Fresh Pond Posted January 21, 2016 Share #426 Posted January 21, 2016 No, the first 8090 was definitely the pilot for the order along with 8091. Supposedly there were some issues when it was rejected, and MTA would rather have a new bus. But again, don't quote me on that one until I make my next trip to ENY. You can quote me on this one though. Now that we are finally into 2016, we can gear up for the options! Updating the title post now..... XD40's 7483-7734 (252) and Nova's 8504-8671 (168) are on the horizon. So is this option pushing out every last Orion/RTS? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aemoreira81 Posted January 21, 2016 Share #427 Posted January 21, 2016 So is this option pushing out every last Orion/RTS? It could also be enough to push out some of the first hybrids too. Some of the RTS buses are beyond done as they're 20 years old. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T J Trainman Posted January 21, 2016 Share #428 Posted January 21, 2016 I guess this new batch is being built asap..... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewFlyer 230 Posted January 21, 2016 Share #429 Posted January 21, 2016 New Flyer is becoming like Orion to the MTA. I would imagine this order being able to wipe out all pre 2000 buses from Queens and the Bronx and most from Brooklyn and Manhattan. I wonder why Casey Stengel got XD40's as suppose to LFS's which they already have the parts for because of the artics. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Around the Horn Posted January 21, 2016 Share #430 Posted January 21, 2016 (edited) New Flyer is becoming like Orion to the MTA. I would imagine this order being able to wipe out all pre 2000 buses from Queens and the Bronx and most from Brooklyn and Manhattan. I wonder why Casey Stengel got XD40's as suppose to LFS's which they already have the parts for because of the artics. They originally were going to keep the 72 Orions in best shape at CS but they realized that they need to replace them now. Only the New Flyer contract had an option order for 72 buses in it. They chose to add XD40s now instead of wait for the LFS options to start later. Edited January 21, 2016 by Around the Horn 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
East New York Posted January 22, 2016 Author Share #431 Posted January 22, 2016 (edited) Actually we are all getting ahead of ourselves here! lol Both contracts still have open option orders for one. The next batches will be exercised soon. The 72 was just the first option award for NF. This will be their second.. The combined option delivery schedule for both NFI and Nova are as follows: 60 buses by June 120 buses between July-September 220 buses between October-December 20 buses between January and February 2017 (Nova) This means we still have plenty of RTS buses that will be running around...... I feel like a dad repeating myself! lol. I told yall for the last 3 years that through 2017 MTA was Guaranteed to keep most of the remaining buses buses in the 4900-5249 range, as well as the best 25 out of the 9350-9699 series. Anyone remember those posts? Through 2018-2019 There are roughly 658 RTS' in service. 658-420 New options leaves 238 buses remaining in February of next year. The remaining 100 or so buses in the 8750-9349 range will be retired by August 2016. The remaining 218 or so buses in the 9350-9699 batch, should be gone by December with the best 5-7 of them likely to still be hanging on. That leaves us with 340 buses remaining in the 4900-5249 range. About 75 of these will be retired and put int storage. This leaves us with roughly 238 of the best 9600's, and 4900-5249. By Summer/Fall 2017 Those are going to start making their way to the scrapper. There are 208 remaining 40 foot options. By the end of 2017 I expect the best 145 of the 5105-5249 batch to still be around. By 2018 no more than 30-75 should be left on the roster. By 2019 Hopefully the MTA throws us an RTS retirement party. The last remaining buses are said to iconically retire out of Quill (Manhattan Division Headquarters) East New York (Surface Transit Headquarters). However, rumor does have it that depending on the condition of the both RTS buses, and the OG hybrids in 2019, all 145 of the 5105-5245 could still be around, with possible more. They could start to retire the 2003 models which are 6365-6391, and the last of the '02 ESB's end at 6489. If they retire all 125 or even more of the newer ones, MTA could be sticking to there original plans of keeping the RTS through 2020. MTA is playing this one by ear, but the hybrids are holding up a bit better than expected, and MTA maintenance are pro's on the model now. The OG's will be 16 by then, and the remaining RTS will be 30. The remaining 208 options should have been exercised by then. Thats when the OG's will begin there retirement. There there will be 200 diesels and 75 hybrids that will begin to replace everything in the 6365-6639 range. If the 3500's aren't re-powered by then they will be up next. Edited January 22, 2016 by East New York 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B22viaAtlanticAv Posted January 22, 2016 Share #432 Posted January 22, 2016 Lol! Knowing the MTA, the RTS might make it to 2020... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewFlyer 230 Posted January 22, 2016 Share #433 Posted January 22, 2016 Well it's good to know that MTA bus won't be stuck with the oldest hand me downs this time around. I noticed nothing was said about ECH and any new buses so I'm guessing we will be finding out what happens the Q50 and Bx23 when the time comes. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BDNQ2345 Posted January 22, 2016 Share #434 Posted January 22, 2016 Actually we are all getting ahead of ourselves here! lol Both contracts still have open option orders for one. The next batches will be exercised soon. The 72 was just the first option award for NF. This will be their second.. The combined option delivery schedule for both NFI and Nova are as follows: 60 buses by June 120 buses between July-September 220 buses between October-December 20 buses between January and February 2017 (Nova) This means we still have plenty of RTS buses that will be running around...... I feel like a dad repeating myself! lol. I told yall for the last 3 years that through 2017 MTA was Guaranteed to keep most of the remaining buses buses in the 4900-5249 range, as well as the best 25 out of the 9350-9699 series. Anyone remember those posts? Through 2018-2019 There are roughly 658 RTS' in service. 658-420 New options leaves 238 buses remaining in February of next year. The remaining 100 or so buses in the 8750-9349 range will be retired by August 2016. The remaining 218 or so buses in the 9350-9699 batch, should be gone by December with the best 5-7 of them likely to still be hanging on. That leaves us with 340 buses remaining in the 4900-5249 range. About 75 of these will be retired and put int storage. This leaves us with roughly 238 of the best 9600's, and 4900-5249. By Summer/Fall 2017 Those are going to start making their way to the scrapper. There are 208 remaining 40 foot options. By the end of 2017 I expect the best 145 of the 5105-5249 batch to still be around. By 2018 no more than 30-75 should be left on the roster. By 2019 Hopefully the MTA throws us an RTS retirement party. The last remaining buses are said to iconically retire out of Quill (Manhattan Division Headquarters) East New York (Surface Transit Headquarters). However, rumor does have it that depending on the condition of the both RTS buses, and the OG hybrids in 2019, all 145 of the 5105-5245 could still be around, with possible more. They could start to retire the 2003 models which are 6365-6391, and the last of the '02 ESB's end at 6489. If they retire all 125 or even more of the newer ones, MTA could be sticking to there original plans of keeping the RTS through 2020. MTA is playing this one by ear, but the hybrids are holding up a bit better than expected, and MTA maintenance are pro's on the model now. The OG's will be 16 by then, and the remaining RTS will be 30. The remaining 208 options should have been exercised by then. Thats when the OG's will begin there retirement. There there will be 200 diesels and 75 hybrids that will begin to replace everything in the 6365-6639 range. If the 3500's aren't re-powered by then they will be up next. Is there any depot assignment for '16 XD40 and LFS 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B22viaAtlanticAv Posted January 22, 2016 Share #435 Posted January 22, 2016 Really? Don't you think it's too soon for such a Question. Besides the current LFS order assignment changed quite a few times if you have been paying attention and it's still not complete so, who know when and if the remaining buses won't be reassigned... Anyways Keep Calm and Relax, when the time is right, Someone will post the assignments and even then it won't to be set in stone. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Future ENY OP Posted January 22, 2016 Share #436 Posted January 22, 2016 I hope on the next Procurement. They can award MCI again both for NYCT and bus 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
East New York Posted January 22, 2016 Author Share #437 Posted January 22, 2016 I hope on the next Procurement. They can award MCI again both for NYCT and bus With New Flyer in charge of things, I'm almost certain we will be seeing more D4500's in the near future. They are great when it comes to underbidding Nova. NYCT however may go with Prevost for the next order of 50. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Future ENY OP Posted January 22, 2016 Share #438 Posted January 22, 2016 With New Flyer in charge of things, I'm almost certain we will be seeing more D4500's in the near future. They are great when it comes to underbidding Nova. NYCT however may go with Prevost for the next order of 50. I just only think because prevost relocated over to Plattsburgh (correct me on this). However, it would be great to see some new D4500CT's again in the streets of Manhattan. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted January 22, 2016 Share #439 Posted January 22, 2016 With New Flyer in charge of things, I'm almost certain we will be seeing more D4500's in the near future. They are great when it comes to underbidding Nova. NYCT however may go with Prevost for the next order of 50. And why do they suddenly have a love affair with Prevost? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Around the Horn Posted January 22, 2016 Share #440 Posted January 22, 2016 And why do they suddenly have a love affair with Prevost? Upstate New York. need I say more? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
East New York Posted January 22, 2016 Author Share #441 Posted January 22, 2016 And why do they suddenly have a love affair with Prevost? Well, here is the actual inside scoop. MTA would have gotten more MCI's on the last order, however, budgeting stepped in and said no. We want you (DOB) to go with the Prevost on this one because the fuel economy is better. MCI averages about 3 MPG whereas Prevost Averages about 4.38 MPG. 300 buses saving more than a gallon per hour averages up to about 75,000 gallons saved per fleet fill up. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted January 22, 2016 Share #442 Posted January 22, 2016 Well, here is the actual inside scoop. MTA would have gotten more MCI's on the last order, however, budgeting stepped in and said no. We want you (DOB) to go with the Prevost on this one because the fuel economy is better. MCI averages about 3 MPG whereas Prevost Averages about 4.38 MPG. 300 buses saving more than a gallon per hour averages up to about 75,000 gallons saved per fleet fill up. That's crazy. I don't see those buses being able to hold up the way that the MCIs have, especially on Staten Island. lol I predict another shortage where Staten Island will have to borrow express buses from various depots. Upstate New York. need I say more? Well I actually went to university very close to where the first set of train cars were produced that ran on the line not too far from the old airbase in Plattsburgh, so I got to see those trains being tested. I will say that those jobs are VERY important to that area, but still. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Future ENY OP Posted January 23, 2016 Share #443 Posted January 23, 2016 Upstate New York. need I say more? nuff said. Plattsburgh. (Prevost) I hope and pray goes right back to MCI for next procurement and there aren't any real budgetary issues. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
East New York Posted January 23, 2016 Author Share #444 Posted January 23, 2016 (edited) As we now know, 100% of what I have been posing has been officially posted and confirmed by the MTA as of this afternoon, with one update. The MTAB artic order will be increased from 28 to 53. Since that's the only change, I will get to it a bit later as the next wave of information is coming across my desk. Major issues and problem between MTAB and NYCT over RTS buses coming in the days ahead. In other words, the $#!^ is about to hit the fan! I will get into exactly why a bit later. Edited January 23, 2016 by East New York 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MysteriousBtrain Posted January 23, 2016 Share #445 Posted January 23, 2016 As we now know, 100% of what I have been posing has been officially posted and confirmed by the MTA as of this afternoon, with one update. The MTAB artic order will be increased from 28 to 53. Since that's the only change, I will get to it a bit later as the next wave of information is coming across my desk. Major issues and problem between MTAB and NYCT over RTS buses coming in the days ahead. In other words, the $#!^ is about to hit the fan! I will get into exactly why a bit later. Hmmm..... which route could be making this increase in artics I wonder.... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewFlyer 230 Posted January 23, 2016 Share #446 Posted January 23, 2016 How many articulated buses is MTA bus getting now? First it was increased from 72 to 128 and now there could be more? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MysteriousBtrain Posted January 23, 2016 Share #447 Posted January 23, 2016 (edited) How many articulated buses is MTA bus getting now? First it was increased from 72 to 128 and now there could be more? You forgot the recently added 27, making 155. Now 25 more are added, making a total of 180 I believe for bus company. Edited January 23, 2016 by MysteriousBtrain 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewFlyer 230 Posted January 23, 2016 Share #448 Posted January 23, 2016 Wasn't College Point suppose to get artics for the Q25 in preparation for SBS? Perhaps BP is getting more artics for the Q64 for the rush hours. I thought the Q6, Q10, Q111/Q113/Q114 and Q52/Q53 were the only ones getting these buses. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T J Trainman Posted January 23, 2016 Share #449 Posted January 23, 2016 I think I have an idea regarding the RTS part. Im lost how many artics in total is MTAB getting? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
East New York Posted January 24, 2016 Author Share #450 Posted January 24, 2016 That's crazy. I don't see those buses being able to hold up the way that the MCIs have, especially on Staten Island. lol I predict another shortage where Staten Island will have to borrow express buses from various depots. The X3-45 is a near proven bus that has been around since 2005. It won't reach the 12 year mark until 2017, however, the bus has a solid build, is very reliably, and the US Government definitely made a statement when they dropped the MCI for Prevost as the new Ground Force One. You forgot the recently added 27, making 155. Now 25 more are added, making a total of 180 I believe for bus company. Correct. Wasn't College Point suppose to get artics for the Q25 in preparation for SBS? Perhaps BP is getting more artics for the Q64 for the rush hours. I thought the Q6, Q10, Q111/Q113/Q114 and Q52/Q53 were the only ones getting these buses. Well, this is the thing. With a massive sudden increase in the number of artics wanted at MTAB, this shakes things up quite a bit. From what I am being told, MTA wants the Q6, 8, 10, 23, 25, 52, 53, 60, 64, 65, 66, 111, 113, and 114 lines to eventually be articulated. Anything is possible when it comes to College Point, and it will likely see artics in the future, however for the time being, it appears as if there will be some route swaps for now. Now that the MTA will be introducing CNG artics, they are evaluating them for other purposes and depots as well. For example, the B103 has a higher ridership than than that of the Q6, 8, 64, and 113. So as of right now, it appears the artics for MTA Bus will start off for the Q6, Q10, Q23, Q25/65, Q52/53, Q60, Q111, Q113, and Q114. I think I have an idea regarding the RTS part. Im lost how many artics in total is MTAB getting? I'm going to make a whole post about that. But just to wet your tongue, TA wants their 5175-5199 batch back. EC was upset that they took the 1996 series of RTS buses away for the Orion V's. After much pushing to get rid of the V's and get the RTS back, EC immediately entered into the elite status of only BC depot to have '99 Nova's. Any just just any randoms, but some of the best 25 RTS buses ever made. This now poses a problem as they are now assigned to EC, and FL wants them back like last month. TA wants to send EC hybrids, but EC doesn't want those or anything else. Keep the XD's at LG. Period. So now there is a tug of war as EC officially wants to keep the buses through 2019, and TA is like "oh hell to the no!" Now Enter ENY and Quill into the picture. There's a fight brewing there over who's going to get the last of what, and who's going to keep what they currently have. As the Nova's prepare to leave EN, and head out to Queens and Staten Island, we have another problem. ENY DOES NOT want any hybrids. OG or NG. They want more RTS' back. But not just any RTS.... They want 5175-5199 as well!! Then we aren't even going to get on Ulmer Park.... They have guard dogs ready to chew someone's arm off over 5076-5124 ZF batch, which coincidentally is my favorite as well. Bottom line is this, the ONLY reason MTA wants 8750-9349 gone is because of the wheelchair lift issues. And last but not least! For all that have wanted to know what Quill wants to replace the crosstown buses with...... Drum Roll Please.... NOTHING! They said they are fine with the workhorse RTS through 2019. Please and Thanks! So there you have the facts folks, no one wants to let go of these buses and a fight over the last of them is brewing as we speak. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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