Random Thoughts Thread - Nassau Inter-County Express (NICE)

[NY1635]

What usually causes the n40 and n41 to usually arrive and leave Hempstead in pairs, or a few minutes apart from each other?

[B35 via Church]

What usually causes the n40 and n41 to usually arrive and leave Hempstead in pairs, or a few minutes apart from each other?

IDK, but for as many n40's/n41's I see entering Mineola (in bunches, or a few mins apart), I don't think I have ever seen one bus drop pax. off & then pickup pax for the return trip back south without going on layover....

 

They all go on layover (some buses longer than others - which could be the cause of the problem), a crowd starts piling up, then.... let's call it bus #1 (doesn't seem to matter much if it's a 40 or 41, because I don't see people on those epic lines stepping/sidestepping away from the line if it isn't whichever bus they specifically need) powers on & starts picking up said crowd.... Then while bus #1 is picking up pax, another bus we'll call bus #2 (if bus #1 is a 40, then bus #2 will be a 41 - or vice versa... you won't see two 40's or two 41's leaving in unison) powers on in service.... What I find somewhat odd is that virtually nobody jumps off the line for bus #1 to walk over & catch bus #2.... IDC if the line for bus #1 is 40+ ppl. deep, you will see virtually everyone board bus #1, single file....

 

Basically what I'm getting at is, when bus #1 & bus #2 leave Mineola, the first bus leaves with basically everybody, and the 2nd bus leaves with almost (I've seen instances where that 2nd bus left right behind the first bus, with literally) nobody on it..... There's like this strange "leader/follower" thing that goes on, leaving Mineola......

 

Sometimes there's a 3rd bus in the above scenario... when this happens, it usually leaves no more than 5 mins after bus #1 & bus #2.... Almost always, this bus leaves with more ppl. than bus #2, b/c by that time, an EB n22 and/or n24 will have arrived between [the time bus #1 & bus #2 left] & [before said bus #3 leaves].....

 

The way I see it, they don't need literally every n40 & n41 trip throughout the day going to Mineola - but at the same time, there should be special/certain trips dedicated to only run b/w Mineola & HTC during peak hours... What it is, is that the vast majority of ppl boarding n40's/n41's at Mineola are taking it to Hempstead (a lot of these folks are coming off n23's, and again, off EB n22's/n24's)....

 

...and then the n40/41 has to contend with the crowds at HTC, for service due south, which is another can of worms....

[IAlam]

Does anyone else think that NICE should charge some sort of transfer fee for riders transferring from the MTA (such as 25 cents)? It would still be significantly cheaper for riders compared to the LIRR, and could help to fill the budget gap a bit.

The problem is that the system is tied in with the metrocard and the metrocard rules.

[Joel Up Front]

Does anyone else think that NICE should charge some sort of transfer fee for riders transferring from the MTA (such as 25 cents)? It would still be significantly cheaper for riders compared to the LIRR, and could help to fill the budget gap a bit.

 

That's a good way to kill ridership that's already on the decline.

[Union Tpke]

That's a good way to kill ridership that's already on the decline.

 

Nassau might want that as a way to justify killing more routes.

[NY1635]

Nassau might want that as a way to justify killing more routes.

 

Nassau doesn't want to kill off it's bus system, the County Executive has been trying and failing to get Transdev to subside the County's bus system.

[Mtatransit]

Nassau doesn't want to kill off it's bus system, the County Executive has been trying and failing to get Transdev to subside the County's bus system.

Nassau had been trying to get everyone but themselves to subsidize the system (state,MTA, Transdev)

[B35 via Church]

Now I don't expect Nassau county to pony up 100% of the money to fund its own bus system, but there is way too much passing the buck going on at the same time... On top of it, the whole acronym gimmick in the naming of its bus system shows just how serious the county thinks surface transit in general is.....

 

Yeah, there was an exhibition of wordplay on NICE all over the place; from news 12 LI (tv), newsday (newspaper), & various other online blogs & discussion forums (like this one), but "Nassau inter county express", from jump, never made much sense to me:

 

nassau = primary service area of the buses.....

inter county = term by itself is self explanatory

express = to convey to riders/potential riders that the buses are fast.... got that part...

 

putting this together though.... Lol... to sum it up, it's conveying to riders that the bus system exists to get you the f*** out of the county...

 

...Fast

[NY1635]

What is it about the North Shore that makes the roads dangerous during snowstorms? The n20h are bypassing the colleges, n21 has been suspended, n27s are now stopping at Roslyn LIRR because of the hazardous weather conditions today.

[67thAve]

What is it about the North Shore that makes the roads dangerous during snowstorms? The n20h are bypassing the colleges, n21 has been suspended, n27s are now stopping at Roslyn LIRR because of the hazardous weather conditions today.

Hills. Lots of hills. Plus, with a system like NICE, you can be assured that the buses aren't in the greatest shape to haul up and down slopes in this weather.

[NY1635]

Hills. Lots of hills. Plus, with a system like NICE, you can be assured that the buses aren't in the greatest shape to haul up and down slopes in this weather.

 

That explains why the n23 north of Rosyln LIRR has been suspended. I do notice some hills around the clock tower area.

[FamousNYLover]

Hills. Lots of hills. Plus, with a system like NICE, you can be assured that the buses aren't in the greatest shape to haul up and down slopes in this weather.

 

After the snow storm, I always avoid the hills at Roslyn Clock Tower. Some Nassau County and NYSDOT are so slow removing ice from bus stop area and sidewalk.

[DS4Ever]

Sad

[NY1635]

Nassau bus riders shouldn't be that surprised that services are being cut. Aside from the County not providing recurring source of revenue for the Bus System, Nassau itself hasn't really changed much in the past 10 years to justify most of the routes. I've seen and heard more businesses closing down and job losses than newer ones starting up to hire workers. Even the redevelopment of the Nassau Coliseum won't be enough to generate riders because it's still incomplete. I feel that the future of buses in Nassau is going to be determined by whether or not plans to redevelop Hempstead, Glen Cove, Route 110, and whatever is going on at Belmont Park actually happens.

[RES2773]

I know this is such I tiny possibly silver lining, but maybe NICE will actually finally release a new system map? They still use the one from 2012 which is just so wrong. On a different note, these cuts are devastating. A person that cleans my house once a week sometimes takes the n27 to my house if we can't give her a lift. That service is being reduced. She also works for two people along the n79 route that now she can't get to either. It's rough.

 

 

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[N6 Limited]

Does NICE release the Passenger Counter data to the public? It would be interesting to see  ridership patterns and loss, N6 is only full during rush hour basically, it used to be full ALL DAY.

[danielhg121]

I doubt they even collect that sort of data. Whenever they need a service cut, they blindfold a guy, give him a dart and have him throw it at whichever line gets cut.

 

 

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[Joel Up Front]

Does NICE release the Passenger Counter data to the public? It would be interesting to see  ridership patterns and loss, N6 is only full during rush hour basically, it used to be full ALL DAY.

 

And show the world how much ridership has actually plummeted?  There's got to be a political reason as to why Mongo and company aren't completely gutting service.

[Amtrak7]

An 11th hour bailout may be coming:

 

http://www.newsday.com/long-island/transportation/pols-more-than-6m-nice-bus-bailout-to-avert-route-cuts-coming-1.13324696

 

With less than two weeks to go, I'm not sure how this will work...you can't annul the pick and write another one in such a short time.

[67thAve]

An 11th hour bailout may be coming:

 

http://www.newsday.com/long-island/transportation/pols-more-than-6m-nice-bus-bailout-to-avert-route-cuts-coming-1.13324696

 

With less than two weeks to go, I'm not sure how this will work...you can't annul the pick and write another one in such a short time.

 

Knowing NICE, they'll figure out a way at the last minute, but it will be badly executed, and we will end up with a surreal series of driver errors and passenger complaints come the 9th.

[RES2773]

So I don't know if anyone saw yet, but NICE did scale back the service cuts slightly. The n19, n57, and n78/n79 are not being discontinued, but service is being greatly reduced. Just look at the differences between the current schedule and the one effecting April 9. It's crazy. But this comes at a cost. A bunch of routes are losing weekend service. Personally, I think the n27 is the biggest loss for the reductions. And while not officially stated on the website, the schedule says the n22a is being eliminated.

 

 

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[NY1635]

This is starting to get ridiculous. I can understand the n19, n57, n78/79, and even the n1, but there's no justification for saving the n45 and n51.

 

http://www.newsday.com/long-island/transportation/nassau-urged-to-halt-nice-route-cuts-set-to-roll-out-sunday-1.13372743

Edited April 7, 2017 by NY1635

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

This is starting to get ridiculous. I can understand the n19, n57, n78/79, and even the n1, but there's no justification for saving the n45 and n51.

 

http://www.newsday.com/long-island/transportation/nassau-urged-to-halt-nice-route-cuts-set-to-roll-out-sunday-1.13372743

Whatever savings they get from the n45 and n51, only to be reinstated (if it is), could have gone to the n27 for some weekend service, or for additional n19 or n79 service during the day. But what do I know. Additionally, this is almost like a f**king lottery game now. Take your chances and see if you win the grand prize of retaining your bus service. Hey, you never know.

 

The n45 will run in Bellmore during the same general hours as the n19, and furthermore, not much of anyone gets on outside of "Downtown" Bellmore, and even less along Camp Avenue. The n51 is just a major disaster. The route never carried to begin with, but NICE shitted on the n51 majorly. One purpose is to maintain coverage for students from the Merrick area going to NCC, but I have yet to see one using the bus south of NCC nowadays. One trip I took last month, it was me, some chick, and the BO, and south of the Student Union, it was just me and the BO until Merrick. The trip left Merrick without anyone. I don't even see the elderly in Merrick use it during the midday hours for shopping and whatnot. 

 

The same thing occurred on the n73/74. The routes didn't carry, but they weren't necessarily anemic either. Now, with the current iteration of service, virtually no one rides south of Wantagh Avenue & Jerusalem Avenue, and there's like 3 to 4 people at most per trip. These people probably either got a different job or now rely on another mode of transportation. I can't blame them for not going back to take the bus, especially when the service is taken away one day, then restored the next, only for it to be taken away again later on. I've taken the n73 on a Saturday (back when the service was still around), and it had a lot more than just 3-4 people. 

 

The only routes I believe have remained somewhat invulnerable to ridership losses is the n80/n81, but I feel that part of that may deal with there being no bus on Jerusalem Avenue outside of the rush hour. 

 

 

Another mistake was reinstating rush hourly only service in Elmont with the Flexi. I've taken the n2/n8, and although they never had many people at a certain time, they usually got a suitable amount of riders per trip. One of the trips had 24 riders on just that one trip, and it was a midday bus too. The n2 should have at least been reinstated, re-engineered (whatever they wanna call it) to run between Franklin Square and Green Acres Mall (or expand the Flexi to run during midday hours and Saturdays). From the beginning, NICE had a lot of potential to cut back on service in the Elmont area, but they decided to go with that n2/n8 loop. That was a crappy decision, most of the riders at any given point were on the eastern Valley Stream portion of the route (and the Meacham Avenue), which ended up waiting twice tha amount of time for a bus (unless they wanna loop around Green Acres and tour the County Line). IMO, they could have ran the n2 only after April 8th and saved up by eliminating the n8 outright. 

Edited April 7, 2017 by BM5 via Woodhaven Bl

[NY1635]

Whatever savings they get from the n45 and n51, only to be reinstated (if it is), could have gone to the n27 for some weekend service, or for additional n19 or n79 service during the day. But what do I know. Additionally, this is almost like a f**king lottery game now. Take your chances and see if you win the grand prize of retaining your bus service. Hey, you never know.

 

The n45 will run in Bellmore during the same general hours as the n19, and furthermore, not much of anyone gets on outside of "Downtown" Bellmore, and even less along Camp Avenue. The n51 is just a major disaster. The route never carried to begin with, but NICE shitted on the n51 majorly. One purpose is to maintain coverage for students from the Merrick area going to NCC, but I have yet to see one using the bus south of NCC nowadays. One trip I took last month, it was me, some chick, and the BO, and south of the Student Union, it was just me and the BO until Merrick. The trip left Merrick without anyone. I don't even see the elderly in Merrick use it during the midday hours for shopping and whatnot. 

 

The same thing occurred on the n73/74. The routes didn't carry, but they weren't necessarily anemic either. Now, with the current iteration of service, virtually no one rides south of Wantagh Avenue & Jerusalem Avenue, and there's like 3 to 4 people at most per trip. These people probably either got a different job or now rely on another mode of transportation. I can't blame them for not going back to take the bus, especially when the service is taken away one day, then restored the next, only for it to be taken away again later on. I've taken the n73 on a Saturday (back when the service was still around), and it had a lot more than just 3-4 people. 

 

The only routes I believe have remained somewhat invulnerable to ridership losses is the n80/n81, but I feel that part of that may deal with there being no bus on Jerusalem Avenue outside of the rush hour. 

 

 

Another mistake was reinstating rush hourly only service in Elmont with the Flexi. I've taken the n2/n8, and although they never had many people at a certain time, they usually got a suitable amount of riders per trip. One of the trips had 24 riders on just that one trip, and it was a midday bus too. The n2 should have at least been reinstated, re-engineered (whatever they wanna call it) to run between Franklin Square and Green Acres Mall (or expand the Flexi to run during midday hours and Saturdays). From the beginning, NICE had a lot of potential to cut back on service in the Elmont area, but they decided to go with that n2/n8 loop. That was a crappy decision, most of the riders at any given point were on the eastern Valley Stream portion of the route (and the Meacham Avenue), which ended up waiting twice tha amount of time for a bus (unless they wanna loop around Green Acres and tour the County Line). IMO, they could have ran the n2 only after April 8th and saved up by eliminating the n8 outright. 

 

Again, the County Legislators are the ones going out of their way to prevent these cuts from happening despite being told multiple times that the route in their district got cut because of low ridership. They had enough time to find the money to avert the cuts and still couldn't find it before the deadline, now they're trying to stall long enough for the bailout from the state to arrive and solve their problems. I feel that NICE really want to make these cuts permanent because they know that Nassau doesn't have the money, and that the riders are too scared to admit that they had it too good for too long.

 

I think the Elmont/Valley Stream area could be better served by a Green Acres-Hempstead route, or if the n2 was extended somewhere north of the NY-24 like LIJ. Terminating at the Hempstead Turpike isn't going to cut it nowadays.

Edited April 7, 2017 by NY1635

[pranavbhat924]

When's the nice artics coming out?

 

 

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