BUS - Random Thoughts Thread

[Q43LTD]

They just had to add another LTD, to spare the axing of the Q21.... The Q52 is that 21 LTD.....

So this really all boils down to the Q21.

 

The Q21 extension (to QCM) cut into Q11 service, and prior to that, the Q53 (the rendition that first saw LTD stops along woodhaven, instead of going straight to the Wildlife Refuge from Hoffman) cut into the ridership of the Q11... The latter I never had a problem with, it's the former I have an issue with....

 

Basically, all that was needed was the local Q11 & the LTD Q53.... Now you have this over-saturation of LTD service & a very noticeable lack of local service along Woodhaven, and I firmly believe that is by design.....

 

Unlike with the M98, notice the Q52 nor the Q53 is seeing any bastardization.... Yeah, because they want M101 LTD's to be crushloaded, the M98 gone, and the Q52/53 SBS'd.....

 

I get the sense they don't really want to run that route (M98); hell, I felt that way even before the cutback to 67th/68th.... But as it is, the MTA does little things like this to thwart riders away from taking a route (route truncation to where a route's much less useful, significant enough span reduction &/or headway increases)..... Then when enough riders no longer consider utilizing a route of sorts that already suffers from low ridership, then there's their justification right there to axe it...... I happen to think VG8's onto something with that LTD thing....

 

To your other point, I don't see neither one of them as being short turns to their other respective LTD routes (Q52 to the Q53, M98 to the M101)....

 

pair 1] Most the folks along Woodhaven/Cross Bay are not riding past the mall; turnover is ridiculous at QCM for the Q53.....So as such, the Q52 IMO is nothing more than an unnecessary 2nd LTD along Woodhaven.... Worse, if we're to talk about the Rockaway portion, the demand is by far & large for the Q53......

 

pair 2] As for the M98 & M101, I see them as two separate routes.... One that the MTA wants everyone along that corridor to cram on, and one the MTA wants to fail & eventually can.....

 

Avatar with a B in it... Yeah, alright...

 

I'm going comment on any route I have rode many times before, regardless of where I don't live; silly prerequisite to try to impose on someone & silence them with.....

 

For someone who's more proximal to the M98 & takes it on occasion or whatever, one would think you have a hell of a lot more to add than how so difficult it is to get to the M101, how crowded the M4 would supposedly be, and how crowded the M98 gets along 178th (which was never disputed anyway).... Have someone read your post, they'd think the M98 only served Washington Heights.....

 

I find that most people resort to using the fixed/regular stops....

All jokes aside, I find that the main people that (inadvertently) use request a stop are actually..... drunks..... Well that & rowdy teenagers/young adults coming back from some party.... But regular nightly commuters, nah...

 

Before I started doing a bunch of late night fanning many moons ago, I would have thought that demographic would have been heavily female requesting to get off at a corner that isn't a bus stop or w/e, but I find that even they tend to ring the bell to get off at a fixed stop.....

 

42nd is a nice compromise, but I would still also revert the full routing of the M98.... Don't know about all day per se, but I actually wish it did have a broader span..... Cutting it to end it around Hunter college is flat-out bullshit...

Should I praise or chide the for what they've done on Woodhaven? Back in the PBL days it was just the Q11 (the Howard Beach branches and the short turns to Rockaway Blvd ). It had minimal help with the Q21/41 from Liberty to Pitkin. And then the Q21, I'll never forget this the 72 minute headways it had in its Green Line days, from 164 down. I mean they really got the shaft in Howard Beach and Broad Channel. 

[IAlam]

Technically, they say that Request-A-Stop is not available on +SBS+ routes, limited-stop routes, and express routes. I've heard that excuse from the MTA's customer service representatives when I complained that one of the last S93 drivers of the night basically made me walk in the grass along Victory Blvd because he didn't want to drop me off outside the CSI gate. The MTA's response was that it's not available on limited-stop buses, even though the S93 runs local west of Jewett.

 

It makes sense not to have it on the limited-stop/express portions of the limited/express routes because there's usually alternatives in those areas (and obviously it doesn't make sense to have an express bus randomly get off the highway and drop somebody off). But once they're running on their local portions, I don't see why that shouldn't happen. Most B/Os at that time of night are reasonable, but you have some of those annoying "by the book" operators who just like to bust chops.

 

From the MTA Website

 

 

 

Request-A-Stop service is not available on limited-stop bus service, Select Bus Service (SBS), the non-stop portion of express bus service, or shuttle bus service.

After 10 you can be dropped anywhere on Express buses as long as it's during the pick up/drop off portion, and I'd be more than willing to write a complaint for any driver who refuses to do that. 

 

[GojiMet86]

#1016 is on the M34A-SBS. Funny thing is, this also happened a couple of nights ago.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

#1016 is on the M34A-SBS. Funny thing is, this also happened a couple of nights ago.

What's so odd about that?

[B35 via Church]

The demand is higher for the Rockaway Park portion, but at the same time, the Q53 basically has double the frequency of the Q52, so it's not like the Q52 is tremendously overserved. And turnover might be high at the QCM, but at the same time, that doesn't negate the fact that the Q53 route physically begins at Woodside (in other words, it's a backup in case there's traffic along Broadway in Elmhurst).

 

Would you feel any differently if the Q52 was a local? (No change in the physical route, but all local stops from QCM to Arverne). One of the things is that the Q52 basically provides extra limited-stop capacity along Woodhaven, but at the same time, some of that demand (i.e. the need for that limited-stop capacity to begin with) is due to the crappy local service.

Nobody is disputing where the Q52 ends, with respect to where the Q53 physically ends... Nor am I stating that isn't how the Q52 is literally used with respect to the Q53 - yes the Q52 is backup, but I still don't see it as a short turn of the Q53 & those two statements aren't saying the same thing either.... It would be like me saying the B74 is a short turn of the B36 (which is isn't, regardless of the 1 block difference) - but the B74 is most certainly backup to the B36 (well these days, the B36 is backup to the B74 , but in any case).....

 

Way I see it, by saying/deeming/feeling the Q52 is a short turn of the Q53, you're ignoring the Rockaways.... Hell, the first area that comes to mind when I think about the Q53 is the Rockaways.... Probably one of the main reasons why I don't feel the same way you do about this.... Well that, and how the Q52 came to existence in & of itself.....

 

But yeah, after I said I don't see the Q52 as a short turn of the Q53, I was posting my sentiments about the two routes...

You're addressing it as if I'm disputing your sentiments:

 

As for the 2nd paragraph there.... If the Q52 was a local from QCM to Arverne, in conjunction with the Q11 & the Q21 running to QCM, I would even be more miffed with how the MTA is handling Woodhaven.... Something would have to give with the Q21 & such a Q52 of sorts..... Unless you're talking about seeing a Q52 local being a short turn to the Q53 LTD, which I still wouldn't.....

 

Should I praise or chide the for what they've done on Woodhaven?

 

Back in the PBL days it was just the Q11 (the Howard Beach branches and the short turns to Rockaway Blvd ). It had minimal help with the Q21/41 from Liberty to Pitkin. And then the Q21, I'll never forget this the 72 minute headways it had in its Green Line days, from 164 down. I mean they really got the shaft in Howard Beach and Broad Channel. 

They've forced excessive LTD service & undermined the shit out of (the importance of) local service along Woodhaven... Looking at the big picture, I'm not praising them for that..... The small victory I will give/praise them on, is how they've managed to spare the Q21 (even if it came with less Q11 service).... I was okay with 11/21 local service & the Q53 being the long LTD.... But when this Q52 came out, even less service was taken away from the 11 (which had service taken away from it w/ the Q21 extension), and on top of that, a slight bit of servicewas taken from the Q53 as well).... I'm like WTF is really good with all these goddamn LTD's here....

 

Lol @ those infamous 72 min headways.... 72 min headways for like what, a 20 minute ride!

 

But yeah, the biggest victory I'll give the MTA when it comes to that corridor, is the transformation of the Q53 (regarding the nonstop service b/w Hoffman & the wildlife refuge, compared to what it is today).... Now that's how you eradicate antiquation....

 

Now if that same emphasis/effort was done to address other antiquated routes/portions of routes on other routes.....

[MysteriousBtrain]

What's so odd about that?

1016 is not an SBS bus.

[Fresh Pond]

What's so odd about that?

1016 is not an SBS bus.

A friend of mine took this photo:

 

Edited December 8, 2016 by Turtle

[NewFlyer 230]

Nobody is disputing where the Q52 ends, with respect to where the Q53 physically ends... Nor am I stating that isn't how the Q52 is literally used with respect to the Q53 - yes the Q52 is backup, but I still don't see it as a short turn of the Q53 & those two statements aren't saying the same thing either.... It would be like me saying the B74 is a short turn of the B36 (which is isn't, regardless of the 1 block difference) - but the B74 is most certainly backup to the B36 (well these days, the B36 is backup to the B74 , but in any case).....

 

Way I see it, by saying/deeming/feeling the Q52 is a short turn of the Q53, you're ignoring the Rockaways.... Hell, the first area that comes to mind when I think about the Q53 is the Rockaways.... Probably one of the main reasons why I don't feel the same way you do about this.... Well that, and how the Q52 came to existence in & of itself.....

 

But yeah, after I said I don't see the Q52 as a short turn of the Q53, I was posting my sentiments about the two routes...

You're addressing it as if I'm disputing your sentiments:

 

As for the 2nd paragraph there.... If the Q52 was a local from QCM to Arverne, in conjunction with the Q11 & the Q21 running to QCM, I would even be more miffed with how the MTA is handling Woodhaven.... Something would have to give with the Q21 & such a Q52 of sorts..... Unless you're talking about seeing a Q52 local being a short turn to the Q53 LTD, which I still wouldn't.....

 

They've forced excessive LTD service & undermined the shit out of (the importance of) local service along Woodhaven... Looking at the big picture, I'm not praising them for that..... The small victory I will give/praise them on, is how they've managed to spare the Q21 (even if it came with less Q11 service).... I was okay with 11/21 local service & the Q53 being the long LTD.... But when this Q52 came out, even less service was taken away from the 11 (which had service taken away from it w/ the Q21 extension), and on top of that, a slight bit of servicewas taken from the Q53 as well).... I'm like WTF is really good with all these goddamn LTD's here....

 

Lol @ those infamous 72 min headways.... 72 min headways for like what, a 20 minute ride!

 

But yeah, the biggest victory I'll give the MTA when it comes to that corridor, is the transformation of the Q53 (regarding the nonstop service b/w Hoffman & the wildlife refuge, compared to what it is today).... Now that's how you eradicate antiquation....

 

Now if that same emphasis/effort was done to address other antiquated routes/portions of routes on other routes.....

I personally and still stand by this that I believe the Q21 should have gotten axed back in 2010.

If the had of improved service on the Q11 and Q53 from the get go there would be no need for the Q21 and Q52.

It's unfortunate how the Q11 went from having over 11,000 daily ridership in 2007 to only 4,000+ in 2015. The Q53's did increase heavily itself but I feel like the Q11 and Q53 could of had a more balanced ridership along Woodhaven. I feel the addition of more LTD service and the decrease of Local service was part of the MTA's grand plan to eventually put SBS on Woodhaven. And with the Q53 and Q52 as popular as they are that would only justify the need for it even more even if it doesn't save the average person much time in the long run.

The Q52 as far as I'm concerned is a short turned Q53 and a alternative.

The Q21 I don't know what to say about that one.

I feel a problem with the MTA when it comes to MTA bus is that they are so quick to make a branch of a service with a new destinations but avoids fixing the problem all together.

They made so many different variations of the QM1/QM1A is pathetic. It made since to break the QM1A into the QM5, QM6, QM7 and QM8. But when you add the QM31, QM35 and QM35 it only makes me suspicious that the MTA is looking to cut in many areas as possible. It's unfortunate because they should be promoting this service not looking to get rid of it. Queens MTA bus express routes will fall victim to the "Spring Creek" effect. The continuous cutting until service is bare minimum. It makes me wonder why doesn't the MTA rename branches of NYCT express bus routes. I can already imagine how the X63, X64 and X68 service would look like if each of its individual branches had its own destination.

I alway wonder what would happen to local service when SBS arrives to Woodhaven Blvd

[Via Garibaldi 8]

1016 is not an SBS bus.

 

 

A friend of mine took this photo:

 

I had no idea that was an old bus... Interesting indeed... Bad idea IMO, given how crowded some of those M34 buses can be...

[paulrivera]

Maybe they're expanding the vintage buses to the M34A with vintage artics or something LMAO

 

Speaking of which, anyone remember the one year they tried to run the vintage buses in every borough? Is it true that the drivers in the other boroughs never even bothered to take the vintage buses out of the depots?

[Around the Horn]

Maybe they're expanding the vintage buses to the M34A with vintage artics or something LMAO

 

Speaking of which, anyone remember the one year they tried to run the vintage buses in every borough? Is it true that the drivers in the other boroughs never even bothered to take the vintage buses out of the depots?

LMAO!

As for the second part of your post, yes that was what I heard

[danielhg121]

Can u blame them? What happens if they break down?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using NYC Transit Forums mobile app

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

Didn't they run them on the Q32 before though?

[R188 7857]

I never really noticed until today, but 5987 is A LOT faster than the 7000 series XD40s. Being on a 74xx after riding 5987 feels slow and horrible. Why can't they adjust the Allisons on the XD40s? Those buses are way to slow when accelerating.  

Edited December 8, 2016 by R188 7857

[Jdog14]

I never really noticed until today, but 5987 is A LOT faster than the 7000 series XD40s. Being on a 74xx after riding 5987 feels slow and horrible. Why can't they adjust the Allisons on the XD40s? Those buses are way to slow when accelerating.  

 

Or maybe you haven't ridden enough 7000s with fast drivers....

[paulrivera]

I never really noticed until today, but 5987 is A LOT faster than the 7000 series XD40s. Being on a 74xx after riding 5987 feels slow and horrible. Why can't they adjust the Allisons on the XD40s? Those buses are way to slow when accelerating.  

I can't wait until those XN40's hit West Farms. I hope they spread them around and not just keep them on the Bx6 SBS...

[R188 7857]

Or maybe you haven't ridden enough 7000s with fast drivers....

I've heard before that the 7000s have really slow acceleration, even when I do get fast drivers the bus seems to drag. 

[IAlam]

I personally and still stand by this that I believe the Q21 should have gotten axed back in 2010.

If the had of improved service on the Q11 and Q53 from the get go there would be no need for the Q21 and Q52.

It's unfortunate how the Q11 went from having over 11,000 daily ridership in 2007 to only 4,000+ in 2015. The Q53's did increase heavily itself but I feel like the Q11 and Q53 could of had a more balanced ridership along Woodhaven. I feel the addition of more LTD service and the decrease of Local service was part of the MTA's grand plan to eventually put SBS on Woodhaven. And with the Q53 and Q52 as popular as they are that would only justify the need for it even more even if it doesn't save the average person much time in the long run.

The Q52 as far as I'm concerned is a short turned Q53 and a alternative.

The Q21 I don't know what to say about that one.

I feel a problem with the MTA when it comes to MTA bus is that they are so quick to make a branch of a service with a new destinations but avoids fixing the problem all together.

They made so many different variations of the QM1/QM1A is pathetic. It made since to break the QM1A into the QM5, QM6, QM7 and QM8. But when you add the QM31, QM35 and QM35 it only makes me suspicious that the MTA is looking to cut in many areas as possible. It's unfortunate because they should be promoting this service not looking to get rid of it. Queens MTA bus express routes will fall victim to the "Spring Creek" effect. The continuous cutting until service is bare minimum. It makes me wonder why doesn't the MTA rename branches of NYCT express bus routes. I can already imagine how the X63, X64 and X68 service would look like if each of its individual branches had its own destination.

I alway wonder what would happen to local service when SBS arrives to Woodhaven Blvd

SBS definitely has a horrible effect on local service, Evening/late night local service on Main St after SBS has pretty much been f*****. Q20 Ridership at this point seems to depend on mainly whether or not the Q44 comes. Though I will admit there seems to be an increase in more dedicated riders on the Q20, (Mainly Students and Seniors) but I haven't seen any numbers to back it up yet. However it still doesn't change the fact that 20 reliability has been worse with random fluctuations of passengers. 

[MikeC]

When I take any of the Woodhaven buses its usually to go to the A at rockaway blvd or to the mall so I just hop on whatever comes first. I do tend to notice that the people who use it for local stops get screwed waiting for the 11/21. It probably would be best to have a single Local and a single limited and increase service on both. 

[Cait Sith]

Didn't they run them on the Q32 before though?

 

Nope. The closest thing they've gotten to running an artic on the Q32 was running them on the shuttle in Queens.

 

I had no idea that was an old bus... Interesting indeed... Bad idea IMO, given how crowded some of those M34 buses can be...

 

Not at that time of the night. That was taken around 11pm, that M34/M34A eastbound is practically empty.

 

I never really noticed until today, but 5987 is A LOT faster than the 7000 series XD40s. Being on a 74xx after riding 5987 feels slow and horrible. Why can't they adjust the Allisons on the XD40s? Those buses are way to slow when accelerating.  

Artics generally have more power than their 40ft variants. The engine and the transmission is more powerful (Cummins ISL9 380HP compared to a 330HP and an Allison WB-500R Gen V compared to a WB-400R Gen V) than their 40ft counterparts.

 

A proper comparison would be artic to artic.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Not at that time of the night. That was taken around 11pm, that M34/M34A eastbound is practically empty.

 

 

Well if the plan is to run those late nights, then it makes sense from a mileage standpoint, otherwise I don't agree with it.  They like to run older buses on the M79 at night as well.

[Cait Sith]

Well if the plan is to run those late nights, then it makes sense from a mileage standpoint, otherwise I don't agree with it.  They like to run older buses on the M79 at night as well.

There is no plan, it's about necessity.

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

Nope. The closest thing they've gotten to running an artic on the Q32 was running them on the shuttle in Queens.

I know that, I was referring to the vintage buses when I made my post.

[Cait Sith]

I know that, I was referring to the vintage buses when I made my post.

Ohhhh, yeah, once, when they had them operate through a bunch of Quill routes.

 

Sent from my HTC 10 using Tapatalk

[Via Garibaldi 8]

There is no plan, it's about necessity.

That makes no sense given the (MTA)'s push to phase out these high floor artics.  So you're saying they are short of buses?