able size.

 

Also agree LIRR should be cheaper. Seriously, is it that good where it should be two or three times as expensive as the subway? The express bus is a good idea. I'd like something in the ballpark of CityTicket prices or below, but that might be "too cheap".

Edited by Mysterious2train

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Does anyone have ridership projections if a Rockaway Beach brance were to be revived? And where would the stations be? I don't mean to go off topic, since this is in the bus section, but I'm just curious.

Edited by Q10 Airport
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This is what I think the fares should be

 

Zone 1-3: $6.25 peak, $5 off-peak, $236 monthly

 

Zone 3: $4 peak, $2.75 off-peak, $118 monthly

 

Zone 1: $5 all times, $163 monthly

 

The Zone 1 & Zone 3 passes should be valid on the local buses & subways. The Zone 1-3 should also be valid on express buses. They should also allow transfers to services of equal or lesser value (Of course, this is all once SmartCards come out).

 

They should do something similar with the passes out to LI as far as having them valid on the other services goes.

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Please edit the font size. Thanks for the post.

 

Take it from me, Queens has an Okay local bus networks, that could be revised, but has a crappy express bus network with missing gaps and stuff on off peak hours and also during peak hours. Queens has one of the worst of the 4 express bus networks, or the worst. Only off peak service I have is QM15 which doesnt have Sunday Service. And some express bus routes through my neighborhood can use some off peak service
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Take it from me, Queens has an Okay local bus networks, that could be revised, but has a crappy express bus network with missing gaps and stuff on off peak hours and also during peak hours. Queens has one of the worst of the 4 express bus networks, or the worst. Only off peak service I have is QM15 which doesnt have Sunday Service. And some express bus routes through my neighborhood can use some off peak service

 

Well you can blame LIRR for that if LIRR and express bus get one fare structure or similar X63 ridership would plummet. Most of the queens expresses with good service are nowhere near the LIRR. The ones near LIRR will never warrant off peak service since the LIRR will always be chosen instead. X64 & 68 I can understand X68 however. Plus off peak ridership is well less than 10 ppl what do you expect service to be like on QM15 funny thing is it will cost em nothing to add PM reverse trips to manhattan. Edited by qjtransitmaster

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Take it from me, Queens has an Okay local bus networks, that could be revised, but has a crappy express bus network with missing gaps and stuff on off peak hours and also during peak hours. Queens has one of the worst of the 4 express bus networks, or the worst. Only off peak service I have is QM15 which doesnt have Sunday Service. And some express bus routes through my neighborhood can use some off peak service

 

 

Eh, I can't really think of a whole lot of gaps that aren't filled by the LIRR. The only thing is that off-peak, there should be more service to Lower Manhattan (I mean, all the Queens subway lines except for the (J)(Z) (and (M) from Middle Village) go straight into Midtown Manhattan.

 

As for the QM15, I don't think Saturday ridership is high enough to warrant Sunday service.

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Queens' transit trouble stems from the fact that the bulk of the borough (as physically large as it is) only have the QB lines & the roosevelt line as viable subway options.... Bus service (for the most part) is tailored to serve the two subway corridors...... It's not like here in brooklyn for example, where you have multiple bus routes that connect to the IRT, the brighton, the culver, the sea beach, the west end, and/or the 4th av lcl.... Or in the Bronx where there's bus routes that take you to the jerome av line, the concourse, &/or the IRT....

 

As for Astoria, you'd think they'd be humble w/ the subway service they get & their proximity to manhattan, but they're still talkin about bringing back the W & the QM22.....

Edited by B35 via Church
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Yes, transportation in Queens can be a pain.

 

IMO, the priorities need to be reactivating the Bay Ridge LIRR and old Rockaway LIRR, especially the Rockaway branch. It makes no sense for a branch of the (A) to go down there. If anything, the (A) should continue to Jamaica.

 

These lines won't be really crowded (except in certain segments), but they will be lifelines for lots of people and trim significant time off people's commutes. It is a royal pain the behind when I have to go out to Richmond Hill or South Jamaica or pretty much any neighborhood not within walking distance of Queens Blvd (and even then the commutes are long!!)

 

Why the city hasn't acted on this, is beyond me. But it's politics, obviously. My goodness, the right of way and the infrastructure is already there. If the Forest Hill people don't want it, pardon my language, but screw them. There doesn't have to be any station stops in Forest Hills.

 

It's just really frustrating how things work here sometimes, especially when I see Asian and European cities doing all of these things with their systems....

 

We are just so Manhattan centered. People forget Queens has nearly 3 million people living there.

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It does make sence for the (A) to go down there, it dosen't make sense for it to be the only line going down there, and that's why we need the Triboro RX, the Winfield Spur and the northern half of the Rockaway Branch to be built/reactivated...

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Being a daily rider who lives in Queens, i do have to admit transportation options are quite limited, and can be a hassle sometimes.

 

The 7 is the sole subway line that serves the area where i live. The Q23, Q38, Q48, Q58, Q66 and the Q72 bus lines, fortunately, are within walking distance, which makes up for it.

 

Bus service is okay, even though the headways on the bus routes operated by MTA Bus can get quite inconsistent.

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Geographically speaking, IMO the (A) making that sharp curve to the Rockaways looks out of place.

 

So basically the only way (by subway) I can get there is getting the (A). I either make a transfer in Manhattan, downtown brooklyn or at Broadway Junction--that's it--very limiting. That's what I meant when I said "doesn't make sense".

 

A hypothetical reactivation of the LIRR branch would open up way more transfer options, ease intraborough travel and provide more CONSISTENT service to the Rockaways.

 

The service to the Rockaways can be very inconsistent on the (A)--I know about that. It is hard for me to imagine living out there without a car--very hard. I have gone out there too many times and have had problems more than I am accustomed to on other stretches in the system.

 

Part of the issue is with track layout in lower manhattan and downtown BK on the (A) and (C). There are only two tracks...any delay, the whole line to Queens gets screwed up, including the local. Trust me, I have spent years dealing with this, especially reverse commuting in the morning.

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If you don't live right near a bus line in Queens, you essentially need a car. Tons of people drive from their houses to Union T'pke to catch the express into the city every day...meaning most parking spaces are taken up early in the morning and are not open until 6 or 7 pm.

 

A lot of the bus lines, like the Q60, are painfully slow and have lots of bunching. I really think the MTA needs to be more flexible with bus routes since so many areas in Queens are filling up with young people, like in Astoria. Obviously they can't just create new lines every month, but being more flexible with the number of runs, etc, on each line could potentially be very helpful without costing that much if runs are just shifted according to need. When NYCT and MTA Bus Co are finally integrated, this should be more possible. And there are a number of places that would be well served with a new line, even if it is only weekdays initially, to see how it goes.

 

I don't know why Forest Hills people are complaining- they have great subway, local, and express bus service aleardy. I doubt new service lines will directly cut through them , except for Queens Blvd, which is already packed. That might slow down run times for exp. lines and such, but won't bother residents in their apartments or whatever.

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I also think the borough can use better bus connections to Brooklyn especially NORTH-SOUTH routes. For instance, I always thought there should be a bus going North-South from Broadway Junction to Queens Blvd, essentially combining parts of the Q45, Q58 and B20 bus routes. This route can be a semi express, like what the B103 is.

 

Queens can use more B103 like bus routes as well.

Edited by Brooklyn

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I used to live in Forest Hills before. Outside peak hours I didn't have any bus service except for the Q23, which is a quite a walk. Metropolitan Avenue was 15 minutes, which felt like more. The subway was a 20 minute walk, and the only bus I had without such a long walk is the QM12. IMO I understand why residents don't want a subway line. It's really not only noise. See there are trees, probably 40 or 50 year trees, that have grown on the tracks. Taking down those trees would take time, money, and a lot of noise. And it's not like 1-2 trees, it's about 20-40 that have grown along it, and not only that, but most of the bridges are unstable. And taking plant life and stuff, well the DEP will have a serious problem with that. Queens does have an irritated transit system, with the most comfortable or the nearest subway being like far away.

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^^^^^^^^^^

 

I hear you, but these are costs that must be incurred. Those trees have to go. This is where there has to be political willpower making these things happen.

 

It's like there almost has to be a Robert Moses like figure again.

 

Out of all of the transportation projects being talked about, this one (to me) is a no brainer....so many people's commutes would be made so much easier that it wouldn't be funny.

 

The outer boroughs have to be developed. People work there too, especially between Brooklyn and Queens. There is over 5.5 million people in both of those boroughs combined. To not have better linkage and transportation seems to almost be ludicrous at this point.

 

And people have to think: if these lines were made, maybe certain train lines wouldn't be as crowded and as stressed.

 

There are people I know who live in Brooklyn and work in Queens and their commutes are slightly over an hour, on a good day. This is crazy when you consider that geographically, they are only 6 miles away!!!

 

So essentially, their commutes average between 5-6 mph.

 

To think that I can LITERALLY ride a bike and beat them by at least a half hour (most likely more) puts the icing on the cake.

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Queens can use more B103 like bus routes as well.

 

I know what you mean.... I think the Q67 should become a route like the B103.... It can be restructured & used to take ppl from areas south of QB to the (7) at hunterspt. av, for a quick ride into manhattan that way..... Just like the B103 is there to bring Canarsie folks to downtown bklyn. quicker (since the L runs nowhere near downtown), the Q67 can be morphed into a route that brings residents residing in certain areas of Queens to the 7 or for the E/F @ court sq. (basically, ultimately to manhattan, which is where ppl that utilize the Q67 in residential maspeth & middle village are headed) quicker than a route like the Q60 ever would.....

Edited by B35 via Church

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I have to say that I agree with Q23, CT and QM1. I had to travel to Queens on several occasions, and recently had to give tutoring sessions far out and I had to take three buses to get there because the area was served by express bus service, but only during rush hours. The QM5 and QM6 are not enough and quite frankly, as others have said, you need a car to get around in some cases which IMO can be WORSE than the commute on Staten Island. Now other people keep talking about oh there's the LIRR and this and that, but there are some areas where the LIRR can be a schlepp to get to and it would be better to have more express bus service and for that matter to eliminate the need for a gazillion transfers I also feel that some north-south local buses should be extended to act as feeders to express buses. I kept looking the map trying to figure out how I could get to my destination quickly without the long schlepp on the subway plus transfers to the bus and there really wasn't many options. Quite pathetic if you ask me. IMO Staten Island and Queens has some of the worst transportation options.

 

I also agree with Astoria fighting to get the (W) and QM22 back. The QM22 should be restored at some point and its hours extended because with just two runs each way, it is no wonder ridership would be low.

Edited by Via Garibaldi 8
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I have to say that I agree with Q23, CT and QM1. I had to travel to Queens on several occasions, and recently had to give tutoring sessions far out and I had to take three buses to get there because the area was served by express bus service, but only during rush hours. The QM5 and QM6 are not enough and quite frankly, as others have said, you need a car to get around in some cases which IMO can be WORSE than the commute on Staten Island. Now other people keep talking about oh there's the LIRR and this and that, but there are some areas where the LIRR can be a schlepp to get to and it would be better to have more express bus service and for that matter to eliminate the need for a gazillion transfers I also feel that some north-south local buses should be extended to act as feeders to express buses. I kept looking the map trying to figure out how I could get to my destination quickly without the long schlepp on the subway plus transfers to the bus and there really wasn't many options. Quite pathetic if you ask me. IMO Staten Island and Queens has some of the worst transportation options.

 

I also agree with Astoria fighting to get the (W) and QM22 back. The QM22 should be restored at some point and its hours extended because with just two runs each way, it is no wonder ridership would be low.

 

 

IMO the (W) should be restored as a weekday only with no weekday evening service.

Back to topic. On thus Queens bus/rapid transit issue, the express buses help but no one has mentioned a light rail system. I know i mentioned it before and a couple of guys have stated it would never work in NYC. Then why not? Light rail a modern version of trolleys was all over NYC in the (5) boros before the subway was bulit.

 

I am surprised none of the transit experts suggested it instead of buliding and extending existing or new subway lines. It would be cheaper and a whole network could be done in a couple of years instead of a decade or more for latest version of the 2nd Ave subway. It's a huge success all over America from nearby Jersey City, Newark and on west coast, San Diego and Portland, Org.

 

Plus the NIMBY's get peace and quiet with light rail say on Northern Blvd coordior, Brewer in SE Queens, Merrick Blvd just to touch the surface. Not sure what answer is, but light rail should be on the table for imporving rapid transit in Queens and maybe rest of outerboros as well at cheaper cost of a new subway line.

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IMO the (W) should be restored as a weekday only with no weekday evening service.

Back to topic. On thus Queens bus/rapid transit issue, the express buses help but no one has mentioned a light rail system. I know i mentioned it before and a couple of guys have stated it would never work in NYC. Then why not? Light rail a modern version of trolleys was all over NYC in the (5) boros before the subway was bulit.

 

I am surprised none of the transit experts suggested it instead of buliding and extending existing or new subway lines. It would be cheaper and a whole network could be done in a couple of years instead of a decade or more for latest version of the 2nd Ave subway. It's a huge success all over America from nearby Jersey City, Newark and on west coast, San Diego and Portland, Org.

 

Plus the NIMBY's get peace and quiet with light rail say on Northern Blvd coordior, Brewer in SE Queens, Merrick Blvd just to touch the surface. Not sure what answer is, but light rail should be on the table for imporving rapid transit in Queens and maybe rest of outerboros as well at cheaper cost of a new subway line.

 

 

That's because express buses are even cheaper than light rails, plus you don't have to build the infrastructure either for it. Simply put buses can go places that trains can't so even with light rail folks would be forced to make several transfers.

Edited by Via Garibaldi 8
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That's because express buses are even cheaper than light rails, plus you don't have to build the infrastructure either for it. Simply put buses can go places that trains can't so even with light rail folks would be forced to make several transfers.

 

 

Not everyone is going to Manhattan VG8. Stop with the excessive love of the Express bus VG8 lol. Light rail is for intraboro travel say within Queens. Plus light rail has their own right of way and not subject to traffic something the current Manhattan Express Bus does have a huge problem with. Have you been on a light rail in US Vg8? You need to explore more transit modes i.e going on Path, NJ light rail etc especially if you said at one point you want to work in operations planning.

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Not everyone is going to Manhattan VG8. Stop with the excessive love of the Express bus VG8 lol. Light rail is for intraboro travel say within Queens. Plus light rail has their own right of way and not subject to traffic something the current Manhattan Express Bus does have a huge problem with. Have you been on a light rail in US Vg8? You need to explore more transit modes i.e going on Path, NJ light rail etc especially if you said at one point you want to work in operations planning.

 

 

I'm sorry to tell you this but the purpose of light rail is mainly to get folks to the city and not really for intraborough commuting, hence my comments. I think for intraborough commuting, better local bus service with artics can accomplish the same purpose at a cheaper cost. As for the traveling comments, I've traveled extensively in Europe, Canada and in parts of the US, including NJ Path, NJ commuter trains, express buses and local buses, so I know what I'm talking about.

Edited by Via Garibaldi 8

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