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EE Broadway Local

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Calvin

Calvin

Posted
Posted (edited)

So, for the NYPD on the NYC Subway system: 
If you're onboard any line including the Shuttle(s), at the arriving stop, they (conductors, T/O's for Shuttles but that'll rarely happen) will announce that there are NYPD police officers at the platform for assistance or building at the station. Them boarding the train varies. 

 

Example: I'm on a (Q) train at Neck Road

* Conductor opens doors. Announces next stop and advises passengers that police are at the station if you need assistance. 

Car numbers aren't announced

Edited by Calvin
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RandomRider0101

RandomRider0101

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Calvin said:

So, for the NYPD on the NYC Subway system: 
If you're onboard any line including the Shuttle(s), at the arriving stop, they (conductors, T/O's for Shuttles but that'll rarely happen) will announce that there are NYPD police officers at the platform for assistance or building at the station. Them boarding the train varies. 

 

Example: I'm on a (Q) train at Neck Road

* Conductor opens doors. Announces next stop and advises passengers that police are at the station if you need assistance. 

Car numbers aren't announced

Got it. Yesterday I heard this type of announcement for the first time when reaching 14th St. Union Square.

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Trainmaster5 Motorman (Retired)

Trainmaster5

Posted
Posted

I recently posted on the R211 thread about certain terminology and things and how my contemporaries and I were taught and I got a message that I was confusing some folks. I’m going to try to explain this in simple terms. What I called the “ Bible “ is the division timetable. I’ve been lucky enough to have a rabbi who taught me and others what that means in RTO. I’ve seen many people posting about being delayed at Nostrand Avenue or President Street for minutes almost daily. The reason why it happens is because that’s what the timetable calls for. My instructor went to Operations and Planning after the Trainmaster title was phased out. He wrote schedules, especially for the (5) line. He showed us how every pm rush was handled on the N/B Lex from Borough Hall to Grand Central. Between 4:45 and 5:25 pm x amount of trains were scheduled to head through the corridor. Back then it included (4) trains from Flatbush to Woodlawn and (5) trains to 241 st or Dyre. Trains every 90 seconds or 120 seconds. I left Utica at 5pm to WPR and my follower left 2 minutes later to Dyre. Between Kingston and Nostrand a (4) would cross ahead of me and we would form a caravan up to Grand Central. We were staged and slotted that way by the tower operator at the junction or later on Utica tower took that job. What I’m trying to point out is that the trains were not delayed even though some riders thought they were. S/B at Franklin Avenue was a similar situation. The ATD on duty would tell the tower operator at the junction what trains he had, local or express, their destinations, and either Utica or Flatbush would tell the tower operator what order they wanted the trains to be sent to the terminal. The new ATS system was being used when I retired so it didn’t really matter to me although I did point out many things that didn’t actually make sense to me. Things that a local supervisor could do to override the mistakes that the ATS computer made. I had a job that started at Dyre for years before and after ATS took over and at least twice a week the computer would line me up with an improper lineup when I got south of Franklin at the junction. When you see a train slow down or completely stop there’s usually a good reason for it.

Two other things I would point out to you rail fans who are interested in getting a job in RTO. When I was a new C/R school car taught all new students how to read the iron (switches) every day. Terminal Dispatchers taught us how to schedule trains when things got screwed up. It’s not that easy to run a “flex” on a line like the (5) which has numerous terminals and train crews based in different locations and boroughs. Hopefully I haven’t made things more confusing than before. Carry on. We’ve got some current employees on the boards who can correct me if I’m wrong.

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CenSin

CenSin

Posted
Posted
On 10/28/2022 at 2:34 AM, Trainmaster5 said:

I’ve seen many people posting about being delayed at Nostrand Avenue or President Street for minutes almost daily. The reason why it happens is because that’s what the timetable calls for. My instructor went to Operations and Planning after the Trainmaster title was phased out. He wrote schedules, especially for the (5) line. He showed us how every pm rush was handled on the N/B Lex from Borough Hall to Grand Central. Between 4:45 and 5:25 pm x amount of trains were scheduled to head through the corridor.

I thought this was common knowledge. It’s not rare to hear a conductor announce that a train is being held because it was ahead of schedule or to maintain even spacing of trains. In some cases it was obvious to anyone doing the AM/PM commutes like when southbound (N) trains were held at Bay Parkway or northbound (N) trains held at 59 Street during the Sea Beach track reconstruction period.

Basically reads to the layperson: “we do not intend trips to be that quick because the average trip does not meet those high standards, so we have to add minutes to pad your commute.”

On 10/28/2022 at 2:34 AM, Trainmaster5 said:

What I’m trying to point out is that the trains were not delayed even though some riders thought they were.

That’s a technicality. People riding the trains are only interested in shortening their commute.

I’m not saying the system as it runs is unjustifiable, but from a marketing/PR perspective, this does not come off positively.

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MarkGuy Train Operator

MarkGuy

Posted
Posted
On 10/25/2022 at 9:48 AM, texassubwayfan555 said:

Will anyone answer my question about SMEEs on the last page?

SMEE's definitely have dynamic breaking, contrary to what has been said here.

SMEE stands for Self Lapping Mechanical Electrical Equipment. What that references is the train's ability to set itself up for dynamic braking when in the coast position for the master controller.

Essentially what happens when you put the M/C into the off/coast position, the traction motors reconnect as generators to create electricity for the dynamic braking. The heat from this gets discharged via the train's resistor grids located under the car body.

Any errors here, anyone who has also operated down here who can spot them, please let me know.

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darkstar8983

darkstar8983

Posted
Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, Q43LTD said:

6 Av local southbound is a bit of an overload. The (C) (F) and (R) using the tracks

yeah, which is why I'm wondering why they didn't alter the Broadway Line work as follows:

(N) running between Coney Island and 57 St-7 Av, then via the (Q) to 96 St-2 Av via 4 Av Express/Bridge/Broadway Express,

(Q) suspended (shuttle buses extended to Atlantic Av-Barclays Center)

(R) via 63 St (but still Broadway)

 

**I understand the reason why the (C) is moved to 6 Av. Today I took the (E) train and there was a lot of flagging on the downtown 8 Av Line (too much invasive work to allow a conga line backup of the (A)(C)(E) trains all on 8 Av Express, especially with the new flagging rules - 10mph speed restrictions through work zones and extended work zones distances).

Edited by darkstar8983
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Around the Horn

Around the Horn

Posted
Posted
5 hours ago, darkstar8983 said:

yeah, which is why I'm wondering why they didn't alter the Broadway Line work as follows:

(N) running between Coney Island and 57 St-7 Av, then via the (Q) to 96 St-2 Av via 4 Av Express/Bridge/Broadway Express,

(Q) suspended (shuttle buses extended to Atlantic Av-Barclays Center)

(R) via 63 St (but still Broadway)

 

**I understand the reason why the (C) is moved to 6 Av. Today I took the (E) train and there was a lot of flagging on the downtown 8 Av Line (too much invasive work to allow a conga line backup of the (A)(C)(E) trains all on 8 Av Express, especially with the new flagging rules - 10mph speed restrictions through work zones and extended work zones distances).

They don't have enough buses to do an Atlantic-Coney Island shuttle bus. Traffic on Flatbush between Grand Army Plaza and Atlantic makes it virtually impossible to do it in under an hour each way which means you'd need like 50 buses out there minimum (not counting buses already at each terminal.)

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BM5 via Woodhaven

BM5 via Woodhaven

Posted
Posted (edited)
13 hours ago, Q43LTD said:

6 Av local southbound is a bit of an overload. The (C) (F) and (R) using the tracks

 

6 hours ago, darkstar8983 said:

yeah, which is why I'm wondering why they didn't alter the Broadway Line work as follows:

(N) running between Coney Island and 57 St-7 Av, then via the (Q) to 96 St-2 Av via 4 Av Express/Bridge/Broadway Express,

(Q) suspended (shuttle buses extended to Atlantic Av-Barclays Center)

(R) via 63 St (but still Broadway)

 

**I understand the reason why the (C) is moved to 6 Av. Today I took the (E) train and there was a lot of flagging on the downtown 8 Av Line (too much invasive work to allow a conga line backup of the (A)(C)(E) trains all on 8 Av Express, especially with the new flagging rules - 10mph speed restrictions through work zones and extended work zones distances).

I think various factors went into that decision. With the ongoing bus shortage, and with how much of a PITA it can be going down Flatbush Avenue, I think it was the best possible option to run them from Prospect Park. Plus, the (R) is not a full time Broadway local, so it would be a service cut during late night hours if it was just the (N). 

I wonder if they could have done things slightly differently to avoid the issues on 6th Avenue, with the (C) and (R) switching at various points. It might not seem like it's that bad because of their headways, but keep in mind you have all four lines operating every 12 minutes, and with both merges, the local track will have (C)(F)(R) all together (meaning a combined 3 minute headway, IF they are spaced out evenly, which surprise surprise...they weren't). Also one switch problem or incident and then you're screwed with all this local-express switching. If the switch from the SB local track at West 4th Street is stuck to the local position for example, it would be easier to have the (R) switch over at 42nd Street when there's nothing else going on in that area. There was an issue on the local tracks this weekend at some point and they had some (F)(R) trains switching to the express track south of 42nd Street, on top of having the (C) trains cross over to the local track at the same location. Yikes!

They could have rerouted the (E) instead onto 6th Avenue potentially and we wouldn't be dealing with all this merging to/from the express tracks. It would just be the (R) merging to the express tracks approaching West 4th (and vice versa in the other direction), rather than two merges. You're dealing with the same merging north of 47th-50th Streets on the local track, but you wouldn't have the mergers between 42nd & 34th Streets. The downtown (E) would switch off to the 8th Avenue line south of West 4th, but there's less train traffic with the (R) already being on the express track. So TLDR, the switching and mergers would The local tracks  affect the (D)(R) a less, and the (F) would be affected by about a similar amount. The (C) gets to remain on 8th Avenue, and Broadway service would remain consistent for the whole weekend. This is what I would have ideally have gone with.  

---------------------------------------------------

If that was not an option for some reason, then I guess maybe perhaps suspend the (C), and have the (B) run from 168th Street to Prospect Park (making all weekday (B) stops plus the three (C) stops north of 145th Street). You would need to have the (E) would run to/from Euclid Avenue during daytime hours to replace the (C) in Brooklyn. Then I guess you could have the (N)(R) via Broadway ( (N) to 96th, and (R) via 63rd). The (Q) would not be running in this scenario. 

^^^However, where that becomes and issue is during late nights, because you don't need the (A)(B)(D) all on CPW, and running the (B) as a shuttle from Prospect Park to Atlantic would just be completely annoying after having dealt with the shuttle buses. However if you send the (B) into Manhattan, but not up CPW, where would it go? To 96th Street would overserve the 2nd Avenue portion (since the (N) would already be there) while being a service cut on Broadway, and running it on Broadway would make it a (Q), on top of having an inconsistent day/night service pattern south of Atlantic. Late night shuttle buses running to Atlantic Avenue I guess would mean less transferring, but you need more transfers, and again the subway commutes would be inconsistent and riders would have to be extra mindful of that, which would be a headache all around. 

Edited by BM5 via Woodhaven
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Q43LTD

Q43LTD

Posted
Posted
17 hours ago, darkstar8983 said:

yeah, which is why I'm wondering why they didn't alter the Broadway Line work as follows:

(N) running between Coney Island and 57 St-7 Av, then via the (Q) to 96 St-2 Av via 4 Av Express/Bridge/Broadway Express,

(Q) suspended (shuttle buses extended to Atlantic Av-Barclays Center)

(R) via 63 St (but still Broadway)

 

**I understand the reason why the (C) is moved to 6 Av. Today I took the (E) train and there was a lot of flagging on the downtown 8 Av Line (too much invasive work to allow a conga line backup of the (A)(C)(E) trains all on 8 Av Express, especially with the new flagging rules - 10mph speed restrictions through work zones and extended work zones distances).

What would have went to Astoria under this plan?

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Vulturious

Vulturious

Posted
Posted
13 hours ago, BM5 via Woodhaven said:

 

I think various factors went into that decision. With the ongoing bus shortage, and with how much of a PITA it can be going down Flatbush Avenue, I think it was the best possible option to run them from Prospect Park. Plus, the (R) is not a full time Broadway local, so it would be a service cut during late night hours if it was just the (N). 

I wonder if they could have done things slightly differently to avoid the issues on 6th Avenue, with the (C) and (R) switching at various points. It might not seem like it's that bad because of their headways, but keep in mind you have all four lines operating every 12 minutes, and with both merges, the local track will have (C)(F)(R) all together (meaning a combined 3 minute headway, IF they are spaced out evenly, which surprise surprise...they weren't). Also one switch problem or incident and then you're screwed with all this local-express switching. If the switch from the SB local track at West 4th Street is stuck to the local position for example, it would be easier to have the (R) switch over at 42nd Street when there's nothing else going on in that area. There was an issue on the local tracks this weekend at some point and they had some (F)(R) trains switching to the express track south of 42nd Street, on top of having the (C) trains cross over to the local track at the same location. Yikes!

They could have rerouted the (E) instead onto 6th Avenue potentially and we wouldn't be dealing with all this merging to/from the express tracks. It would just be the (R) merging to the express tracks approaching West 4th (and vice versa in the other direction), rather than two merges. You're dealing with the same merging north of 47th-50th Streets on the local track, but you wouldn't have the mergers between 42nd & 34th Streets. The downtown (E) would switch off to the 8th Avenue line south of West 4th, but there's less train traffic with the (R) already being on the express track. So TLDR, the switching and mergers would The local tracks  affect the (D)(R) a less, and the (F) would be affected by about a similar amount. The (C) gets to remain on 8th Avenue, and Broadway service would remain consistent for the whole weekend. This is what I would have ideally have gone with.  

---------------------------------------------------

If that was not an option for some reason, then I guess maybe perhaps suspend the (C), and have the (B) run from 168th Street to Prospect Park (making all weekday (B) stops plus the three (C) stops north of 145th Street). You would need to have the (E) would run to/from Euclid Avenue during daytime hours to replace the (C) in Brooklyn. Then I guess you could have the (N)(R) via Broadway ( (N) to 96th, and (R) via 63rd). The (Q) would not be running in this scenario. 

^^^However, where that becomes and issue is during late nights, because you don't need the (A)(B)(D) all on CPW, and running the (B) as a shuttle from Prospect Park to Atlantic would just be completely annoying after having dealt with the shuttle buses. However if you send the (B) into Manhattan, but not up CPW, where would it go? To 96th Street would overserve the 2nd Avenue portion (since the (N) would already be there) while being a service cut on Broadway, and running it on Broadway would make it a (Q), on top of having an inconsistent day/night service pattern south of Atlantic. Late night shuttle buses running to Atlantic Avenue I guess would mean less transferring, but you need more transfers, and again the subway commutes would be inconsistent and riders would have to be extra mindful of that, which would be a headache all around. 

I think it's possible to run (B) trains during weekends days and let the (Q) take back service during late nights. One situation I can compare to when it comes to something like this would be when the (C) went to the Bronx and late nights ran shuttle service signed up as the (D). Obviously, the (Q) isn't running shuttle service in this scenario, but it's not that far fetched either. I don't think running single-track shuttle service between Atlantic Av and Prospect Park would hurt as much either, but who knows.

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Calvin

Calvin

Posted
Posted

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/tourist-assaulted-robbed-aboard-4-train-after-attacker-said-why-are-you-looking-at-me/ar-AA13FLP0?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=6053a1fcaad847fe9b873fc0360a1ff6

Advisory to be careful of your surroundings or coming across strangers on-board the subway at any time. A tourist was robbed at late AM rush hour at Fulton Center. 

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