LIRR And MNRR Random Thoughts Thread

[B35 via Church]

20 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

There was a time when I would ride MNRR to 125th St from GCT and I stopped even buying tickets because they would never check. Now with the LIRR which I have used over the years, I have generally been checked, but I've had a few times where I've rode for free, and this had nothing to do with any train being crowded either. Personally I find the Hudson Line to be ok, provided you are getting on or off where they check. There are a few stops where they still don't, or what some people do is if they get on at say Yankees-153rd or anywhere before Marble Hill, they just hide in the bathroom and then get off at Marble Hill. I've seen that a lot pre-COVID and at first I didn't realize what was going on, but then it all clicked when I kept seeing it.

I tend to take semi-express trains now whenever I do use MNRR, such as this morning, so if I get on in Riverdale or Spuyten Duyvil, they will usually check before we get to Harlem-125th. I get a CityTicket anyway, so it doesn't even matter. It's only good for the day, so I just activate it. My use is so minimal now that I'm lucky if I use the railroad a few times a month. lol

I should've added that those LIRR trains in the morning weren't crowded either, but you could easily deduce that being the case, being that we (Brooklynites) have scoot service now.

But yeah, I never once considered not buying tickets, because on those WB trains during the PM rush hour, enough of the c/r's I had were pretty anal about ticket collection.... Even during Ranger or Islander (when they moved to Barclays for that brief stint) games, and/or for whoever was performing at whatever concert LI-ers were going to see.... Been on several trains coming home where they ended up being held at Jamaica (which had no bearing on me, because I would get off at Jamaica to xfer over for an Atlantic Term. train anyway) so that those transit cops could detain/apprehend some farebeater.... Usually the ones that did the ole, staking out in the bathroom bit as you mentioned (I don't see how anyone can do that shit... ughkkk).... I'd hop on that n22 (NICE bus) to get to 179th & ride out all the way to Church av. before I'd ever consider doing that.....

"Come on man, people gotta use the bathroom"

I don't miss any of this shit at all.

Edited March 4, 2023 by B35 via Church

[Cait Sith]

My observations in Jamaica is that Track 3 has largely gone unused for service, and has been used for deadheads mostly(westbound trains deadheads on tracks 1, 4 & 5 more). GCT trains use both track 1 and 2, Penn Station trains is primarily on track 2, and track 3 remains largely unused except for the trains from West Hempstead. I don't know why they don't have some of those Atlantic Terminal trains board on track 3.

[B35 via Church]

4 minutes ago, Cait Sith said:

My observations in Jamaica is that Track 3 has largely gone unused for service, and has been used for deadheads mostly(westbound trains deadheads on tracks 1, 4 & 5 more). GCT trains use both track 1 and 2, Penn Station trains is primarily on track 2, and track 3 remains largely unused except for the trains from West Hempstead. I don't know why they don't have some of those Atlantic Terminal trains board on track 3.

It used to be tracks 4 & 5 that largely went unused... I can probably count on two hands the number of times I've ever been on that platform....

Anyway, with how things are set up now, I don't see how they could have some of those scoot trains utilize track 3 at this point.....

What I'd like to know is, what are those WB trains from OB doing now? They used to end at Jamaica on track 1 (or track 3 sometimes)... Do they have more of them running to LI City or something?

 

[IAlam]

On 3/2/2023 at 4:15 PM, Lawrence St said:

Then the next thing is the transfer it’s self, it should not take close to 15 minutes to walk from GC to GCM.

I just saw this but at 45th St there is a fairly hidden staircase to the 100-level tracks. At 47th St there is a second escalator staircase that goes to the upper-level Metro North tracks. They're not at obvious as they could be but it saves a lot of time. 

3 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

That's nice that you know multiple conductors. Still has nothing to do with those who can't collect on the overcrowded trains.  Hell I've been on a number of trains where it wasn't crowded and I essentially got a free ride over the years.  They've been better on MNRR about collecting them, but depending on where you are going, it is totally possible to ride for free for several weeks at a time.

At this point, it seems the conductors are spread so thin I'm riding into Manhattan again without getting my ticket checked even on empty off-peak trains. The last time that was frequently happening to me was during the pandemic. 

49 minutes ago, Cait Sith said:

My observations in Jamaica is that Track 3 has largely gone unused for service, and has been used for deadheads mostly(westbound trains deadheads on tracks 1, 4 & 5 more). GCT trains use both track 1 and 2, Penn Station trains is primarily on track 2, and track 3 remains largely unused except for the trains from West Hempstead. I don't know why they don't have some of those Atlantic Terminal trains board on track 3.

I think the trains from West Hempstead do board on track 3 but the rest are delegated to the shuttle platform. 

[Cait Sith]

1 minute ago, IAlam said:

I just saw this but at 45th St there is a fairly hidden staircase to the 100-level tracks. At 47th St there is a second escalator staircase that goes to the upper-level Metro North tracks. They're not at obvious as they could be but it saves a lot of time. 

At this point, it seems the conductors are spread so thin I'm riding into Manhattan again without getting my ticket checked even on empty off-peak trains. The last time that was frequently happening to me was during the pandemic. 

I think the trains from West Hempstead do board on track 3 but the rest are delegated to the shuttle platform. 

That's what I'm saying, that's the only time that track sees revenue service as of late.

When they had those weekend shuttles between Jamaica & Atlantic Terminal last month. They would lay up the train and then send it back down to Track 3 and board. I don't know why they don't do that now. It's not like they can't since they've done it multiple times, and they have trains during the rush hour that would pull of out of Jamaica Yard and goes westward, so it's not impossible.

[IAlam]

3 minutes ago, Cait Sith said:

That's what I'm saying, that's the only time that track sees revenue service as of late.

When they had those weekend shuttles between Jamaica & Atlantic Terminal last month. They would lay up the train and then send it back down to Track 3 and board. I don't know why they don't do that now. It's not like they can't since they've done it multiple times, and they have trains during the rush hour that would pull of out of Jamaica Yard and goes westward, so it's not impossible.

I feel like for peak hours they have a valid case for why it's too difficult, but when it comes to off-peak I'm not sure. But honestly, I believe it comes from laziness, they don't want to have different standards for peak and off-peak service. It's more of less the same issue Queens Express buses have been dealing with for years. There's no good reason they can't have cross-platform transfers and connect during off peak hours but because it takes more work to plan that out they'd rather not do it. 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

9 minutes ago, IAlam said:

At this point, it seems the conductors are spread so thin I'm riding into Manhattan again without getting my ticket checked even on empty off-peak trains. The last time that was frequently happening to me was during the pandemic. 

That or they just don't feel like checking them.  I took MNRR this morning (semi-express train) and my conductor checked.  I would say out of the MNRR branches, I find it more common to not be checked on the Harlem line, either because the train is crowded or they just don't care and on the New Haven line, occasionally from points in Westchester down to Fordham.

[IAlam]

5 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

That or they just don't feel like checking them.  I took MNRR this morning (semi-express train) and my conductor checked.  I would say out of the MNRR branches, I find it more common to not be checked on the Harlem line, either because the train is crowded or they just don't care and on the New Haven line, occasionally from points in Westchester down to Fordham.

I felt like that was because a lot of people are transferring at Woodside. Basically, before then they would rather not check and after that, they might not have enough time depending on the train. I rarely see a conductor check before a major transfer point. 

[Far rockaway]

Ok so most Montauk branch diesel trains operate via the main line and central branch. But sometimes it operates via the Babylon Branch. Is there a way to know if the train your on will past by Babylon Stations or nah.

[danielhg121]

4 minutes ago, Far rockaway said:

Ok so most Montauk branch diesel trains operate via the main line and central branch. But sometimes it operates via the Babylon Branch. Is there a way to know if the train your on will past by Babylon Stations or nah.

Honestly they used to use Babylon branch before the schedule change provided service was running fine and there wasn’t a late train but they’ve changed it now to utilize the Main Line more. I’m guessing it’s less prone to delays cause of the third track. You would honestly just have to observe the train routings daily and see which branch it uses.

[Lawrence St]

With Penn Station access, why are they choosing to put an island platform on a 4 track section? Where are they going to put it?

Reason why I’m asking is because the right of way looks tight to where it can only fit 4 tracks.

Edited March 5, 2023 by Lawrence St

[xD4nn]

14 hours ago, Far rockaway said:

Ok so most Montauk branch diesel trains operate via the main line and central branch. But sometimes it operates via the Babylon Branch. Is there a way to know if the train your on will past by Babylon Stations or nah.

Use traintime. It displays the route.

[biGC323232]

On 3/4/2023 at 7:27 AM, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Of course you would paint it that way. There will always be entitled riders that only think of themselves, but let's not make it sound like the  did a good job here and a few people are just complaining just because, which is your usual narrative. When you have cars leaving Grand Central with ONE person in them, and cars that are overcapacity leaving Penn Station, it is clear that changes are needed to balance things out. They also royally screwed over Atlantic Terminal riders.  The transfers in general are poorly timed (this is the case at several stations) and force people to run around the terminal (specifically the Jamaica station) or face a longer commute that may make them late to work through no fault of their own. What it comes down to is they spent a lot of money on GCM and they want to make it appear that it is a success. No one wants to spent billions of dollars on a shiny new terminal that is barely used. 

It could be that demand was much higher for Grand Central pre-COVID, but the problem is ridership patterns have changed substantially in some cases as we move to a post-COVID environment and the  was given plenty of feedback before releasing these schedules, so it's not like they didn't know as they are trying to claim.

Me personally the  should have left service the way it is until GCM demaded an service increase.....Just cause it serve the east side doesnt means everybody gonna use it..Like u said they completely said the hell with brooklyn and everything now going to/from GCM which is totally not fair...They should have left the service as a shuttle from GCM -JM for a few months longer to actually see the ridership patterns...Like u  also said its cause of the money spent on GCM....

[Via Garibaldi 8]

2 hours ago, biGC323232 said:

Me personally the  should have left service the way it is until GCM demaded an service increase.....Just cause it serve the east side doesnt means everybody gonna use it..Like u said they completely said the hell with brooklyn and everything now going to/from GCM which is totally not fair...They should have left the service as a shuttle from GCM -JM for a few months longer to actually see the ridership patterns...Like u  also said its cause of the money spent on GCM....

Of late they have been sending out tons of surveys asking about service. It doesn't make any sense to send them out if you're not going to listen to what your customers are asking for.  Despite claiming that they were making changes to fix the schedules, LIRR riders are still complaining this week about severely late trains, missed transfers and overall chaos, esp. people going to Penn or Atlantic Terminal.

You may very well see some people switch to driving if this continues. It makes no sense to pay a premium to constantly have to worry about arriving to work on-time.

[IAlam]

On 3/5/2023 at 2:26 PM, Lawrence St said:

With Penn Station access, why are they choosing to put an island platform on a 4 track section? Where are they going to put it?

Reason why I’m asking is because the right of way looks tight to where it can only fit 4 tracks.

Is it 2 Island or a single one in the middle? If it's 2 my guess is for added flexibility, if it's 1 that seems like a cost-saving measure. 

3 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

Of late they have been sending out tons of surveys asking about service. It doesn't make any sense to send them out if you're not going to listen to what your customers are asking for.  Despite claiming that they were making changes to fix the schedules, LIRR riders are still complaining this week about severely late trains, missed transfers and overall chaos, esp. people going to Penn or Atlantic Terminal.

You may very well see some people switch to driving if this continues. It makes no sense to pay a premium to constantly have to worry about arriving to work on-time.

Yeah, where is this survey, me a and a lot of other people in my area are pissed that our service is effectively hourly now. 

[B35 via Church]

Please don't tell me it's true that you're now having riders in the morning taking trains to GCT & xferring over to the to get to the west side....

YGBFKM, if so... How much damn service in the morning did they take away from Penn..... Good lord...

 

[Lawrence St]

3 hours ago, IAlam said:

Is it 2 Island or a single one in the middle? If it's 2 my guess is for added flexibility, if it's 1 that seems like a cost-saving measure. 

Yeah, where is this survey, me a and a lot of other people in my area are pissed that our service is effectively hourly now. 

It’s a single one but it’s in a weird setup where it’s between the outer tracks.

[checkmatechamp13]

58 minutes ago, B35 via Church said:

Please don't tell me it's true that you're now having riders in the morning taking trains to GCT & xferring over to the to get to the west side....

YGBFKM, if so... How much damn service in the morning did they take away from Penn..... Good lord...

Basically, there was no increase in service levels east of Jamaica, so they took about 40-50% of the Penn Station trains, diverted them to Grand Central, added some shuttles to Brooklyn, and called it a day. So Penn Station saw about a 40-50% service cut. 

[Lawrence St]

10 hours ago, checkmatechamp13 said:

Basically, there was no increase in service levels east of Jamaica, so they took about 40-50% of the Penn Station trains, diverted them to Grand Central, added some shuttles to Brooklyn, and called it a day. So Penn Station saw about a 40-50% service cut. 

And that’s what leading to all these issues and complaints. 
 

They really should go back to the old schedule and increase service to GCT overtime as it gets more popular.

[danielhg121]

Welp Train 1523 Huntington to Penn is running with only 6 cars so... this should be interesting.

[46Dover]

I recently took a ride out of Grand Central (Don’t call me) Madison on the LIRR to Jamaica and I wish I could’ve had the benefit of a RFW to see the path of travel.  Think I lost five pounds from the walk alone through the station 😁

[46Dover]

15 hours ago, B35 via Church said:

Please don't tell me it's true that you're now having riders in the morning taking trains to GCT & xferring over to the to get to the west side....

YGBFKM, if so... How much damn service in the morning did they take away from Penn..... Good lord...

 

Maybe there’ll be 10 car  trains? 🤷🏽‍♂️

[46Dover]

3 hours ago, danielhg121 said:

Welp Train 1523 Huntington to Penn is running with only 6 cars so... this should be interesting.

Oof

[Lawrence St]

Amtrak will reduce service on the Hell Gate Bridge to accommodate work on Penn Station access.

[trainfan22]

41 minutes ago, Lawrence St said:

Amtrak will reduce service on the Hell Gate Bridge to accommodate work on Penn Station access.

Surprised since Amtrak isn't THAT frequent between NYP and BOS, I'm guessing single tracking between Queens and New Rochelle? That's the only reason I can see them needing to cut service though there.