MTA Bus Operations: Fleet & Depots

[LTA1992]

On 10/21/2021 at 10:23 PM, MHV184 said:

The community needs to change that rule because just like this current situation just imagine this happens again and the NGs are scrapped like what else are you giving Manhattanville

So they have to sacrifice cleaner air because of MTA operations? The MTA knows this exists and therefore should already plan for such a thing. To say the neighborhood should sacrifice clean air is ridiculous.

And the phrase "It's the MTA" ain't a defense.

 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

On 10/21/2021 at 10:23 PM, MHV184 said:

The community needs to change that rule because just like this current situation just imagine this happens again and the NGs are scrapped like what else are you giving Manhattanville

What a ridiculous thing to say. These communities historically have had high asthma rates, and thus the only way that the  could keep depots in these areas was by providing clean air buses and more eco-friendly depots. That's one reason why historically, you had depots that weren't built in residential areas (with some exceptions).

Edited November 1, 2021 by Via Garibaldi 8

[Gotham Bus Co.]

10 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

What a ridiculous thing to say. These communities historically have had high asthma rates, and thus the only way that the  could keep depots in these areas was by providing clean air buses and more eco-friendly depots. That's one reason why historically, you had depots that weren't built in residential areas (with some exceptions).

 

Yes, but crying "environmental racism" is disingenuous (at best) because the bus garage was there before minorities were. 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

2 minutes ago, Gotham Bus Co. said:

 

Yes, but crying "environmental racism" is disingenuous (at best) because the bus garage was there before minorities were. 

Regardless, allowing the same old same old to continue because the depot was there before doesn't mean that changes shouldn't be made. Furthermore, this isn't just a minority issue. Environmental concerns are in any residential area where there is a depot, such as Yukon Depot. Not only that, but there have been a number of  workers that have fallen ill. 

https://www.silive.com/westshore/2014/09/lawsuit_exhaust_fumes_at_yukon.html

https://www.aboutlawsuits.com/bus-depot-asbestos-162217/

 

[GojiMet86]

2 minutes ago, Gotham Bus Co. said:

Yes, but crying "environmental racism" is disingenuous (at best) because the bus garage was there before minorities were. 

 

Why does it matter if the bus garage came before? Does it have some indisputable right to exist? Last time I checked, health is pretty important. It's why we've been moving towards transit that emits less pollution than before.

[JAzumah]

On 10/29/2021 at 5:06 PM, SevenEleven said:

The SIM23 and 24 will be operated out of Charleston Depot next pick, subject to approval by the MTA Board. 

Some 3000s are being transferred to Charleston at the moment to make service and will be replaced when the option order of the Prevosts are delivered. 

Please start the services off with a 30 minute headway to begin with. Let the loads balance naturally between the avenues. 

The SIM8 is now a candidate for all day service. Hourly service to the Outerbridge Park & Ride off-peak via the SIM24 path for now. The SIM4C can run every 30 minutes and the SIM8 can now stop at Newark Airport.

[Gotham Bus Co.]

8 hours ago, GojiMet86 said:

Why does it matter if the bus garage came before? Does it have some indisputable right to exist? Last time I checked, health is pretty important. It's why we've been moving towards transit that emits less pollution than before.

 

It matters because the claim of "environmental racism" explicitly claims that bus garages were intentionally built in minority neighborhoods for the purpose of adversely impacting minority residents. Meanwhile, the historical fact is that minority residents moved into bus garage neighborhoods (in some cases because they worked in those bus garages).

[MHV9218]

3 hours ago, Gotham Bus Co. said:

It matters because the claim of "environmental racism" explicitly claims that bus garages were intentionally built in minority neighborhoods for the purpose of adversely impacting minority residents. Meanwhile, the historical fact is that minority residents moved into bus garage neighborhoods (in some cases because they worked in those bus garages).

Your point taken, that yes, it's inaccurate to act like the depot got built there out of spite after a major community was established. But, to be fair, it's not like everybody moving up to Harlem in the 1940s/50s did that entirely by choice. It was an extremely low-cost neighborhood for poor people (most of them black) to move, so many went. I'm sure plenty of people would have preferred to live on the Upper East Side, but whatwith the sheer property value and redlining, that wasn't really an option. And if you do look at some of the depots in more residential, wealthier neighborhoods (Hudson Depot or 54th Street Depot, for example), the TA has since shuttered/repurposed those garages and moved the vehicles out. It's not a total coincidence that the remaining bus depots in Manhattan are in neighborhoods with less political say and sway (exception Quill, which is in tunnel no man's land). I agree that it was complete BS when Clayton Guse tried this argument about RTSes at ENY (as if the M66/72 were running through impoverished neighborhoods), and you're right that the line gets thrown around in some silly ways, but in this case it's not completely out of left field. 

Edited November 2, 2021 by MHV9218

[Calvin]

One NovaBus LFS HEV is in-service at Manhattanville. They will slowly use a few units to see if they're functioning properly/well on the road (sort of like a 30-day test). 

Edited November 9, 2021 by Calvin

[MHV184]

Just now, Calvin said:

One NovaBus LFS HEV is in-service at Manhatanville. They will slowly use a few units to see if they're functioning properly/well on the road (sort of like a 30-day test). 

Actually that bus was 9745 and it broke down while doing the M2 earlier 

[LegoBrickBreaker101]

13 hours ago, Calvin said:

One NovaBus LFS HEV is in-service at Manhattanville. They will slowly use a few units to see if they're functioning properly/well on the road (sort of like a 30-day test). 

As of this morning, #9660 is back in service on the M100 along with #9745 which is out again today on the M96.

[Cait Sith]

 

There you have it folks, New Flyer strikes gold with the XE40 order.
A lot of folks were saying that Proterra was a shoe-in, but I had my doubts, especially with the brake test failure.

It is important to note here that these buses are largely federally funded.

Edited November 13, 2021 by Cait Sith

[MysteriousBtrain]

7 hours ago, Cait Sith said:

 

There you have it folks, New Flyer strikes gold with the XE40 order.
A lot of folks were saying that Proterra was a shoe-in, but I had my doubts, especially with the brake test failure.

It is important to note here that these buses are largely federally funded.

Which basically means these are NYCT's and are not allowed in MTA Bus in their lifetime

[Cait Sith]

3 hours ago, MysteriousBtrain said:

Which basically means these are NYCT's and are not allowed in MTA Bus in their lifetime

MTA Bus in general isn't getting any electrics for a long, looooong time lol.

[R32 3838]

5 minutes ago, Cait Sith said:

MTA Bus in general isn't getting any electrics for a long, looooong time lol.

Which I don't get, BP and Eastchester would benefit having electric buses (Bx23/Q112 and even the Q110) for 40 footers and the (Q111 farmers blvd) for 60 footers.

[Cait Sith]

1 hour ago, R32 3838 said:

Which I don't get, BP and Eastchester would benefit having electric buses (Bx23/Q112 and even the Q110) for 40 footers and the (Q111 farmers blvd) for 60 footers.

Eastchester would benefit far more than BP. You can easily have a full fleet of them there for local service.

MTA Bus still has pending orders on 40ft standards and 60ft artics.

[Lawrence St]

Dam, I was rooting for Proterra to win the order since they have the best battery range out of all of them.

[RSMG106]

3 hours ago, Lawrence St said:

Dam, I was rooting for Proterra to win the order since they have the best battery range out of all of them.

Agreed, especially the motor system. I've been on 0017 once in October, and it sounded beautiful.

[MHV9218]

8 hours ago, Lawrence St said:

Dam, I was rooting for Proterra to win the order since they have the best battery range out of all of them.

I wouldn't count them out for the future. They need to work out the QC issues that plagued them here and in Philly, but they just won a big old order out in LA (where range is less of an issue, anyway), and they have a pretty sizable market share that's going to allow them to grow and mature up ahead.

[FLX9304]

17 hours ago, Lawrence St said:

Dam, I was rooting for Proterra to win the order since they have the best battery range out of all of them.

Go ask SEPTA on why their 24 buses are still in storage….

[Bill from Maspeth]

20 hours ago, Lawrence St said:

Dam, I was rooting for Proterra to win the order since they have the best battery range out of all of them.

I think there's more to it than the battery range.  I rode 0020 a few months ago from end to end on the B57.  It was a great ride on a nice running bus, but if you track Grand Ave. routes, usually only 1 or 2 are in service at any one time M-F.  This hints that they are shop queens.  

[Cait Sith]

3 hours ago, FLX9304 said:

Go ask SEPTA on why their 24 buses are still in storage….

SEPTA's issues are build quality issues. The issues with ours were not that.

Two different scenarios.

[Around the Horn]

29 minutes ago, Cait Sith said:

SEPTA's issues are build quality issues. The issues with ours were not that.

Two different scenarios.

I do understand that but it is a cautionary tale for anyone buying electric buses because the build quality issues stem from Proterra attempting to increase battery range by installing larger batteries on the same chassis. I doubt that they're the only manufacturer doing this. There needs to be additional scrutiny of any electric bus with an "extended range" to ensure that this doesn't happen again. I just don't trust New Flyer, Proterra or the MTA to do that based on their track record.

[Cait Sith]

1 hour ago, Around the Horn said:

I do understand that but it is a cautionary tale for anyone buying electric buses because the build quality issues stem from Proterra attempting to increase battery range by installing larger batteries on the same chassis. I doubt that they're the only manufacturer doing this. There needs to be additional scrutiny of any electric bus with an "extended range" to ensure that this doesn't happen again. I just don't trust New Flyer, Proterra or the MTA to do that based on their track record.

Considering that the FTA will be involved with the XE40 order, they'll probably be good in quality overall. They were involved in the order of the 5300-5400 series XD60s and those are better than the rest of the XD60s.

We're also getting five pilot buses. The MTA is being pretty cautious with this order especially with the term of the contract. Me personally, I think NF has a grip on what they are doing. It's just a matter of what the transit agency wants and how fast they want them to get to the property. Agencies need to let the manufacturers do their thing instead of rushing them, which was largely SEPTA's case.

Nova is also making more of an appearance as well. Other than Milwaukee, they now have a small, but interesting contract with SFMTA. They've entered their electric bus testing program.

[danielhg121]

It just occurred to me that MTA Bus Company has no Novabus anywhere. I guess a large part of that is due to the funding? They have Prevosts which are part of the Volvo group but not a single Novabus. Why was the FTA involved with the 5300-5400 series XD60's anyways? Was it because it was the spark of a new generation (Cuomo wrap, outlets, wifi, etc.). I guess these amenities have become a bit more common on public transit in other areas too.