Fleet Swap Discussion Thread

[MHV9218]

1 minute ago, Maxwell179 said:

I think he means it illegal for it to just have steps and no alternative method of boarding besides steps. 

Dunno, I read the comment as in response to the RTS, which obviously had steps but had lifts too.

[Cait Sith]

9 hours ago, Around the Horn said:

It's literally illegal to run local buses with steps. The Americans with Disabilities Act is legally binding you know...

And to bring this back to trains, the ADA also requires recorded automated announcements and signage that meets specific standards for passengers with difficulty seeing and hearing. These things are not luxuries, they are requirements for people with disabilities.

It's actually legal(otherwise, NJT wouldn't have gotten 500+ NABIs LOL), it's illegal to run local buses without lifts and/or ramps.

Edited December 14, 2020 by Cait Sith

[T to Dyre Avenue]

On 12/11/2020 at 11:24 AM, VIP said:

Concourse yard doesn’t have parts nor want to handle additional equipment other than their R68/68A.  They should really put the R46’s for   Service and not the R68/A’s and decrease Jamaica yard’s spare factor a bit. 

That I can agree with. Maybe even have Pitkin send its two-car R46 sets to CI so the  can once again run six-car trains. 

[Railfanner Mario]

Is is true that CIY yard currently has no more Siemens Sets as they all got transferred to Jamaica YD for some Alstom Sets back?

[Calvin]

30 minutes ago, Railfanner Mario said:

Is is true that CIY yard currently has no more Siemens Sets as they all got transferred to Jamaica YD for some Alstom Sets back?

Yes. The trade is 9833-9922 [Alstom] at Coney Island Yard with 8913-7, 9008-12, 9023-9102 [Siemens] being at Jamaica Yard. 

Edited December 14, 2020 by Calvin

[bobtehpanda]

On 12/12/2020 at 9:03 PM, R3238 said:

People are spoiled these day with these new tech trains LED lights and automatic announcement, why in a rush to retire the trains and bus,  the RTS bus run about 20 years or more if spoils brat didn't complainto the press for no wifi, phone charger and lazy to lift there feets up 3 step in the front door , and older trains avg , 60s years , believe me maintenance the old fleet is penny to MTA , they have so much waste they could cut ✂️ if they want to, thousands of bigwigs if I were them with budget issue i would cancel the R211 order,  i rather use the money to build the 2nd and 3rd phase 2nd ave line and build the 2nd station 10ave 41 st they to cheap to build decade ago

If they stopped buying buses for ten years it wouldn't pay for a single Second Avenue station.

The lifts are good for

• elderly
• people with disabilities (which includes temporary disabilities, like crutches)
• people with luggage
• people with strollers

You know what happens when people who find it difficult to use stairs are forced to use them? It slows down service, and people can get injured or even die. It is absolutely tragic to lose young mothers to falling down the stairs because there's no elevator for them to take the stroller.

(Also this is some smooth brain talk, because you still need to buy new cars to operate extensions.)

[Railfanner Mario]

7 hours ago, Calvin said:

Yes. The trade is 9833-9922 [Alstom] at Coney Island Yard with 8913-7, 9008-12, 9023-9102 [Siemens] being at Jamaica Yard. 

I believe the reason is to keep Siemens 160 sets only at 1 yard and not have them in multiple Yards?

[Calvin]

4 hours ago, Railfanner Mario said:

I believe the reason is to keep Siemens 160 sets only at 1 yard and not have them in multiple Yards?

Indeed it is. Have them maintained at 1 location (yard) with that specific group (siemens)

[VIP]

16 hours ago, Calvin said:

Yes. The trade is 9833-9922 [Alstom] at Coney Island Yard with 8913-7, 9008-12, 9023-9102 [Siemens] being at Jamaica Yard. 

9833-9922 is only 9 sets. Coney Island yard had 11 sets of R160’s after the swap. I believe its 9833-9942

[darkstar8983]

1 hour ago, VIP said:

9833-9922 is only 9 sets. Coney Island yard had 11 sets of R160’s after the swap. I believe its 9833-9942

Maybe it’s because some are still on standby for the . Hopefully once that fiasco is over, the additional trains in that series will come. They had 12 sets before the R179 failures if I’m not mistaken. Wouldn’t make sense to have transferred only up until 9922 and mess up the numbering scheme, leaving 9923-9942 in Jamaica

Edited December 15, 2020 by darkstar8983

[R32 3838]

3 hours ago, darkstar8983 said:

Maybe it’s because some are still on standby for the . Hopefully once that fiasco is over, the additional trains in that series will come. They had 12 sets before the R179 failures if I’m not mistaken. Wouldn’t make sense to have transferred only up until 9922 and mess up the numbering scheme, leaving 9923-9942 in Jamaica

 

its 9833-9922, all of this makes no sense at all. they should have kept the 9800's at Jamaica, they could have sent 8653-8712 (60 cars) and (9423-9477) 65 cars to CI instead.

[Lex]

19 hours ago, bobtehpanda said:

You know what happens when people who find it difficult to use stairs are forced to use them? It slows down service, and people can get injured or even die. It is absolutely tragic to lose young mothers to falling down the stairs because there's no elevator for them to take the stroller.

Dial the rhetoric back a bit. I'm fine with calling for improved accessibility, but I'd need hard evidence that she would've survived but for the stairs, and considering how little we've heard beyond the fact that she happened to fall down the stairs and that the coroner suspected a medical condition in a situation without even the perception of obligation toward a certain body (the MTA), I have no reason to think it was necessarily the stairs that did her in.

[VIP]

5 hours ago, R32 3838 said:

 

its 9833-9922, all of this makes no sense at all. they should have kept the 9800's at Jamaica, they could have sent 8653-8712 (60 cars) and (9423-9477) 65 cars to CI instead.

Why should they have sent such a random series to Coney Island (9423-9477) having KEPT 8653-8762 would’ve been logical. If Coney Island exclusively wanted R160B’s then they could have kept 9103-9197

[R32 3838]

5 hours ago, VIP said:

Why should they have sent such a random series to Coney Island (9423-9477) having KEPT 8653-8762 would’ve been logical. If Coney Island exclusively wanted R160B’s then they could have kept 9103-9197

the only reason why they probably didn't get those because the they redid the R160's (mixed up) in the coumo scheme and they have no seats at the B ends of the cars. that's why i said that random group, this is exactly why they sent the 98/9900's since they weren't modified. the 9400's weren't modified ether.

[VIP]

6 hours ago, R32 3838 said:

the only reason why they probably didn't get those because the they redid the R160's (mixed up) in the coumo scheme and they have no seats at the B ends of the cars. that's why i said that random group, this is exactly why they sent the 98/9900's since they weren't modified. the 9400's weren't modified ether.

Oh right I forgot about the “Cuomo scheme” refurbished R160’s but then they could have then kept or returned 8653-8762 if having exclusively R160Bs wasn’t a preference. 

Edited December 15, 2020 by VIP

[vioreen]

The R46 on the  runs a long distance from 207 to Far Rockaway and they don't break down, so why are the R46 on the  breakdown fast ?

[R179 8258]

8 minutes ago, vioreen said:

The R46 on the  runs a long distance from 207 to Far Rockaway and they don't break down, so why are the R46 on the  breakdown fast ?

Think it’s because Pitkin knows that they’ll have the R46s until they retire , whereas Jamaica knew the swap was going to happen to they just let the R46s good and focus on the R160s they have 

[danielhg121]

59 minutes ago, vioreen said:

The R46 on the  runs a long distance from 207 to Far Rockaway and they don't break down, so why are the R46 on the  breakdown fast ?

Well, Pitkin has had the R46's for awhile now so I'm sure they know how to troubleshoot issues with ease whereas Coney Island didn't have nearly as much experience as Pitkin nor Jamaica did. Also, Jamaica treated their R46's like crap in general and they have a lot of cars of various classes to maintain but Pitkin really only had the R46's and maybe a few R32's.

Edited December 21, 2020 by danielhg121

[Around the Horn]

4 hours ago, vioreen said:

The R46 on the  runs a long distance from 207 to Far Rockaway and they don't break down, so why are the R46 on the  breakdown fast ?

The may have a longer trip and therefor more total route miles, but it has a higher spare factor than the which means each individual set is being used less than the ones on the .

[NoHacksJustKhaks]

5 hours ago, vioreen said:

The R46 on the  runs a long distance from 207 to Far Rockaway and they don't break down, so why are the R46 on the  breakdown fast ?

Many R46's are now assigned to a yard that doesn't typically operate them, and the above comments on spare factor also apply. These are older trains and making them run well takes time and some experience. R46's on broadway will likely fail less with time and experience.

Also, R46's on the  were not flawless either, they broke down decently often as well when they dominated the line.  

[darkstar8983]

6 hours ago, NoHacksJustKhaks said:

Many R46's are now assigned to a yard that doesn't typically operate them, and the above comments on spare factor also apply. These are older trains and making them run well takes time and some experience. R46's on broadway will likely fail less with time and experience.

Also, R46's on the  were not flawless either, they broke down decently often as well when they dominated the line.  

9283-9287/XXXX - XXXX is doing a stint on the  

[R32 3838]

11 hours ago, NoHacksJustKhaks said:

Many R46's are now assigned to a yard that doesn't typically operate them, and the above comments on spare factor also apply. These are older trains and making them run well takes time and some experience. R46's on broadway will likely fail less with time and experience.

Also, R46's on the  were not flawless either, they broke down decently often as well when they dominated the line.  

But the had a 12 set spare factor while Coney Island Has Barely any. This is what happens when an Agency don't want to run a few R32's to balance out the fleet so instead lets run the 2nd oldest cars to the ground.

[R10 2952]

1 hour ago, R32 3838 said:

But the had a 12 set spare factor while Coney Island Has Barely any. This is what happens when an Agency don't want to run a few R32's to balance out the fleet so instead lets run the 2nd oldest cars to the ground.

3rd oldest, theoretically there's still R42s on-property they could use if need be, but I get your point all the same.

[darkstar8983]

1 hour ago, R32 3838 said:

But the had a 12 set spare factor while Coney Island Has Barely any. This is what happens when an Agency don't want to run a few R32's to balance out the fleet so instead lets run the 2nd oldest cars to the ground.

There’s only 355 R46s at Pitkin, and the  needs 224 to make service, along with 110 R179s. The rockaway shuttle needs 12 R46s.

 

244 + 12 = 256 R46s needed just to make service. The spare factor is 12 additional R46 cars for the  and let’s say for the sake of the argument, 24 R46s.

That leads to 256 + 12 + 24 = 292 R46s. This leaves only 69 (in reality) R46s to not only make  service but also serve as a spare factor. The  has 88 R179s (but only 72 run daily), meaning that if we want a spare factor of 4 train sets, only five R46  trains (40 cars) can run, leaving 2 R179 trains and 2 R46 trains as spares. This is partly why the  has to run a 12 minute headway regardless of full crew availability. The only other solution would be to move some R46s from Coney Island to Pitkin and R160s from Jamaica to Coney Island.

 

long story short, the B division has a serious car crunch.

[darkstar8983]

9618-9622 / ???? Seen on the  at Ditmars Blvd, and 9198-9202/9638-9642 on the  

Edited December 21, 2020 by darkstar8983