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48 minutes ago, 4 via Mosholu said:

I have seen about half the fluorescent lights of a Dyre Avenue bound (2) and (5) trains turn off at Baychester Avenue as the doors are closing up, only to come back on as it is departing to go to Dyre, and I have not seen the same thing happen on the Manhattan bound platform. I wonder if it was due to a third rail gap within that area, if it was because of a tragic accident at the Dyre platform that happened that led to that policy, or if it came from the older New York, Westchester, and Boston Railroad practice.

A 3rd rail gap wouldn't cause what you're describing....

32 minutes ago, Trainmaster5 said:

I have never experienced this problem as a rider or an employee. As a matter of fact I have never even heard this mentioned before by anyone else.  SMEE, NTT, or any other type of equipment. Is this something new ? I have no idea what causes this.  Carry on. 

I've never heard or seen anything like that happening either.... As the train is in motion upon switching tracks or whatever, yeah, the lights (in the whole car) will temporary cut off; but as it pertains to half of all the lights cutting off (on a stationary train) as the doors are closing? Haven't seen that... Although I would be interested to know just wth would cause such a phenomenon....

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31 minutes ago, M5viaRiverside said:

Do the (B) and (Q) run directly underneath the (2)(3)(4) (5) between Atlantic Avenue and Grand Army Plaza?

They runs alongside the (2) and (3). North of 7th Avenue on the (B)(Q) there’s an opening in the tunnel where you can see the northbound (2)(3) local track right next to the southbound (B)(Q).

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8 minutes ago, Maxwell179 said:

Just got off the (J) at Flushing , announcement went along the lines of “ this is an accessible station , the elevator is located at the front of the platform “. Have these announcements been out for a while now ? 

Yes, it's been a thing for a good while. Although, I can't recall if they are on all NTTs with that announcement since I haven't taken the train in a while or at stations with elevators to really give a definitive answer.

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On 11/20/2020 at 1:11 PM, 4 via Mosholu said:

I have seen about half the fluorescent lights of a Dyre Avenue bound (2) and (5) trains turn off at Baychester Avenue as the doors are closing up, only to come back on as it is departing to go to Dyre, and I have not seen the same thing happen on the Manhattan bound platform. I wonder if it was due to a third rail gap within that area, if it was because of a tragic accident at the Dyre platform that happened that led to that policy, or if it came from the older New York, Westchester, and Boston Railroad practice.

I think you could answer this question @Trainmaster5 as you spent most of your time via Dyre, some of it via Bronx Park.

I know exactly what you're talking about, as I've seen it dozens of times on departing (5) trains going N/B. Hoping someone can share some insight as well. 

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On 11/20/2020 at 1:11 PM, 4 via Mosholu said:

I have seen about half the fluorescent lights of a Dyre Avenue bound (2) and (5) trains turn off at Baychester Avenue as the doors are closing up, only to come back on as it is departing to go to Dyre, and I have not seen the same thing happen on the Manhattan bound platform. I wonder if it was due to a third rail gap within that area, if it was because of a tragic accident at the Dyre platform that happened that led to that policy, or if it came from the older New York, Westchester, and Boston Railroad practice.

I think you could answer this question @Trainmaster5 as you spent most of your time via Dyre, some of it via Bronx Park.

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Edited by subway4832
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So I've been working the past week on how the (MTA) could modify service patterns due to the budget crisis, please give feedback.

Quote

(1) - No routing change.

Frequency change during rush hours to every 7 minutes and every 10 minutes off-peak.

Quote

(2) - Routing change.

During rush hours in the peak direction, select (2) trains will operate express between East 180th St and 3rd Av.

Frequency change during rush hours to every 7 minutes and every 10-12 minutes off-peak.

Quote

(3)Route Eliminated.

Route eliminated, service replaced by the (2) and (4). 145th St and 148th St stations closed. 148th St yard now serves as the overflow yard to 238th St yard.

Quote

(4) - Routing change.

All trains will now operate between Woodlawn & New Lots Av at all times.

Frequency change during off peak to every 8 minutes.

Quote

(5)Routing change.

This route will operate during rush hours only, between 149th St-Grand Concourse and Bowling Green.

Frequency remains the same during rush hour.

*NOTE: The reason for this new (5) is to keep the same service level on Lexington Av to avoid over crowding. 

Quote

(6)<6> - Frequency change, <6> discontinued.

No more <6> service.

Frequency change during off peak to every 8 minutes.

Quote

(7)<7> - Frequency change, <7> service reduced to avoid overcrowding.

<7> operates with less frequent service between 7:30 AM to 8:45 AM and 3 PM to 6 PM.

(7) frequency change during off peak to every 7 minutes.

Quote

(S)Dyre Ave Shuttle - New route.

This shuttle operates with 5 car sets, operating between East 180th St and Eastchester-Dyre Av, every 10 minutes days and evenings.

Quote

(S) 42nd St Shuttle - Operating Span change.

Operates between the hours of 7:30 AM and 10 PM.

 

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14 hours ago, Lawrence St said:

So I've been working the past week on how the (MTA) could modify service patterns due to the budget crisis, please give feedback.

 

Sounds good but I would do it this way:

(1) - Rush hour frequency reduced to every 5 minutes. Midday and evening frequency every 10 minutes, weekends every 10 minutes

(2) - Rush hour frequency reduced to every 6 minutes. midday, evening, and weekend service every 10 minutes

(3) - Rush hour frequency every 10 minutes. Midday, and evening frequency every 12 minutes. No weekend service

(4) - Rush hour frequency every 6 minutes. Midday, evening and weekend frequency every 10 minutes. Local in Brooklyn weekends

(5) - Trains run between Eastchester-Dyre Av and Bowling Green weekdays only. 12 minute headways all day. No weekend service

(6)<6> - Rush hour express/local frequency reduced to every 8 minutes for local and express service. No midday <6> and (6) service runs every 8-10 minutes. Evenings and weekends (6) runs every 10 minutes

(7)<7> - rush hour express/local frequency reduced to every 6 minutes. Midday (7) and evening service every 8 minutes. No <7> after 7:45PM departure from 34 St-Hudson Yards. Weekend service every 7-8 minutes.

 

(A) - No Rockaway Park Rush Hour service. Service every 10 minutes rush hours out of Far Rockaway/Lefferts Blvd, every 20 minutes all other times.

(B) - Trains run only between 145 St and Brighton Beach every 10 minutes rush hours, 15 minutes middays

(C) - Keep the current 12 minute weekday headway rush hours. Reduce midday, evening, and weekend frequency to every 15 minutes

(D) - local service in the Bronx. Midday frequency every 12 minutes. All other frequency unchanged

(E) - Eliminate 179 St rush hour service. Trains run every 6 minutes rush hours, 10 minutes middays and evenings, every 12-15 minutes weekends

(F) - Keep rush hour frequency at current 8 minute headways, reduce midday and evening frequency to 10 minutes

(G) - Rush hour frequency reduced to every 10 and midday/evening/weekend frequency reduced to every 12-15 minutes. 
 

(J)(Z) - Rush hour frequency unchanged. Midday, evening and weekend frequency every 12-15 minutes

(L) - Rush hour frequency reduced to every 5 minutes. Trains run every 10 minutes all other times

(M) - Rush hour frequency reduced to every 10 minutes. Midday service frequency every 12 minutes. Evening and weekend service frequency every 15 minutes

(N) - Local service in Manhattan. Midday frequency every 12 minutes.

*Select trains terminate at Canal St or Whitehall St rush hours - see (W) entry

(Q) - Midday, evening and weekend frequency reduced to every 10 minutes (12 minutes possibly weekends)

(R) - Rush hour frequency reduced to every 8-10 minutes. Midday/evening frequency reduced to every 12 minutes. 

(W) - Eliminated (or would run rush hours only from 7AM to 9:30AM, 4:30PM to 6:30PM departing Ditmars Blvd, every 20 minutes). If the 20 minute rush hour frequency is selected, (N) trains express in Manhattan rush hours

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25 minutes ago, darkstar8983 said:

Sounds good but I would do it this way:

Your not reducing enough service to fix the budget problem.

The (3), (B)(W)(Z) all have to be discontinued in order to fix and maintain the budget.

At least with my plan, we keep almost the same frequency and connectivity throughout the system. The (5) stays during rush hours to reduce the overcrowding on the (4). The (3) can be replaced by additional (2) trains if need be.

While the (B) is useful, it would make more sense to discontinue the (B), have the (C) run between 168th St and World Trade Center with more frequent service and extend the (E) to Euclid Av or Lefferts Blvd.

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16 hours ago, Lawrence St said:

So I've been working the past week on how the (MTA) could modify service patterns due to the budget crisis, please give feedback.

 

Eliminating the (3) on weekends will be a disaster for the (2) even if you add extra trains...Also making the (4) all local on weekends in Brklyn i really dont agree with.... 

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37 minutes ago, biGC323232 said:

Eliminating the (3) on weekends will be a disaster for the (2) even if you add extra trains...Also making the (4) all local on weekends in Brklyn i really dont agree with.... 

How so? The loss of the (3) can partially be replaced by extra (2) trains that end at 135th St.

And the (4) stays express (except between Franklin Av & Utica Av). The only change is that Eastern Pkwy local service starts earlier then it does now.

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2 hours ago, Lawrence St said:

How so? The loss of the (3) can partially be replaced by extra (2) trains that end at 135th St.

And the (4) stays express (except between Franklin Av & Utica Av). The only change is that Eastern Pkwy local service starts earlier then it does now.

I second this, I think there were a few weekends where they did just this. And with current ridership levels due to COVID, you could definitely do away with the (3). You could send every other :15x15_px_02: to 148, or reinstitute the shuttle bus

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1 minute ago, Lawrence St said:

Why not? Without the (B) you have (C) headways of 12-15 minutes when it can become 6 minutes or better with the shortened (C) route. No (B) , shortened (C) and extended (E) should save a lot of money.

No you won't because you would have to now add extra crews for the (E) Train to have it extend to Euclid Avenue and the cuts is supposed to lay off workers. On top of that the (E) extension to Euclid Avenue will be longer than the current (C) Train route.

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5 hours ago, Lawrence St said:

Your not reducing enough service to fix the budget problem.

The (3), (B)(W)(Z) all have to be discontinued in order to fix and maintain the budget.

At least with my plan, we keep almost the same frequency and connectivity throughout the system. The (5) stays during rush hours to reduce the overcrowding on the (4). The (3) can be replaced by additional (2) trains if need be.

While the (B) is useful, it would make more sense to discontinue the (B), have the (C) run between 168th St and World Trade Center with more frequent service and extend the (E) to Euclid Av or Lefferts Blvd.

1. Eliminating the (J)(Z) skip stop pattern wouldn’t save much because then extra money would be needed to run the all-local (J) service.

2. if the (W) is eliminated, the rush hour current frequency of the (N) (7 minute headways) has to be maintained at least in Queens/Manhattan, even if in Brooklyn service gets cut (to 10-12 minutes), which is why for the (N) / (W), some version of the Astoria-Whitehall St service pattern is left over for rush hours.

3. The (5) cannot run at current rush hour frequencies between 149 St and Bowling Green due to the track and switch layout. Might as well keep my proposed Dyre Av-Bowling Green pattern every 12 minutes.

4. If you eliminate the (B) , the (Q) train in Brooklyn would have to run its current headways at all times. In the Bronx, the (B) is already getting slashed in my proposal and the frequency is cut from every 6 minutes to every 10-12 minutes rush hours. The service hours could be cut too, ending at 8PM instead of 9PM.

5. The <7> ridership is too high to see major service cuts, hence why i proposed a softer service reduction for this line.

6. most of the frequency cuts I suggested (at least in the B division) are centered in Queens, where the availability of the (E)(F)(M)(R) can offset the service reductions on either one of these lines individually.

 

the tough part is maintaining an appropriate level of service everywhere because otherwise, in some areas, the frequency cut would be above 50-60%, and blue-collar workers are still going to work. Believe it or not, the subway has been more crowded especially during the early/late shoulders of the rush hours, with about 35-40% of the pre-COVID ridership

Edited by darkstar8983
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Problem with these service cutbacks is they're self-defeating - cut service on trains and make more people ride significantly fewer trains in Lex Av SRO conditions and you end up driving more ridership away.

If anything, the cutbacks should really be to realign service so buses don't duplicate subway routes and feed riders to them instead (like other Transit Systems do when they build rail lines).

Can someone do math on how much could be saved if (MTA) got rid of north-south buses along subway routes in the Bronx and Manhattan and Brooklyn?

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46 minutes ago, darkstar8983 said:

1. Eliminating the (J)(Z) skip stop pattern wouldn’t save much because then extra money would be needed to run the all-local (J) service.

2. if the (W) is eliminated, the rush hour current frequency of the (N) has to be maintained at least in Queens/Manhattan, even if in Brooklyn service gets cut, which is why for the (N) / (W), some version of the Astoria-Whitehall St service pattern is left over for rush hours.

3. The (5) cannot run at current rush hour frequencies between 149 St and Bowling Green due to the track and switch layout. Might as well keep my proposed Dyre Av-Bowling Green pattern every 12 minutes.

4. If you eliminate the (B) , the (Q) train in Brooklyn would have to run its current headways at all times. In the Bronx, the (B) is already getting slashed in my proposal and the frequency is cut from every 6 minutes to every 10-12 minutes rush hours. The service hours could be cut too, ending at 8PM instead of 9PM.

5. The <7> ridership is too high to see major service cuts, hence why i proposed a softer service reduction for this line.

6. most of the frequency cuts I suggested (at least in the B division) are centered in Queens, where the availability of the (E)(F)(M)(R) can offset the service reductions on either one of these lines individually.

 

the tough part is maintaining an appropriate level of service everywhere because otherwise, in some areas, the frequency cut would be above 50-60%, and blue-collar workers are still going to work. Believe it or not, the subway has been more crowded especially during the early/late shoulders of the rush hours, with about 35-40% of the pre-COVID ridership

I would say that's steadily increasing. I've been taking the train more often (I don't leave early enough for the Bx99 anymore), and I've been seeing a good increase in subway ridership around the system. It's not insanely crowded, but you'll still get no seaters here and there in the morning and afternoon rushes.

I'd say midday and off peak riders are gonna be the ones biting the bullet. I haven't been on any recently (I might on a day off next week), but I can say that rush hour should be the same or cut by a couple minutes.

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2 hours ago, Deucey said:

Problem with these service cutbacks is they're self-defeating - cut service on trains and make more people ride significantly fewer trains in Lex Av SRO conditions and you end up driving more ridership away.

If anything, the cutbacks should really be to realign service so buses don't duplicate subway routes and feed riders to them instead (like other Transit Systems do when they build rail lines).

Can someone do math on how much could be saved if (MTA) got rid of north-south buses along subway routes in the Bronx and Manhattan and Brooklyn?

Thing is, there's not too much of that in Brooklyn, and for those that exist, there's more to the equation than mere duplication. For example, the B44 has plenty of people using it north of Flatbush Avenue in spite of the subway's presence, which implies that the subway either does not meet a particular need in the first place or is an option of convenience that is undercut by not needing to cover too much more ground. While the B37 and B63 could theoretically be cut, part of the problem is that they serve to better address coverage than the subway, especially in places with slopes. In addition, 5th Avenue is the western boundary of Greenwood Cemetery, so it's not as if they can simply be shifted further east. (Maybe you could make that argument about the B25...)

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