Enhanced Station Initiative

[Deucey]

U

2 hours ago, WestFarms36 said:

It would help if the were more transparent to its customers and specify the reasons of why accessibiliy/additional entrance projects get delayed, and or may not happen, e.g. 'The ADA Accessibility/additional staircase(s) at _____________ Station is being delayed/may be postponed/not occur for _________________ reasons, we will still keep this location in further study to find othet solutions to mitigate such issue.' Instead of dodging questions or making budgetary excuses as they are known to make. Most Elevated lines can get elevators and theres' no excuse to say that they have no control of streets, thats stupid for them to say, they could coordinate with the DOT and make Curb extensions if Feasible and Necessary to facilitate the Installation of an Elevator at those stations, while on other elevated stations it obviously be impossible due to the fact that theres buildings adjacent on both sides and a narrow street below and narrow sidewalk.

I wonder if there’s a correlation between customer satisfaction and the period after  stopped giving details of what’s being worked on when trains are rerouted for construction.

That was like 2013 when they stopped explaining Weekend Services Updates?

Edited February 28, 2018 by Deucey

[CenSin]

On 4/23/2017 at 7:56 AM, Union Tpke said:

That is one of the most disgusting stations on the subway system. It smells like an uncleaned bathroom.

 

There is a family of rats at the south end of the southbound platform where the garbage is stored. It smells like piss around there and something obscene is always leaking out from under the gate.

[bobtehpanda]

4 hours ago, Deucey said:

U

I wonder if there’s a correlation between customer satisfaction and the period after  stopped giving details of what’s being worked on when trains are rerouted for construction.

That was like 2013 when they stopped explaining Weekend Services Updates?

The problem was that service update explanations were canned responses, but there's not enough real estate on a poster to concisely fit all that info. What is happening, and how to cope, is way more important than why. 

In the case of construction projects for rehab and the like, though, the what and how is pretty damn obvious, so the why becomes more important.

[Deucey]

16 minutes ago, bobtehpanda said:

The problem was that service update explanations were canned responses, but there's not enough real estate on a poster to concisely fit all that info. What is happening, and how to cope, is way more important than why. 

In the case of construction projects for rehab and the like, though, the what and how is pretty damn obvious, so the why becomes more important.

I wouldn’t expect it on a poster, but I remember way back when Ben Kabak, and .info, would have the reasons posted with the service changes.

For us transitheads, it was trivia but for the interested public, it was a window into what was meant by “Improving Nonstop.”

(Although I don’t think changing the corporate slogan to something akin to ‘We suck but we’re trying’ did  any favors.)

[Lance]

I remember when the reasons behind the service changes were removed. If I recall correctly, the person typing out the service changes could not get the information from the maintenance department (or whichever relevant one) in a timely enough fashion. Something along those lines, but BS nonetheless. Recently, they compromised by giving vague reasons like track or signal maintenance, but when over half of the service changes have that same descriptor, it becomes kind of useless.

[NewFlyer 230]

On 2/28/2018 at 12:53 PM, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

You can call it selfish, but they have a right to voice their concern.  You're not the one that lives there and would have to put up with the consequences of that entrance.  I attend a lot of these meetings and was at one recently and after hearing the concerns, I completely understand where they are coming from.  Once you graduate or transfer from Hunter, you won't have to put up with 68th street, but they will for years to come.  I myself will likely be an owner of a residence in the near future, and I will do everything to protect my investment.  These people have put in thousands to millions of dollars for their apartments, not including the yearly taxes and all of the other fees that they have to pay.  They certainly have a right to be concerned about their investment and quality of life.  Sometimes these projects come about and they sound great.  Let's build it!  I find that these engineers sometimes lack commonsense and sometimes they just don't think about certain things because they don't live in the neighborhood.  

I totally understand where you are coming from but at the end of the day some type of agreement has to be made. I still however feel that another entrance for that stop is needed because it’s a busy station and during rush hours tons of people are crowding at the one staircase up to the mezzanine area and you have those who are trying to get down to the platform but can’t. 

I’m pretty sure the entrance would have been in front of the school so I don’t think it would really affect the quality of life in any way. 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

11 hours ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

I totally understand where you are coming from but at the end of the day some type of agreement has to be made. I still however feel that another entrance for that stop is needed because it’s a busy station and during rush hours tons of people are crowding at the one staircase up to the mezzanine area and you have those who are trying to get down to the platform but can’t. 

I’m pretty sure the entrance would have been in front of the school so I don’t think it would really affect the quality of life in any way. 

Well you won't hear me disagree. Quite frankly the condition of that station is appalling.  Is it getting a full rehab because it needs it.  Ultimately another entrance or entrances are needed, but it needs to be done with the community in mind.  

[LGA Link N Train]

34 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Well you won't hear me disagree. Quite frankly the condition of that station is appalling.  Is it getting a full rehab because it needs it.  Ultimately another entrance or entrances are needed, but it needs to be done with the community in mind.  

what station are we talking about?

[Via Garibaldi 8]

14 minutes ago, LGA Link N train said:

what station are we talking about?

68th Street-Hunter College.

[Mysterious2train]

47 minutes ago, LGA Link N train said:

what station are we talking about?

68 St-Hunter College . The MTA is proposing to add elevators there, redo the street entrances and add new staircase entrances around 69th St. NIMBYs opposed it because the new staircases would ruin the character of 69th St or something. The MTA first unveiled the project late in 2011 but they tabled it for a few years because of the opposition. They did revive the project a couple of years ago. They're still trying to sort out the real estate and engineering issues and hope to award a contract later this year, according to committee materials.

The MTA actually did work with the NIMBYs and the authority is now proposing to put the new northbound entrance in a storefront in the middle of the block instead of on 69th St itself. 

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From here: http://web.mta.info/mta/planning/68St-Hunter/pdf/EA.pdf

Just to give you an idea of how ridiculous these NIMBYs are, they proposed putting new entrances on 67th or 70th St instead. Which is basically unfeasible since the station doesn't actually reach under either of those blocks, so the MTA would have to build new connecting passageways to those streets, ultimately making the project longer and more expensive.

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But I suppose it's good a compromise was tentatively reached.

The reason I first mentioned 68 St-Hunter College in this thread was because of the sentiment that ESI should include ADA-accessibility and possibly new entrances. It makes sense on paper but the reality is that ADA projects/new entrances have the potential to get delayed by NIMBYs or other issues like engineering* so tying those with doing component repairs to stations in desperate need of TLC is not always a good idea (although as @RR503noted, ESI stations aren't always the ones most in need of repair, but I digress.) 

* - The other station I mentioned, 57 St-7 Av , had its ADA accessibility delayed for a few years because of engineering issues. A contract was finally awarded back in December. That station actually already has an elevator from the street to the 57th St mezzanine (There are two mezzanines, one at 57th St at the north end of the station and one at 55th St at the south end.) The MTA is just trying to finish the job by building platform elevators. The MTA was apparently unable to fit in elevators from the 57th St mezzanine to the platforms. So they've decided to build elevators from the 55th St mezzanine to the platform instead. Which will also require them to build a new street elevator from 55th St to the mezzanine. Which is unfortunate because as I noted, there already is a street elevator at 57th St.

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Edited March 2, 2018 by Mysterious2train

[Deucey]

17 minutes ago, Mysterious2train said:

Just to give you an idea of how ridiculous these NIMBYs are, they proposed putting new entrances on 67th or 70th St instead. Which is basically unfeasible since the station doesn't actually reach under either of those blocks, so the MTA would have to build new connecting passageways to those streets, ultimately making the project longer and more expensive.

A situation where Eminent Domain should've been used for what it was actually designed for..

Edited March 2, 2018 by Deucey

[m7zanr160s]

So what I'm getting here is that instead of having new station entrances on the opposite corner of a building an entrance is already on, and another in the middle of a commercial strip, the opposing residents want to compromise by having the entrances further away in more inconvenient places (one that's way more residential at 70th Street); makes no sense to me.

[RR503]

Before, we had rule by Robert Moses. That was one sort of tyranny. 

Now, we have rule by 'concerned citizens' who hijack planning processes that further greater goods for their own benefit. This is also a sort of tyranny.

Net net, we haven't improved. Tyranny by the autocrat didn't work; tyranny by old ladies on community boards isn't working either. It's time we changed this. 

[ABOGbrooklyn]

Hey guys do any of you know what are the next stations to get renovated that are outside (Not underground)?

The remaining of the Flushing line stations

Church Ave on the Brighton

Aqueduct North Conduit on the

The entire Dyre Ave line

The rest of Jamaica Cypress Hills - 121

New Lots Ave on Livonia

 

I know the Astoria line will get fixed soon as well as Culver and Sea Beach and Westchester Sq East Tremont on the

Also will the MTA eventually dismantle Intervale Ave on the

 

Does anyone know the dates?

 

Edited March 3, 2018 by ABOGbrooklyn

[Mysterious2train]

21 hours ago, m7zanr160s said:

So what I'm getting here is that instead of having new station entrances on the opposite corner of a building an entrance is already on, and another in the middle of a commercial strip, the opposing residents want to compromise by having the entrances further away in more inconvenient places (one that's way more residential at 70th Street); makes no sense to me.

The new northbound entrance being inside the storefront is the compromise. The MTA's original plan was to have the new entrances at the intersection of Lexington Avenue and 69th  St, which is what the NIMBYs balked at. The unrealistic NIMBY proposals to put entrances on 67th St or 70th St were shot down by the MTA. According to the environment assessment, the 69th St Tenants Corporation talked with the MTA, and then Imperial House apartments (which takes up the entire block between 3rd Av, Lexington Av, 68th St and 69th St) offered the MTA one of its storefronts to use for a new northbound entrance, which the MTA decided to use. Although right now, the MTA is still trying to work out some issues before finalizing things. If everything works out as planned, the new northbound entrance will be inside the Imperial House storefront at 931 Lexington Av, in the middle of the block between 68th and 69th. The new southbound entrance will still be on the sidewalk, at the SW corner of Lexington Av and 69 St. 

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Or this picture helps visualize it: The new southbound entrance will be where the hot dog stand is now. The new northbound entrance will be inside a storefront, where the black car is on the left-hand side of Lexington Avenue, in front of the white van.

Edited March 3, 2018 by Mysterious2train

[Union Tpke]

14 hours ago, ABOGbrooklyn said:

Hey guys do any of you know what are the next stations to get renovated that are outside (Not underground)?

The remaining of the Flushing line stations

Church Ave on the Brighton

Aqueduct North Conduit on the

The entire Dyre Ave line

The rest of Jamaica Cypress Hills - 121

New Lots Ave on Livonia

 

I know the Astoria line will get fixed soon as well as Culver and Sea Beach and Westchester Sq East Tremont on the

Also will the MTA eventually dismantle Intervale Ave on the

 

Does anyone know the dates?

 

Flushing Line 2019

[ABOGbrooklyn]

6 hours ago, Union Tpke said:

Flushing Line 2019

Thanks. Know anything about the other lines/stations I mentioned?

[Mysterious2train]

On 3/3/2018 at 7:49 AM, ABOGbrooklyn said:

Hey guys do any of you know what are the next stations to get renovated that are outside (Not underground)?

The remaining of the Flushing line stations

Church Ave on the Brighton

Aqueduct North Conduit on the

The entire Dyre Ave line

The rest of Jamaica Cypress Hills - 121

New Lots Ave on Livonia

 

I know the Astoria line will get fixed soon as well as Culver and Sea Beach and Westchester Sq East Tremont on the

Also will the MTA eventually dismantle Intervale Ave on the

 

Does anyone know the dates?

 

 

On 3/4/2018 at 5:33 AM, ABOGbrooklyn said:

Thanks. Know anything about the other lines/stations I mentioned?

I believe the only outdoor stations planned to get rehabbed this capital program (2015-2019) are the ones on the Flushing line, Astoria line and Jamaica line plus anything in the ESI (I don't remember which outdoor stations besides the Astoria line are in the ESI). I don't think there's any stations from the previous capital program scheduled for rehabs that haven't gotten it yet. 

New Lots Av  isn't getting a full top-to-bottom rehab like the rest of the line. According to an MTA press release: http://www.mta.info/press-release/nyc-transit/mta-announces-reopening-two-rehabilitated-subway-stations-brooklyn 

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The five other stations (besides Sutter Av and Junius St) that are part of the rehabilitation project are Saratoga Av, Rockaway Av, Pennsylvania Av, Van Siclen Av, and New Lots Av. The work at New Lots Av is ongoing as the station remains open during repairs. At New Lots Av, component repairs will include the installation of a new exterior metal panel façade, repairs to mezzanine beams and concrete floors, and reconfiguration of the existing fare control area.

Cypress Hills, 75 St, 85 St and Woodhaven Blvd  should be getting rehabbed soon, including elevator installation at Woodhaven Blvd. No dates yet, but I'm guessing after work at 121 St winds down. I don't see anything for 111 St listed in the capital program.

I don't think anything on the Dyre Av line is supposed to get a full rehab, but Gun Hill Rd is getting an elevator and apparently Pelham Parkway is getting some platform work done. I don't have any dates for you. As for the other two stations you mentioned, I don't think they're getting anything. 

 

 

 

[LGA Link N Train]

@Mysterious2train earlier you mentioned Woodhaven  being rehabbed on the . I feel as if they should do something with the middle, or make the station look like a peak express station though I don't think that's feasible. But getting an elevator installation I can agree with

[Wallyhorse]

On 3/3/2018 at 3:56 PM, Mysterious2train said:

The new northbound entrance being inside the storefront is the compromise. The MTA's original plan was to have the new entrances at the intersection of Lexington Avenue and 69th  St, which is what the NIMBYs balked at. The unrealistic NIMBY proposals to put entrances on 67th St or 70th St were shot down by the MTA. According to the environment assessment, the 69th St Tenants Corporation talked with the MTA, and then Imperial House apartments (which takes up the entire block between 3rd Av, Lexington Av, 68th St and 69th St) offered the MTA one of its storefronts to use for a new northbound entrance, which the MTA decided to use. Although right now, the MTA is still trying to work out some issues before finalizing things. If everything works out as planned, the new northbound entrance will be inside the Imperial House storefront at 931 Lexington Av, in the middle of the block between 68th and 69th. The new southbound entrance will still be on the sidewalk, at the SW corner of Lexington Av and 69 St. 

Or this picture helps visualize it: The new southbound entrance will be where the hot dog stand is now. The new northbound entrance will be inside a storefront, where the black car is on the left-hand side of Lexington Avenue, in front of the white van.

I'm sure many of the NIMBY's opposed to the 69th Street entrance were the children and grandchildren of many of the owners fearful those homes would severely decrease in value once that entrance was built and many of those already have had plans for some time to sell those homes as soon as the actual owners pass on.  That to me had a lot to do with this. 

[Cabanamaner]

I recently passed by 163rd Street & Amsterdam Avenue to see how work was progressing on the ESI rebuild, and I noticed that they actually dug up the closed 163rd street entrance at street level! Reopening it would finally give a purpose to the large abandoned mezzanine that this station has. It's a shame that no elevators are planned for this station, since it's size could easily accommodate them.

[MysteriousBtrain]

In case it wasn't posted:

STATION ENHANCEMENTS
Cathedral Pkwy (110 St) will close in both directions

Beginning 5 AM Monday, Apr 9 until Sep 2018

trains will skip Cathedral Pkwy (110 St) in both directions.
 

Travel Alternatives

• Use nearby stations at 116 St, 103 St, the at 110 St 
   or the at Central Park North (110 St).

• Take the M10 bus and transfer to the ( late night) at 116 St or 103 St with MetroCard.

• Need to transfer to another bus? Ask the M10 driver for a MetroCard Bus Transfer which is for 
   your next local bus ride within two hours.
   - On your return trip, ask the station agent at 116 St or 103 St for a transfer to the bus.

Reminder: trains run local during late night only.

[LGA Link N Train]

I passed by 36 Avenue and 30 Avenue on the and . I can EASILY see where the can put elevators. Yet they choose not to.

[ABOGbrooklyn]

On 3/29/2018 at 8:55 AM, Mysterious2train said:

 

I believe the only outdoor stations planned to get rehabbed this capital program (2015-2019) are the ones on the Flushing line, Astoria line and Jamaica line plus anything in the ESI (I don't remember which outdoor stations besides the Astoria line are in the ESI). I don't think there's any stations from the previous capital program scheduled for rehabs that haven't gotten it yet. 

New Lots Av  isn't getting a full top-to-bottom rehab like the rest of the line. According to an MTA press release: http://www.mta.info/press-release/nyc-transit/mta-announces-reopening-two-rehabilitated-subway-stations-brooklyn 

Cypress Hills, 75 St, 85 St and Woodhaven Blvd  should be getting rehabbed soon, including elevator installation at Woodhaven Blvd. No dates yet, but I'm guessing after work at 121 St winds down. I don't see anything for 111 St listed in the capital program.

I don't think anything on the Dyre Av line is supposed to get a full rehab, but Gun Hill Rd is getting an elevator and apparently Pelham Parkway is getting some platform work done. I don't have any dates for you. As for the other two stations you mentioned, I don't think they're getting anything. 

 

 

Thanks for the info. Pelham Pkwy on Dyre and Westchester East Tremont on Pelham and apart of the EIS. 

 

[Lance]

The Enhanced Station Initiative is dead. Cause of death: higher costs due to increased scope.

Courtesy: Paul Berger, Wall Street Journal

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New York Subway Cuts Back Plans to Renovate Stations

The Metropolitan Transportation Authority is running out of funds for a controversial program to renovate 32 subway stations and will scale it back as a result.

MTA chairman Joe Lhota said Monday that most of the program’s $936 million budget has been used for the 19 stations completed or under way. Mr. Lhota said costs rose after contractors began work on stations and discovered “infrastructure rot” that broadened the scope of work.

Under the original plan, the renovations would have cost an average of $28 million per station. The current average cost for each station is $43 million.

“We live in a world of limited funding,” Mr. Lhota said. “We need to make decisions about how we use that funding.”

The MTA will have spent about $850 million for the renovations to 19 stations and the Richmond Valley station on the Staten Island Railway. That leaves 13 targeted subway stations without any funding. They will have to wait for the MTA’s next five-year spending plan, Mr. Lhota said, which starts in 2020.

The so-called enhanced-station initiative was championed by New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo when it launched in the summer of 2016. Mr. Cuomo’s office declined to comment.

His administration touted cleaner, brighter and easier-to-navigate stations with new lighting, digital signage, USB ports and artwork.

Some transit advocates as well as several MTA board members criticized the program as a poor use of scarce funds when the agency should be focused on improving subway service.

Critics said the MTA could better spend its money modernizing the subway’s signal system, which would reduce delays and allow trains to run faster and more frequently. They also said the MTA should focus on adding elevators. Currently, only one-quarter of the subway’s 472 stations are accessible to people with disabilities.

The MTA expects that about $90 million will be left over from the program, which will be transferred to projects that make stations more accessible, an MTA spokesman said.

Earlier this year, MTA board members representing Mayor Bill de Blasio voted against contracts to upgrade eight stations in the program at a cost of more than $200 million. But the measure passed the full board.

On Monday, Carl Weisbrod, a commissioner who represents New York City, said the program was “ill-conceived,” and that he is glad it has come to an end.

“I don’t know when the MTA management realized that the program had run out of money but it would’ve been helpful to have informed the board when this matter was under discussion,” he said.

Mr. Lhota said he was aware of the increased costs last year, but he chose not to mention it until now. “I didn’t think it was relevant to the debate,” he said.

At a board presentation in February, the MTA’s new head of the subway, Andy Byford, said the program was more than just cosmetic. He pointed to major repairs that were being carried out on platforms, station walls and stairways. He also cited degraded steelwork on the Astoria line, which carries the N and W trains in Queens.

State Sen. Michael Gianaris, whose district includes the Astoria line, said his constituents aren’t pleased with the station-enhancement program because elevators weren’t included despite the MTA spending $200 million to upgrade four stations on an elevated line.

The MTA closes two stations at a time while renovations are carried out. Since the stations at 30th Avenue and 36th Avenue closed last fall, Mr. Gianaris said eight businesses have closed because of the loss of foot traffic. The stations are due to reopen this summer.

The renovations “have been a real problem for communities throughout New York,” Mr. Gianaris said, questioning why the program’s costs have increased.

“Were they purposefully underestimating the cost at the outset to downplay how expensive it would be?” he said. “Or has something happened in the last year that raises questions about how they budget and how they spend their money?”

Mr. Lhota said the need to expand the scope of work only became clear once renovations began and the need for extensive repairs became apparent. “Given the fact that the stations haven’t been closed in some time, this was going to be the only shot,” he said.

For those wondering, all stations through the fourth package will still be covered by this budget. That means 57 Street (6th Avenue), 145 Street (Lenox Ave), 167 Street and 174-175 Streets (Concourse), along with Richmond Valley on the Staten Island Railway, will receive the full renovations. Partial renovations will also continue on both Penn Station stops. The remaining Astoria and Central Park West stations are also included in the present budget.

CORRECTION: 174-175 Streets was not part of the first four phases of the ESI. It's originally from phase eight and was bumped up, displacing 23 Street (Lexington Ave), which originally held that spot.

On a side note, it's interesting that the stations that could really use a full renovation, like Pelham Pkwy or any of the Pelham underground stations, got deferred to a later point. If riders can see the stalactites on the ceiling, that should be a pretty good indicator that the station is in a state of bad repair.

Edited April 3, 2018 by Lance